Jerry's reasons

[VA Cowboy]

Chief never suggested he was a puppet or the wrong man for the job.

I have no doubt that Wade is going to tutor Garret and some of our other Young coaches ..... but he may also be the best man to get us a Superbowl soon.

He does not have a history of being conservative on D ..... thank god.

I take it reading comprehension isn't your strong suit.


As for Wade, he isn't terrible. Much better imo than Norv. But he's still a mediocre HC. I hope he does better here than in his last three opportunities.
I hope he can work with Jerrys assistants and personnel.

 

[zrinkill]

I take it reading comprehension isn't your strong suit.

I think you read into things what you want to hear ..... But hey if Chief wants to come correct me about thinking Wade is a puppet, then I would admit I was wrong.

Keep digging though.

 

[ilovejerry]

I agree as well, Also we all know that the AFC s a much better conference right now as well, SD was ripped off they should be the SB champs this year, Also there was a post up predicting the new coach can we see the results of that I would like to see where everyone voted , not to toot my own horn but I saw this coming a mile away, and if you could post the peoples votes i think Norv was leading by a mile

 

[YosemiteSam]

My only real worry at this point is draft choices. The Cowboys in their history has had some of the greatest talent evaluators in the game. Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Tom Landry, and Gil Brandt. The Dallas Cowboys are one of the most successful franchises in NFL History and it was because of guys like these. If you go back in Cowboys history there are only a hand full of times the Cowboys were not winners when these guys were part of the Cowboys. Most of the time it was during a rebuilding process. (late 80s and early 60s) When they vanished, the Cowboys took a major slide into the depths of the NFL. Parcells came in and brought real talent back to the Cowboys and while the level of play has been up and down, the talent level of the Cowboys has skyrocketed and that cannot be denied. All of those guys are now gone again. I looked back at Wade Phllips draft choices in Denver and Buffalo. The best player I saw that he drafted was Peerless Price. That is a scary thought.

I fear a return to an inability to judge real talent. A slide back to the bottom of the league because we have to sign free agents because we can't draft. It's been said that the draft is the life-blood of a team. If you can't draft, you die. Look at the Washington Commanders. Look at the Cowboys of the late 90s. Both were complete failures when it came to the draft. Wade Phillips hasn't faired well in the draft yet....

 

[THUMPER]

Great take on the situation Chief!

I like the Phillips hiring because it addresses our biggest area of need and that is the 3-4 defense that Jerry is committed to. Phillips is probably the best available coach for the 3-4 so it makes a lot of sense.

 

[ilovejerry]

Great take on the situation Chief!

I like the Phillips hiring because it addresses our biggest area of need and that is the 3-4 defense that Jerry is committed to. Phillips is probably the best available coach for the 3-4 so it makes a lot of sense.

OK what about the other candidates draft history? Exactly ask yourself that

 

[YosemiteSam]

Great take on the situation Chief!

I like the Phillips hiring because it addresses our biggest area of need and that is the 3-4 defense that Jerry is committed to. Phillips is probably the best available coach for the 3-4 so it makes a lot of sense.

Rex Ryan was available and he would have been a better choice for defense.

 

[ilovejerry]

Rex Ryan was available and he would have been a better choice for defense.

why do feel that ? what drafting has he done ? Just curious

 

[superpunk]

My only real worry at this point is draft choices. The Cowboys in their history has had some of the greatest talent evaluators in the game. Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, Tom Landry, and Gil Brandt. The Dallas Cowboys are one of the most successful franchises in NFL History and it was because of guys like these. If you go back in Cowboys history there are only a hand full of times the Cowboys were not winners when these guys were part of the Cowboys. Most of the time it was during a rebuilding process. (late 80s and early 60s) When they vanished, the Cowboys took a major slide into the depths of the NFL. Parcells came in and brought real talent back to the Cowboys and while the level of play has been up and down, the talent level of the Cowboys has skyrocketed and that cannot be denied. All of those guys are now gone again. I looked back at Wade Phllips draft choices in Denver and Buffalo. The best player I saw that he drafted was Peerless Price. That is a scary thought.

I fear a return to an inability to judge real talent. A slide back to the bottom of the league because we have to sign free agents because we can't draft. It's been said that the draft is the life-blood of a team. If you can't draft, you die. Look at the Washington Commanders. Look at the Cowboys of the late 90s. Both were complete failures when it came to the draft. Wade Phillips hasn't faired well in the draft yet....

In Buffalo, Phillips drafted Cowart, Wiley, Winfield, Jay Foreman, Peerless Price - does anyone know why they had so few draft choices in 98?

Looks like his biggest mistake was Smith in the first, but he looked like a good back. I think we're all hoping Ireland will get the players he needs - that worked well with Smith in SD.

 

[YosemiteSam]

why do feel that ? what drafting has he done ? Just curious

I'm not talking about his draft ability. I'm talking about his ability to coach defense.

I don't think there are any candidates that has great drafting ability. This is where you want to hire a GM. DOH! Jerry is the GM. We've seen his handy work when left unchecked.

 

[ilovejerry]

I'm not talking about his draft ability. I'm talking about his ability to coach defense.

