CFZ Is it hope or is it fact?

[Chasing6]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

The fact is we have some hope.

 

[TequilaCowboy]

Again, hope is a good thing as a fan. Hope however is not a viable front office strategy.

Thus why i have been crapping on this FO since forever.... not being a hater, just from what i seen. Thinking Zeke is the answer to your running game is pure insanity.. Credit them at least i guess to trying to upgrade the OL and not depending on Ball, Waltetzko, Biadasz etc to improve. The OL, aside of Zack, is young and MAY get better with reps. But expecting them to gel all this year and become ALL Pros is a bit premature. This year is a learning year not just for the OL, but the defense as well.

 

[Ring6]

2024 Steele should be better in theory than 2023 Steele, so the RT is an upgrade

 

[rambo2]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

I like that they traded back and got Guyton and Beebe and all of their 1st four picks seem to be intelligent. It has a chance of being an excellent draft and the Cowboys could stay on top of the East and build from there. A good chance of getting some improvement on the offensive line and it looks like all of them will be healthy at the start.

 

[zrinkill]

I love that I pre-neutered their responses.

 

[plymkr]

I dont think it’s very realistic to think the OL will be better this year.

This. I feel it’s hope to think we’ll be as good on the offensive line in 2024. I think it’s a fact our offensive line will be better in 2025.

So to be more specific. The offensive line of Tyron, Smith, BDZ, Martin and Steele would be better in 2024 than what we’ll have.

By the time 2025 comes around and Guyton and Beebe develop it will be a better offensive line than Tyron, Tyler, BDZ, Martin and Steele in 2025 due to age and injuries.

 

[starfan1]

It’s hope but I can’t see the run blocking being much worse

 

[Brax]

Again, hope is a good thing as a fan. Hope however is not a viable front office strategy.

Bob did you miss rookies already getting fitted for gold jackets before they even played a game. It’s funny 2 new OL starters whose total experience at playing the position they will this year is 1 game. Funny reading threads on how much better they will be, all this without seeing 1 play yet. Can’t wait for the bashing after a bad play or two

 

[GroundZero1970]

This oline could shape up to being very,very good.

 

[GroundZero1970]

I will eat crow. I was upset over the draft but man this oline could be good, I still think we shoulda got a RB but overall I think we did pretty well in the draft. There crow eaten I took my medicine

 

[kskboys]

A lot lot of people ask me why an Eagles fan would come to this board. Some of them don’t really care about the answer, they would just rather see the backside of me lol, but the real reason is I enjoy football conversation and general debate. I have visited many boards over the years (decades now, really), and I usually find a few outstanding posters who I really appreciate and respect. I don’t decide whether or not to respect someone because of which team they root for (I understand some fans feel that’s the way it should be, especially with rivalries, but I find that is nothing more than false bravado). I look more for the critical thinking of posters.

I always stop to read your posts. They are always well thought out. This one, especially. This one is the theme of every off-season…and for just about every team. Not all, but most. I remember last off-season when the Eagles lost a lot of key players, and a lot of our fan base (myself included for the most part) felt that they would just easily overcome that. A lot of those key losses were on defense… not just players, but the defensive coordinator as well. It’s very easy to grasp on to hope. The NFL media machine has made it very easy to do that. But to answer your question, it is definitely way more hope than it is fact.

Very well done, and I agree. I respect any fan who is loyal to their team.

 

[kskboys]

A lot lot of people ask me why an Eagles fan would come to this board. Some of them don’t really care about the answer, they would just rather see the backside of me lol, but the real reason is I enjoy football conversation and general debate. I have visited many boards over the years (decades now, really), and I usually find a few outstanding posters who I really appreciate and respect. I don’t decide whether or not to respect someone because of which team they root for (I understand some fans feel that’s the way it should be, especially with rivalries, but I find that is nothing more than false bravado). I look more for the critical thinking of posters.

I always stop to read your posts. They are always well thought out. This one, especially. This one is the theme of every off-season…and for just about every team. Not all, but most. I remember last off-season when the Eagles lost a lot of key players, and a lot of our fan base (myself included for the most part) felt that they would just easily overcome that. A lot of those key losses were on defense… not just players, but the defensive coordinator as well. It’s very easy to grasp on to hope. The NFL media machine has made it very easy to do that. But to answer your question, it is definitely way more hope than it is fact.

Oh, and we know why you're REALLY here. You're crushin' on Pappy and Coogles!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[JoeKing]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

Bob, you're calling it more hope than fact because you don't know these new players yet. You can't possibly believe your comfort with these players matters that much. Maybe for you, it does but it doesn't affect the facts. This offensive line in 2024, will be better. Fact.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Bob, you're calling it more hope than fact because you don't know these new players yet. You can't possibly believe your comfort with these players matters that much. Maybe for you, it does but it doesn't affect the facts. This offensive line in 2024, will be better. Fact.

We can't even say for sure who the starting 5 on the Oline will be. I'm hopeful its a step forward this year, but to say thats already fact just seems foolish. What happens if Tyler Smith pulls a hammy in camp and starts the year on the PUP? Way too many variables to say this unit will for a fact be stronger in 2024.

 

[Chasing6]

We can't even say for sure who the starting 5 on the Oline will be. I'm hopeful its a step forward this year, but to say thats already fact just seems foolish. What happens if Tyler Smith pulls a hammy in camp and starts the year on the PUP? Way too many variables to say this unit will for a fact be stronger in 2024.

You could make that same argument with every team in the NFL.

 

[rambo2]

I will eat crow. I was upset over the draft but man this oline could be good, I still think we shoulda got a RB but overall I think we did pretty well in the draft. There crow eaten I took my medicine

It can be very good. I like their depth going forward. Looking forward to the preseason to see how they look at oline and linebacker and Trey Lance at qb.

 

[thunderpimp91]

You could make that same argument with every team in the NFL.

For sure, it's why everything about the upcoming season is hope while the calendar still reads May.

I see reasons to be optimistic about this oline for sure, but we have rookies yet to take a snap, 4 months to avoid the injury bug, who knows if someone on offense tries to hold out ala Zach Martin last year, etc.

I struggle to see the viewpoint of the 'fact' crowd.

 

[john van brocklin]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

All we got is hope , Bob.

 

[GMO415]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

BULLET, hope is not a plan and you never said it was. I just can't see a rookie coming in to replace our HOF LT and expect the play to excel. With the OL in question, Dak will truly run a WCO, and will be targeting his TEs like crazy.

I'll definitely draft a Dallas TE in my FFL.

 

[JoeKing]

We can't even say for sure who the starting 5 on the Oline will be. I'm hopeful its a step forward this year, but to say thats already fact just seems foolish. What happens if Tyler Smith pulls a hammy in camp and starts the year on the PUP? Way too many variables to say this unit will for a fact be stronger in 2024.

We have a damn good idea it will be Steele, Martin, Beebe, Smith and Guyton. Pretending this isn't the case is what is foolish. Stop playing childish games.