Is the reason we won't sign another OG because...

[Risen Star]

I understand the criticism. Our decision makers deserve no benefit of the doubt.

But color me a homer. I'm looking at the bright side of this. If Arkin is just really impressing the staff and does start this year, that's a good thing. Add that to what we expect Tyron to do and the offensive line suddenly has three nice young pieces in place for the future. With Murray expected to be the zang to Felix's zing, Harris working some in the slot and returning kicks and Josh Thomas seeing time in the dime defenses, you could be looking at the most productive draft class we've had here since 2005.

This can be a really good thing. A great thing. Keep that in mind while you're tearing up your season tickets.

 

[skinsscalper]

You were doing so well, then dove overboard.

Peterman was released due to injuries, not a vet. And Kosier is light years ahead of Peterman.

Another devotee to the myth/shrine of Amendola. He wasn't cut for another vet, he was released due to Isaiah Stanback, another young player. Plus, he was so well sought after that he cleared waivers, and spent the entire year on the practice squad.

Fujita? A journeyman LB who happened to be with NO when they won the SB, and thereafter released? And who was replaced by 1st round pick Bobby Carpenter - a younger player?

Remi Ayodele - backup to Jay Ratliff at nose tackle. Are you really going to argue that releasing Ratliff in favor of Ayodele is a good thing.

Look, you have your opinion regarding young players and vets. Gotcha. But it doesn't mean you can make up facts to justify you opinion.

I stand corrected. However, the approach to who is given a legitimate shot at playing is still skewed towards draft position or experience rather than actual ability to play the game.

Peterman: I honestly didn't remember why he had been released. I vaguely remember a knee problem maybe, yes?. I also remember that Marco Rivera was signed that year, also correct? Was Peterman rushed out the door rather than rehabbed due to Rivera's signing? I honestly don't know.

Amendola: O.K. he was sent to the practice squad in favor of Stanback despite the fact that Amendola was actually making plays and Stanback was constantly at the trainers table. They chose a pet cat over a guy that was actually making plays and eventually lost him as a result.

Fujita: O.K. you make room for a 1st round pick. Hard to argue that approach. Ultimately Carpenter went on to become one of the biggest 1st round busts in team history. Meanwhile Fujita, while never setting the world on fire, went on to become what many of us wished that Carpenter would have atleast salvaged out of his career. A decent football player.

Ayodele: Who says you have to cut Ratliff to keep Ayodele? In fact, right now, Ayodele is exactly what this team needs. Quality D-line depth.

Acually, I appreciate you setting the record straight concerning these players. Unfortunately it's highlighted yet another disturbing trend regarding the talent evaluation at Valley Ranch. The end result is the same. Far too often we have to bite the FA bullet to try and fix the shortcomings in player evaluation and development.

Thanks again for the history lesson.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

Or you could cry about the fact that your even playing before you grab the gun. Sure, you can walk away from the table and go back to what was killing you to begin with, but I'll go ahead take the gamble. The FA rout has nothing short of terminal cancer for this team. I'll take the revolver, thanks.

Let the forecast of a crumbling sky keep you rooted to the couch. I could care less. All I know, is I'm ready for a different approach. The FA approach has done little to better our situation along the line. I'm sick of it and obviously the powers that be are, also. Things are being done differently, now. Considering our lack of success via the FA route that you've been touting it's obviously time to try something new. If you're content to continue with something that hasn't worked for us, then power to you. Just don't be surprised if you have a parade of pom poms following you down the street.

Every year teams start rookies that aren't necessarily desperate or rebuilding. If that's what the situation dictates, then so be it.

Don't like Jerry the GM never even try to hide it. That said I agree with what you said. You can only bang your head on the wall so long. Now the FA way did seem to work for a very short time. I do think with a HC in place that Jerry really believes will be here for a very long time he's turned around and is willing to build than buy. I don't see a SB this year (would love to be wrong) but I see a consistently competitive team from here on out. That mixed with a little luck that you have to have could be the recipe in a year or two.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I'll take Peterman and his better (with his contract) than worse in Bigg (and his contract) all day long. Better is better, regardless of the margin. Take the contracts into the equation and Peterman is light years ahead better for this team, right now than Bigg was/would be.

That's the one right there.

Many fans do not figure in the contract when evaluating players.

As you said, Peterman all day long over Bigg.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Jimmy J was good about giving rookies an honest shot... Parcells & Wade? Not so much.

 

[DeaconBlues]

That's the one right there.

Many fans do not figure in the contract when evaluating players.

As you said, Peterman all day long over Bigg.