I don't think there are any candidates that has great drafting ability. This is where you want to hire a GM. DOH! Jerry is the GM. We've seen his handy work when left unchecked.

Ok so your problem is really with Jerry then right ? Well then its not about head coaching if you believe that Bill did all the drafting then now its Jerrys call to blow this year, well time will only tell.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Ok so your problem is really with Jerry then right ? Well then its not about head coaching if you believe that Bill did all the drafting then now its Jerrys call to blow this year, well time will only tell.

Couple of things. Wade is a much better hire than Turner just because I don't think Turner has what it takes to control his team. Wade does. I like that we have Wade Phillips for defensive reasons, but I've never really liked him as a head coach. I just didn't feel he did a very good job when he had that position. Drafting generally isn't the coaches main job. It's what the GM and scouting teams do. The coach tells them what he needs and reviews their candidates. There are some coaches out there that are great talent evaluators. Tom Landry, Jimmy Johnson, Bill Parcells, Bill Cowher, Dick Vermeil, Mike Holmgren, Chuck Noll, etc. You don't have to have a coach thats a great talent evaluator, you just need a GM that is. Jerry is not and he is the GM and thats not going to change. That means we need a coach with that type of skill. I don't beleive Wade is that guy. Maybe we can hire Bill Cowher next year.

 

[ilovejerry]

Couple of things. Wade is a much better hire than Turner just because I don't think Turner has what it takes to control his team. Wade does. I like that we have Wade Phillips for defensive reasons, but I've never really liked him as a head coach. I just didn't feel he did a very good job when he had that position. Drafting generally isn't the coaches main job. It's what the GM and scouting teams do. The coach tells them what he needs and reviews their candidates. There are some coaches out there that are great talent evaluators. Tom Landry, Jimmy Johnson, Bill Parcells, Bill Cowher, Dick Vermeil, Mike Holmgren, Chuck Noll, etc. You don't have to have a coach thats a great talent evaluator, you just need a GM that is. Jerry is not and he is the GM and thats not going to change. That means we need a coach with that type of skill. I don't beleive Wade is that guy. Maybe we can hire Bill Cowher next year.

Ok I hear what your saying, but Tom Landry had picked many dogs in his day, And I really dont want to go and shoot holes through the other guys, TL was great with Gil when they were ahead of teams with there computers and drafting out of small colleges but when the rest of the NFL caught up with what the DC were doing they couldnt draft to save there life.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Ok I hear what your saying, but Tom Landry had picked many dogs in his day, And I really dont want to go and shoot holes through the other guys, TL was great with Gil when they were ahead of teams with there computers and drafting out of small colleges but when the rest of the NFL caught up with what the DC were doing they couldnt draft to save there life.

Hey did you hear. Brandt and Landry's last #1 draft choice just got elected into the Pro Football Hall of Fame! :

It doesn't matter how great a talent evaluator you are, you are always going to get a (in Texas talk) Bum Steer now and again.

 

[ilovejerry]

Hey did you hear. Brandt and Landry's last #1 draft choice just got elected into the Pro Football Hall of Fame! :

It doesn't matter how great a talent evaluator you are, you are always going to get a (in Texas talk) Bum Steer now and again.

Ok so your going to make me post up the last 5 years of TL draft choice's? and Mike Irvin was a no brain-er, come on man.

1Kevin BrooksDEMichigan2Jesse PennLBVirginia Tech3Crawford KerGFlorida4Robert LavetteRBGeorgia Tech5Herschel WalkerRBGeorgia5Matt DarwinCTexas A&M6Kurt PloegerDEGustavus Adolphus6Matt MoranGStanford7Karl PoweWRAlabama State7Jim HerrmannDEBYU8Leon GonzalesWRBethune-Cookman9Scott StrasburgerLBNebraska10Joe JonesTEVirginia Tech11Neal DelloconoLBUCLA12Karl Jordan

Here you go thanks for HW that set us right up.

1986 Draft ​

1Mike SherrardWRUCLA2Darryl ClackRBArizona State3Mark WalenDTUCLA4Max ZendajasKArizona5to San Francisco6Thornton ChandlerTEAlabama6Stan GelbaughQBMaryland6Lloyd YancyGTemple7Johnny HollowayWRKansas8Topper ClemonsRBWake Forest9John IonataGFlorida State10Bryan ChesterGTexas11Garth JaxLBFlorida State12Chris DulibanLBTexas12Tony Flack

ALL SCRAP there 2 great dfarts

1987 Draft ​

1Danny NoonanDTNebraska2Ron FrancisDBBaylor3Jeff ZimmermanGFlorida4Kelvin MartinWRBoston College5Everett GayWRTexas6Joe OnosaiGHawaii7Kevin SweeneyQBFresno State8Kevin GoganTWashington9Alvin BlountRBMaryland10Dale JonesLBTennessee11Jeff WardKTexas12Scott ArmstrongLBFlorida

Looks It Danny NOONAN again he should have brought Gary Oldman wth him

Lets go on to another banner year at the old BENDER house

1988 Draft ​

1Michael IrvinWRMiami2Ken Norton Jr.LBUCLA3Mark Hutson GOklahoma4Dave WidellTBoston College5to Phoenix6Scott SeculesQBVirginia7Owen HoovenTOregon State8Mark HiggsRBKentucky9Brian BedfordWRCalifornia10Billy OwensDBPittsburgh11Chad HenningsDTAir Force12Ben Hummel

OK there we go 3 guys out of how many years?

