Jerry, Landry, Jason

[buybuydandavis]

the cowboys are not any closer to winning super bowl now than they were when garrett started this team

Farther. We had a very good team in 2007.

 

[Diehardblues]

I would compare him to Jimmy Johnson if I actually believed Jimmy and Garrett were in comparable situations.

Jimmy had personnel control in his contract. He built that team. He was the voice of it.

Right ..

The true comparisons for Garrett are in the post Jimmy era or what I call the puppet era.

And after the team Jimmy built faded we saw what Jerry was all about. Shoot, with Switzer they even screwed that up losing at least one or two more championships that team could have won.

Jimmy would have won at least 4 or 5 with that roster. No doubt in my mind.

So, if Jerry can screw up the greatest team in Cowboys history why again do we expect him to build another one?

 

[Risen Star]

Farther. We had a very good team in 2007.

Garrett took over in 2010.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Garrett took over in 2010.

" than they were when garrett started this team"

Garrett started in 2007.

 

[Diehardblues]

Farther. We had a very good team in 2007.

2011 is when Garrett officially took over as HC. You can throw in part of 2010 if you like.

We don’t normally give credit to HC’s when they aren’t HC. Or is that when we’re going to start evaluating everyone. Does that mean we should credit Linehan now? Just saying...

 

[mahoneybill]

The biggest difference with Landry is 4 years after they were an expansion team, the Cowboys showed steady, deliberate improvement for the years following that.

Landry was the forerunner of Belicheck in terms of when he had his team in place it was a given they were going to be in playoffs. The only question was " can they win the big one"

Belicheck has taken this to the next level , and won several , especially impressive with the restriction of salary cap/ rules etc.

With that said I'll root for Andy Reid to win his first one..... and the Chiefs after a very long drought to claim the title again...

 

[JustChip]

Not sticking up for Jason or Jerry at all here. But.

Back in the 60's you only had to win one game to be the NFL or AFL champion.
Hardly a comparison to todays NFL.

Up until the mid 90's, you could build a team and keep your players. You knew you had a good player for their career.
Now a team is lucky to keep a core group together for 3 to 4 years..

That should not be an excuse for not having advanced further. But it does need to be taken into account.
The one exception on this is the Patriots, but then again they have the QB and the coach and the owner. Which is rare now days, very rare.
Jerry had the coach in Jimmy, but his ego screwed that up. Or they could have been successful for 10 years or more.

 

[JustChip]

Coaching absolutely matters, but if it's purely about coaching, why have Billick, Cowher, Gruden, Dungy and McCarthy only sniffed a single Super Bowl appearance? And the same can be said for Peyton, although he has a reasonable chance to make another appearance this year. You have to have talent first, coaching second, and fortune/breaks lastly. Like it or not, there is a significant amount of fortune that has to befall a team to win or play in a Super Bowl.

 

[buybuydandavis]

2011 is when Garrett officially took over as HC. You can throw in part of 2010 if you like.

We don’t normally give credit to HC’s when they aren’t HC. Or is that when we’re going to start evaluating everyone. Does that mean we should credit Linehan now? Just saying...

" than they were when garrett started this team"

Garrett started in 2007.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

Landry was the forerunner of Belicheck in terms of when he had his team in place it was a given they were going to be in playoffs. The only question was " can they win the big one"

Belicheck has taken this to the next level , and won several , especially impressive with the restriction of salary cap/ rules etc.

With that said I'll root for Andy Reid to win his first one..... and the Chiefs after a very long drought to claim the title again...

That's who I'm rooting for.

 

[rags747]

Compare him to Jimmy Johnson then. Garrett is no Jimmy Johnson. Case in point, Jimmy got the hell out of Dallas the second Jerry started causing trouble.

Jerry fired his lame azz

 

[john van brocklin]

As we now know, Jerry made the comparison/analogy that it took years for Landry to win a Super Bowl hence, we can't be quick to judge Garrett. Fisher backed Jerry here saying that you don't know who is a SB caliber coach until they actually win one. I think that's such lazy and flawed thinking because if you actually look at the vast history of Super Bowl winning coaches, almost every one had experienced way more success in their first 8 years than Garrett has.

Here what all the SB winning coaches had accomplished by Year 8 with a team:

- Vince Lombardi - Won 3 NFL Championships, 1 Super Bowl win

- Weeb Ewbank - Won 2 NFL Championships (Baltimore), 1 Super Bowl win (Jets)

- Hank Stram - 2 AFL Championships, 1 Super Bowl appearance

- Don McCafferty - 1 Super Bowl, 1 AFC Championship, 2 total AFC Championship game appearances

- Don Shula - 2 Super Bowls, 3 total SB appearances (Miami), 1 NFL Championship, 2 NFL Champ appearances (Baltimore)

- Chuck Noll - 4 AFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- John Madden - AFC Championship game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Tom Flores - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Bill Walsh - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 SB wins

- Joe Gibbs - 4 NFC Champ game appearances, 3 Super Bowl appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- Mike Ditka - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Bill Parcells - 2 Super Bowl wins

- George Seifert - 5 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- Jimmy Johnson - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Barry Switzer - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike Holmgren - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike Shanahan - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Dick Vermeil - 1 Super Bowl appearance (Philly), 1 Super Bowl win (Rams)

