I'm more excited about Randy Gregory than Taco Charlton

[CATCH17]

Well of course.


Taco is a good solid talent. A better then average guy.

Gregory is a real talent.

 

[Verdict]

He doesn't need to start in year 2 to justify anything.
He is in a pipeline that has produced DLaw, Crawford and others before him.
DLaw had 9 sacks and 16 starts after 3 years.
He just needs to continue to improve and play. His job is to be good enough that they can move on from Crawford or DLaw in a year.
DAL may have the best DE depth in the NFL.
Gregory is very unlikely to ever start here. He's a situational rush guy but can have good value as an R2.

It's a matter of perception. I personally think that Taco has to legitimately seize one of the two DE starting spots from the start of this season or he was too much of a project to be drafted in the first round.

We burned a 2nd and a 3rd on Lawrence and our rate of return on him so far has been one good year. Now we have to pay him big bucks.

You can pay a proven guy big bucks without wasting a draft pick on him.

You and I are using a different yardstick to measure a player. You use yours and I'll use mine.

 

[jterrell]

It's a matter of perception. I personally think that Taco has to legitimately seize one of the two DE starting spots from the start of this season or he was too much of a project to be drafted in the first round.

We burned a 2nd and a 3rd on Lawrence and our rate of return on him so far has been one good year. Now we have to pay him big bucks.

You can pay a proven guy big bucks without wasting a draft pick on him.

You and I are using a different yardstick to measure a player. You use yours and I'll use mine.

What we use to measure them makes exactly zero difference.
The team drafted Taco as a future starter, not a day 1 starter. That was very clear.
And if he replaces a guy that is making a fortune that's a win for the front office.

Once a guy makes All Pro no one really cares what he did his first couple years in the league.
When we drafted Taco I said the guy he reminded me of was Michael Strahan and people of course freaked out and equated that to breaking all-time records....
When in reality Strahan and Taco were both raw, athletic 1 move, large body DEs coming out.
It took Stahan 5 years to reach Pro Bowl level and he had very modest sack production through 4 years.
Then he took off.

Taco is going to get better and better. He wasn't a finished product but if he was he woulda been gone top 3.
He fell because he needed time.
2-3 years is not asking too much for him to start and produce quality numbers versus both run and pass.
To Dallas' credit they didn't just hand him a starting gig and let him collect 4 sacks a year as a starter.
He is working his tail off to earn time.
And he was significantly better late than he was early.
He was better versus starting NFL OTs in weeks 13-16 than he was 3rd strong OTs in pre-season games.

Anyone down on Taco will look foolish sooner rather than later imho.

 

[PUSHfold]

Not saying much, Taco is a wasted pick.

You were probably saying the same thing about D-Law one year into his career, DE's take time to develop in the NFL. How many times do people have to say this? Do they always work out and end up being good starters? No, but with how difficult it is to find them it's worth spending the resources on these types of players.

 

[Verdict]

What we use to measure them makes exactly zero difference.
The team drafted Taco as a future starter, not a day 1 starter. That was very clear.
And if he replaces a guy that is making a fortune that's a win for the front office.

Once a guy makes All Pro no one really cares what he did his first couple years in the league.
When we drafted Taco I said the guy he reminded me of was Michael Strahan and people of course freaked out and equated that to breaking all-time records....
When in reality Strahan and Taco were both raw, athletic 1 move, large body DEs coming out.
It took Stahan 5 years to reach Pro Bowl level and he had very modest sack production through 4 years.
Then he took off.

Taco is going to get better and better. He wasn't a finished product but if he was he woulda been gone top 3.
He fell because he needed time.
2-3 years is not asking too much for him to start and produce quality numbers versus both run and pass.
To Dallas' credit they didn't just hand him a starting gig and let him collect 4 sacks a year as a starter.
He is working his tail off to earn time.
And he was significantly better late than he was early.
He was better versus starting NFL OTs in weeks 13-16 than he was 3rd strong OTs in pre-season games.

Anyone down on Taco will look foolish sooner rather than later imho.

It is of almost no value cap wise for Taco to have the same performance curve that Lawrence did. The team didn't burn a first round pick on Taco with the idea that he would be a player 4 years from his draft date.

Players like that are drafted in the 6th like Rico. That's the argument you are getting behind.

Taco wasn't much of a player so he has pissed off one year of his contract. That's fine if he turns into a stud this year. It's not ok, at least from my point of view, for him to not significantly improve over last year.

Sack numbers are overrated to some degree but he was a non factor last year. We need to see much more quality play out of Taco this year,

 

[Verdict]

You were probably saying the same thing about D-Law one year into his career, DE's take time to develop in the NFL. How many times do people have to say this?

In fairness it was largely a wasted pick until last year. Without last year Lawrence may not still be on the team.

