Jerry's biggest folly

[Rampage]

No he just retired in shame after 4 years because he could not repeat the success he had with the Cowboys without the people who helped him reach that success.

If Jimmy had stayed with the Cowboys ..... I believe we would have stayed dominate for a few more years ..... would then Lacewell and Jerry be considered by you to be good?

They broke up the band and none of them could ever get back to were they wanted to go.

I think those "people" you speak of were definetly the players he had here compared to the players he had in Miami not Jerry and co.

 

[The Rawhide Kid]

I think those "people" you speak of were definetly the players he had here compared to the players he had in Miami not Jerry and co.

It's almost comical for people to discredit Jimmy because he didn't have the success in Miami like he had in Dallas. Jimmy in Dallas w/o the Triplets, and vice versa, wouldn't have been able to produce what they were able to do together. Jimmy brought the right atmosphere that could bring out the best of our team. It also goes to show the talent of that 95 team because they were able to overcome Switzer.

 

[CoCo]

That comment from Lacewell while certainly eye-opening isn't astounding to me because I think its more common than people stop to realize.

Think of past employers or other organizations you're familiar with. Think about US government. It is not uncommon to find a person in power who has their moments when they appear absolutely clueless.

And yes, as TD33 stated, we tend to then characterize them solely in that light which probably isn't fair. There are always exceptions, but typically there is a reasonably legitimate explanation as to why that person came into power to begin with.

I actually kind of hate to see that story come out about Lacewell because it just fuels the fire of those who want to proclaim there is no good thing that could ever come out of Lacewell, or Jones by association, which IMO, is a gross exaggeration.

So Chief, with all due respect, if you find anymore dirt, could you keep it under your hat? I'm trying to keep a balanced perspective here.

 

[InmanRoshi]

The Jerry, Larry and Barry Show was just the epitome of the Good Ole' Boy network run amok. Switzer used to go on KTCK and tell some stories about "the good ole days" when he was with with the Cowboys and their beer drinking sessions, and I swear it doesn't even sound like a professional franchise ... it sounded like a beer league softball team.

 

[Chief]

The Jerry, Larry and Barry Show was just the epitome of the Good Ole' Boy network run amok. Switzer used to go on KTCK and tell some stories about "the good ole days" when he was with with the Cowboys and their beer drinking sessions, and I swear it doesn't even sound like a professional franchise ... it sounded like a beer league softball team.

I'll never forget when the three of them did the "Hear No Evil, See No Evil, Speak No Evil" pose in front of the war room camera during the espn telecast of the draft one year.

Friggin monkeys.

 

[Bach]

I actually kind of hate to see that story come out about Lacewell because it just fuels the fire of those who want to proclaim there is no good thing that could ever come out of Lacewell, or Jones by association, which IMO, is a gross exaggeration.

I can point to 7-8 drafts in that time period that will show it's not an exaggeration.

 

[CoCo]

I also think people who lament what might have been had Jerry and Jimmy been able to keep their egos in check miss some other realities in the process.

One, right or wrong, Jimmy is simply not a happily ever after guy as a football coach. That is a key part of why he didn't last that long in Miami too IMO. He had other aspirations, goals and ideas. The ego clash with Jerry was simply the eject button that was going to happen really soon in Dallas no matter what IMO.

There are also reports that Jimmy's fear/intimidation approach had grown very tiresome with some. Not all of course. And probably not the triplets in particular. But then I think we already discovered they could not do this by themselves either.

I think its quite possible that had Jimmy stayed we might have not fallen short in 94, and still won again in 95 as we did under Barry. But I think the ride would have ended there even with Jimmy on board. Age, injuries, some players getting out of control due to success etc.

IMO, age, injury, self-destruction (Lett, Irvin, Erik?) free agency, the cap, lower draft slots, & fewer picks, all played bigger roles in our ultimate decline than Barry being less prepared than Jimmy, or Jimmy's departure from the war room (which is not at all to make excuses for Jerry/Larry's pitiful drafts).

All the above are why dynasties are so rare.

 

[CoCo]

I can point to 7-8 drafts in that time period that will show it's not an exaggeration.

Any of us can point to those pieces of evidence. And no one disputes what a trainwreck it was or who's to blame. Lacewell ought to be embarrassed for his Haley comments/actions. And Jerry & Larry together ought to be embarrassed over much of their drafting results.

My point is, that Jones has a body of work as owner/GM that precedes that era and follows that era. And that evidence is just as legit, and actualy worthy of some applause.

But the Jerry haters either don't want to talk about those years, or want them all excused away via Jimmy, Parcells, or whatever else is handy. That's the irrational part IMO.