- Brian Billick - 1 Super Bowl win

- Bill Belichick - 5 AFC Champ game appearances, 4 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Super Bowl wins

- John Gruden - 1 AFC Champ game appearance (Oakland), 1 Super Bowl win (TB)

- Bill Cowher - 3 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl appearance

- Tony Dungy - 1 NFC Champ appearance (TB), 2 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win (Indy)

- Tom Coughlin - 2 AFC Champ game appearances (Jax), 2 Super Bowl wins (NYG)

- Mike Tomlin - 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Sean Payton - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike McCarthy - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- John Harbaugh - 3 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Pete Carroll - 2 SB appearances, 1 Super Bowl win (SEA)

- Doug Pederson - 1 Super Bowl win

That leaves 2 SB winning coaches - Landry and Kubiak - not on this list.

Kubiak did zero in Houston and was gone after 8 seasons there. He won a SB after his first year in Denver.

Landry, yes, took awhile but he also took over a brand new franchise and had to build it from scratch. But even then, in the history of the SB, you can only really make the case that 2 took a long time to win a SB and did so after exhibiting limited success early in their careers.

Every single SB winning coach other than Kubiak and Landry had at least coached in a SB by Year 8.

So essentially, Jerry is claiming that the anomalies are the model he's basing his decisions on.

Wow great breakdown, thanks

 

[GenoT]

As long as Jerry is GM and Garrett is HC, we won’t win a SB.

Too much mediocrity to overcome.

 

[fredp22]

My spin on the Bentsen to Quayle quote:

"Jerry, I grew up watching Tom Landry. I learned a lot from Tom Landry. Tom Landry was an idol of mine. Jerry, your coach is no Tom Landry"

 

[eromeopolk]

As we now know, Jerry made the comparison/analogy that it took years for Landry to win a Super Bowl hence, we can't be quick to judge Garrett. Fisher backed Jerry here saying that you don't know who is a SB caliber coach until they actually win one. I think that's such lazy and flawed thinking because if you actually look at the vast history of Super Bowl winning coaches, almost every one had experienced way more success in their first 8 years than Garrett has.

Here what all the SB winning coaches had accomplished by Year 8 with a team:

- Vince Lombardi - Won 3 NFL Championships, 1 Super Bowl win

- Weeb Ewbank - Won 2 NFL Championships (Baltimore), 1 Super Bowl win (Jets)

- Hank Stram - 2 AFL Championships, 1 Super Bowl appearance

- Don McCafferty - 1 Super Bowl, 1 AFC Championship, 2 total AFC Championship game appearances

- Don Shula - 2 Super Bowls, 3 total SB appearances (Miami), 1 NFL Championship, 2 NFL Champ appearances (Baltimore)

- Chuck Noll - 4 AFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- John Madden - AFC Championship game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Tom Flores - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Bill Walsh - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 SB wins

- Joe Gibbs - 4 NFC Champ game appearances, 3 Super Bowl appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- Mike Ditka - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Bill Parcells - 2 Super Bowl wins

- George Seifert - 5 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl wins

- Jimmy Johnson - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Barry Switzer - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike Holmgren - 3 NFC Champ game appearances, 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike Shanahan - 2 Super Bowl wins

- Dick Vermeil - 1 Super Bowl appearance (Philly), 1 Super Bowl win (Rams)

- Brian Billick - 1 Super Bowl win

- Bill Belichick - 5 AFC Champ game appearances, 4 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Super Bowl wins

- John Gruden - 1 AFC Champ game appearance (Oakland), 1 Super Bowl win (TB)

- Bill Cowher - 3 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl appearance

- Tony Dungy - 1 NFC Champ appearance (TB), 2 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win (Indy)

- Tom Coughlin - 2 AFC Champ game appearances (Jax), 2 Super Bowl wins (NYG)

- Mike Tomlin - 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Sean Payton - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Mike McCarthy - 2 NFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- John Harbaugh - 3 AFC Champ game appearances, 1 Super Bowl win

- Pete Carroll - 2 SB appearances, 1 Super Bowl win (SEA)

- Doug Pederson - 1 Super Bowl win

That leaves 2 SB winning coaches - Landry and Kubiak - not on this list.

Kubiak did zero in Houston and was gone after 8 seasons there. He won a SB after his first year in Denver.

Landry, yes, took awhile but he also took over a brand new franchise and had to build it from scratch. But even then, in the history of the SB, you can only really make the case that 2 took a long time to win a SB and did so after exhibiting limited success early in their careers.

Every single SB winning coach other than Kubiak and Landry had at least coached in a SB by Year 8.

So essentially, Jerry is claiming that the anomalies are the model he's basing his decisions on.

I have 2 words for you.....EXPANSION TEAM

 

[links18]

Jerry fired his lame azz

His lame back to back Super Bowl winning azz.

 

[rags747]

His lame back to back Super Bowl winning azz.

Yep very true, dude was on edge though and barely keeping it together. Jerry would have really had to have bought into the “Toxic Masculinity” male of today for that to have continued working. Two Alpha Males, not hard to follow why it eventually failed.