 

[Verdict]

You could trade a 2nd round pick to many teams to acquire the rights to a guy like Chandler Jones and pay him mega bucks, with no ramp up performance delay.

That's cheaper than using a 2nd and a 3rd on a guy and him not performing until his contract year. Plus you eliminate most of the bust factor.

If you are going to draft a player high they need to perform at a high level reasonably early in his contract. At least that's my point of view. It's an overdraft if the player doesn't do that.

 

[jterrell]

It is of almost no value cap wise for Taco to have the same performance curve that Lawrence did. The team didn't burn a first round pick on Taco with the idea that he would be a player 4 years from his draft date.

Players like that are drafted in the 6th like Rico. That's the argument you are getting behind.

Taco wasn't much of a player so he has pissed off one year of his contract. That's fine if he turns into a stud this year. It's not ok, at least from my point of view, for him to not significantly improve over last year.

Sack numbers are overrated to some degree but he was a non factor last year. We need to see much more quality play out of Taco this year,

Keep in mind if he follows DLaw's arc he plays year 4 and gets 14.5 sacks.
Then in year 5 we pay him 10M not Franchise money.
All because he was drafted a whole 6 spots earlier.

 

[links18]

Taco was a first round pick. He needs to justify his draft position.

He just needs to play decent and become a solid contributor. His draft position is the braintrust's issue.

 

[Verdict]

Keep in mind if he follows DLaw's arc he plays year 4 and gets 14.5 sacks.
Then in year 5 we pay him 10M not Franchise money.
All because he was drafted a whole 6 spots earlier.

That's one positive. That's still way too late to contribute for his draft slot.

 

[waldoputty]

Does Gregory outperforming Taco after such a long absence show how good Gregory is or how bad Taco is?

absence was not that long.
he played at the end of 2016 season.

 

[CouchCoach]

I think Gregory will have more sacks than Taco despite not playing football for the last 2 seasons.

Gregory was a better player on a worse D at NE than Charleton was on a good D at MI. It would be nice for both of them to show up and let Lawrence and his fat salary walk but I am not counting on that.

 

[darthseinfeld]

It is of almost no value cap wise for Taco to have the same performance curve that Lawrence did. The team didn't burn a first round pick on Taco with the idea that he would be a player 4 years from his draft date.

Players like that are drafted in the 6th like Rico. That's the argument you are getting behind.

Taco wasn't much of a player so he has pissed off one year of his contract. That's fine if he turns into a stud this year. It's not ok, at least from my point of view, for him to not significantly improve over last year.

Sack numbers are overrated to some degree but he was a non factor last year. We need to see much more quality play out of Taco this year,

People act like Lawrence was a 1 year wonder. He had 8 sacks his second season. He probably would have been a 10 sack guy in 2016 if it weren't for suspension and injuries. People that think he just came on last year havent been paying attention

 

[Corso]

My humble thoughts: I think both players need one more season.

 

[dagreat1_87]

absence was not that long.
he played at the end of 2016 season.

Not that long? Guy has played 14 games in 3 years. And 2 in the past two years. That's a long enough absence. Taco has more game experience in one year.

 

[Number1]

I think Gregory will have more sacks than Taco despite not playing football for the last 2 seasons.

that'll be dictated by snaps and snaps by JJ and the coaches, either or both playing well is a media bonanza for JJ, so ... it comes back to the coaches

I'd point out much of the focus is Randy and Taco.
Randy is in the speed rusher category with Tapper, so is Armstrong.
Taco will battle Crawford and Ealy for snaps, Tapper is in this argument also,

Lawrence, Crawford, and Charlton are in. Leaving Gregory, Tapper, Ealy, and Armstrong - one of them makes the game day roster, IMO Gregory, Tapper or Ealy the 53 man or traded, Armstrong the PS.

injuries will play a factor - still we should have 4 really good DEs on the field most or all of the season

 

[big dog cowboy]

Not saying much, Taco is a wasted pick.

Of course he is.

 

[northerncowboynation]

I think Gregory will have more sacks than Taco despite not playing football for the last 2 seasons.

Yeah the potential was always there for Gregory but hard to reach that potential when not playing. I don't know what to expect from Grego TBH. I expect it will take some time but by game 6 or 7 he should be in total game shape as far as recognition and reaction. There are many interesting sub-plots this tear, Gregory is one of them

 

[northerncowboynation]

Safe prediction, Gregory will have more sacks than Tapper

 

[Verdict]

People act like Lawrence was a 1 year wonder. He had 8 sacks his second season. He probably would have been a 10 sack guy in 2016 if it weren't for suspension and injuries. People that think he just came on last year havent been paying attention

You can ignore his suspension if you want but it's a fact it did happen. So did the injuries. So did his really good last season. It all factors in.

Before last year's breakout season many wondered if he would get a second contract. We are still wondering for different reasons. He was for most intents and purposes a one year wonder.