 

[InmanRoshi]

I'll never forget when the three of them did the "Hear No Evil, See No Evil, Speak No Evil" pose in front of the war room camera during the espn telecast of the draft one year.

Friggin monkeys.

The lasting image of Barry Switzer I'll have until my dying day is him sitting on the bench eating hot dogs during the middle of the Pro Bowl when he was supposed to be the head coach of the NFC squad.

 

[jobberone]

Glad you brought that up. I didn't know so many people were as rubbed about it as I was. I wonder how much of that is hyperbole and how much fact. It is condemning. Didn't know all that stuff about Lacewell, wife et al. Good read.

 

[HoosierCowboy]

Jimmy made some terrible picks as did The Tuna--seems like Jerry is blamed for all the bad drafts and someone else gets credit for the good.

 

[CoCo]

Jimmy made some terrible picks as did The Tuna--seems like Jerry is blamed for all the bad drafts and someone else gets credit for the good.

How could you say that?

[sarcasm off]

 

[WoodysGirl]

Within the context of that quote, it was with regard to how bad a temper Haley had and how he had some outrageous moments in San Fran.

I didn't see an issue with Lacewell hesitating to present the idea of Haley to Jerry within that contextual frame. If messageboards like these were around, we'd have the same type of mass threads that we've had about T.O., Pacman, etc. Talent vs possible lockerroom disruption.

 

[InmanRoshi]

He said he never heard of the player before and then just let it sit on his desk 3-4 days before bringing it over to Jerry. I don't know any other way to interpret it than what it is.

The Mosely column brought up the issue of what really rests a little uneasy with me about the PacMan situation. It's just not that PacMan is a lowlife, although he clearly is, I just don't feel the need to find my personal heros and villians from NFL players ... but rather Jerry has this annoying habit of thinking he can somehow cheat the system. And by cheat the system, I mean there is really only one tried and true way to build and maintain championship teams... have a clear long term vision and team philosophy, evaluate talent with those parameters in mind and patiently develop it for 2-4 years until they become the football players you envisioned. Jerry often times thinks he can circumvent this and add talent on the cheap through high risk fliers like Dimitrius Underwood, Alonzo Spellman, Drew Henson, Chad Hutchinson, Tank, PacMan. Oftentimes it feels like Jerry's "shortcuts" seem to end up putting this franchise back farther than if he would just do things the longterm and right way.

 

[zrinkill]

Jimmy made some terrible picks as did The Tuna--seems like Jerry is blamed for all the bad drafts and someone else gets credit for the good.

 

[Bach]

Jimmy made some terrible picks as did The Tuna--seems like Jerry is blamed for all the bad drafts and someone else gets credit for the good.

Not really. I haven't seen anyone blame Jerry for any bad picks from '89-'93 when Jimmy was here or from '03'-'06 when BP was here. And yeah, there were some bad picks in both of those time periods. But there was alot more good than bad.

You are really way off base.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Nice job Chief. Hope it doesn't get sidetracked.

The Haley comment blows my mind. I had not heard that before. Makes me wonder if guys get comfortable with what they do know and don't prepare.

I was at least encouraged that Jerry apparently not only knew who he was but about had an accident trying to react to the news.

I'm not sure what I feel was Jerry's biggest folly, but I believe I would probably go with "any of 500 guys could coach the Dallas Cowboys." That really did not sit well with me and never has. I've moved past it and long since let it go, but the memory still burns. I knew the team would begin a downward spiral once Switzer was brought in. Had a brief hope in Chan Gailey, no hope in Campo, and unrealized expectations under Tuna.

In between all of that I've come to really respect Jerry Jones, flaws and all.

Post of the week.

 

[Bach]

Any of us can point to those pieces of evidence. And no one disputes what a trainwreck it was or who's to blame. Lacewell ought to be embarrassed for his Haley comments/actions. And Jerry & Larry together ought to be embarrassed over much of their drafting results.

My point is, that Jones has a body of work as owner/GM that precedes that era and follows that era. And that evidence is just as legit, and actualy worthy of some applause.

But the Jerry haters either don't want to talk about those years, or want them all excused away via Jimmy, Parcells, or whatever else is handy. That's the irrational part IMO.

What's irrational is to try and sugarcoat the years when Jerry and Lacewell ran things and then try to credit Jerry for the work that was largely done by Jimmy and BP during those years.

But I know, Jerry is the one that is still here so some feel the need to vehemently defend and make excuses for him.

 

[superpunk]

http://i32.***BLOCKED***/albums/d2/superpunk2884/trickpony.jpg

 

[The Rawhide Kid]

http://i32.***BLOCKED***/albums/d2/superpunk2884/trickpony.jpg

I think Bach is actually Dan Snyder in disguise. Or he could be the little girl in the pic.