Peterman on his best day did not compare to Bigg on his worst day prior to 2010. You want to compare last year, fine, no argument. But Peterman couldn't carry Bigg's jock through 2009.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Peterman on his best day did not compare to Bigg on his worst day prior to 2010. You want to compare last year, fine, no argument. But Peterman couldn't carry Bigg's jock through 2009.

That's a good point, but I think most of this conversation was based on the 2010 season where Bigg wasn't so good and Peterman was OK.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Great post.

The Cowboys have to build from within.

Trying to use free agency to solve each and every problem with this club is a sure trip to salary cap hell.

What you need are good, young cheap players. If you have to rebuild your club using expensive veterans, then you're not building for the future.

Then when their stock is at it's highest and it's time to pay them trade away the expendable ones for more picks. Patriots are a great example of how to do that and contend. But then they didn't win a playoff game in three years and went out and got two guys that go against everything they believe in. So even the great organizations are fickle, but you're right a team full of young guys with some quality vets at the right spots seems to be the recipe for success in this salary cap era.

 

[DeaconBlues]

That's a good point, but I think most of this conversation was based on the 2010 season where Bigg wasn't so good and Peterman was OK.

Oh, I understand that, but you can't separate the entire contract from the last year. Having Peterman in 2010 means having him 2007 - 2009.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Then when their stock is at it's highest and it's time to pay them trade away the expendable ones for more picks. Patriots are a great example of how to do that and contend. But then they didn't win a playoff game in three years and went out and got two guys that go against everything they believe in. So even the great organizations are fickle, but you're right a team full of young guys with some quality vets at the right spots seems to be the recipe for success in this salary cap era.

You're right.

The Pat's seem to be stumbling a little a bit and are grasping at straws.

It'll be interesting to see if their moves pay off or lead the team more so into the direction of mediocrity.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Oh, I understand that, but you can't separate the entire contract from the last year. Having Peterman in 2010 means having him 2007 - 2009.

Well maybe, I think the choice of Peterman was more to serve as an example of "An average player who's cheap is better an average player who's expensive".

 

[skinsscalper]

Peterman on his best day did not compare to Bigg on his worst day prior to 2010. You want to compare last year, fine, no argument. But Peterman couldn't carry Bigg's jock through 2009.

I agree 100% but, honestly though M'K, he didn't really need to. All we've truly needed on this line is serviceable. How many O-linemen from the Packers made the Pro Bowl this year? How about the Steelers? Jamal Brown made it as a reserve in the 2009 Pro Bowl representing the Saints and the Colts had no one. 2008? Faneca represented Pittsburgh. Super Bow teams are littered with the Average Joe Stephen Petermans of the world. Now, if we can just find a way to unearth them and get them contributing to our team.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I agree 100% but, honestly though M'K, he didn't really need to. All we've truly needed on this line is serviceable. How many O-linemen from the Packers made the Pro Bowl this year? How about the Steelers? Jamal Brown made it as a reserve in the 2009 Pro Bowl representing the Saints and the Colts had no one. 2008? Faneca represented Pittsburgh. Super Bow teams are littered with the Average Joe Stephen Petermans of the world. Now, if we can just find a way to unearth them and get them contributing to our team.

I think of those Bronco lines in the late 90's... They were the epitome of "5 average lineman working in concert can mean good things."

 

[skinsscalper]

Oh, I understand that, but you can't separate the entire contract from the last year. Having Peterman in 2010 means having him 2007 - 2009.

And there's the rub. However, I like the idea of Bigg and Peterson a whole lot better than say Bigg and Bright, depth wise. Which goes back to my original line of thought that we are sorely lacking in player development (especially along the O-line).

 

[Mr Cowboy]

Rebuilding your team through the draft is the preferable way of doing it, but you need to draft well. When you spend 12 draft picks, in one draft, on special teams, and have nothing to show for it two years later, well, you have to back fill through FA.

Bigg, Rivera, Flozell, Kozier, and Holland, are the results of poor drafting and developing players in the OL. If Rogers, Marten, Johnson, Brewster and all the others would have panned out, Jerry would have saved lots of money. But that has not happened. Perhaps if Tyron and Arkin turn out, then its a good step in the right direction.

I think that Garrett wants a different type of OL, one that is lighter, quicker and more athletic. Of course Holland doesn't fit the prototype, but perhaps they are trying to get Arken up to speed faster.

 

[mmillman]

the offensive line? Holland, as everyone knows, is suspect. Behind him there is no depth. There is also no depth at Tackle or Center. It looks like a potential disaster to me.

 

[calico]

the offensive line? Holland, as everyone knows, is suspect. Behind him there is no depth. There is also no depth at Tackle or Center. It looks like a potential disaster to me.

isn't there a huge thread about this already?

 

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

He just doesn't wanna spend any more money.