I didnt want to go back to far but Im sure someone wll

 

[Champsheart]

Good Post Chief. It all makes sense.

I have not posted much at all for a while, but here are just a couple of quick thoughts.

I am a little up and down on this Wade Phillips thing.

What I do really like is I think he will make this 3-4 defense much better than the Parcells version. I had so much frustration last year watching a vanilla read and react 3-4 under Parcells. Why would you run a 3-4 and not be creative with it. ATTACK ATACK ATTACK.

I believe Wade will take care of that and our defense could be really good.
I think players like playing for Wade, I think he is a good guy. I think he will want to run the ball a lot, and use play action.
I think Wade did decent in his previous stints as a HC, but never had the talent he will have with this team, so if he could take teams to the playoffs with not that much talent, he could taker this team a little ways.

BUT

I really think at some point down the line we will regret not having a guy like Mike Singletary coaching this team.
I realize he does not have the experience, and I still am not sure he would have been the right choice, but I do believe Singltary is a leader of men, demands respect, is intense, and players would rip someones heart out for him.

This is the piece I think Wade is missing. At some point the Cowboys are going to have to get a young head coach who is that leader of men to take this team's reigns for years to come.

I hope Wade can lead this team! That is what they need. This is what I am not sure about.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Ok so your going to make me post up the last 5 years of TL draft choice's? and Mike Irvin was a no brain-er, come on man.

While they only pulled 1 HoF out of the bunch, they pulled several pretty good players.

• 1988 - Michael Irvin
• 1988 - Ken Norton Jr.
• 1988 - Chad Hennings
• 1987 - Kelvin Martin
• 1987 - Kevin Gogan
• 1986 - Complete Bust!
• 1985 - Herschel Walker
• 1984 - Eugene Lockhart
• 1983 - Jim Jeffcoat

 

[ilovejerry]

1. 1984 Draft ​
   1Billy Cannon Jr.LBTexas A&M2Victor ScottDBColorado3Fred CornwellTEUSC4Steve DeOssieLBBoston College5Steve PelluerQBWashington5Norm GrangerRBIowa6Eugene LockhartLBHouston6Joe LevelisGIowa7Ed MartinLBIndiana State8Mike RevellRBBethune-Cookman9John HuntGFlorida9Neil MauneGNotre Dame10Brian SalonenTEMontana11Dowe AughtmanDTAuburn12Carl LewisWRHouston1984 Supplemental Draft1Todd FowlerTEStephen F. Austin2Malcolm MooreWRUSC3Jeff SpekTESan Diego State

• 1983 Draft ​
  1Jim JeffcoatDEArizona State2Mike WalterDEOregon3Bryan CaldwellDEArizona State4Chris FaulknerTEFlorida5Chuck McSwainRBClemson6Reggie CollierQBS. Mississippi7Chris SchultzTArizona8Lawrence RicksRBMichigan9Al GrossDBArizona10Eric MoranTWashington11Dan TaylorTIdaho State12Lorenzo BouierRBMaine

Heres Toms (Qunicy Carter ) pick remember him, NO of course not cause they wouldn't let a black guy QB Americas team ,they shipped him right off to wide REC.

shall I go on?

 

[ilovejerry]

While they only pulled 1 HoF out of the bunch, they pulled several pretty good players.

• 1988 - Michael Irvin
• 1988 - Ken Norton Jr.
• 1988 - Chad Hennings
• 1987 - Kelvin Martin
• 1987 - Kevin Gogan
• 1986 - Complete Bust!
• 1985 - Herschel Walker
• 1984 - Eugene Lockhart
• 1983 - Jim Jeffcoat

So your theory is one player out of a whole draft?

Then we have nothing to worry about then. Are you kidding me. Any moron could pick where we were what was our record
lets see
we were
83-12-4
84-9-7
85-10-6
86-7-9
87-7-8
88-3-13

now I can look to see where we drafted at if you like as well

 

[YosemiteSam]

So your theory is one player out of a whole draft?

Then we have nothing to worry about then. Are you kidding me. Any moron could pick where we were what was our record
lets see
we were
83-12-4
84-9-7
85-10-6
86-7-9
87-7-8
88-3-13

now I can look to see where we drafted at if you like as well

Once Jonhson, Brandt, and Landry were gone and before Parcells arrived.

• 1994 - Larry Allen
• 1995 - Complete Bust!
• 1996 - Randall Godfrey (Yet we judge him as sucking and let him go)
• 1997 - Dexter Coakley (more of a fan favorite than a great player)
• 1998 - Greg Ellis
• 1998 - Flozell Adams
• 1999 - Dat Nguyen (fan favorite, not a great player)
• 2000 - Complete Bust!
• 2001 - Complete Bust!
• 2002 - Roy Williams (no brainer as you say)
• 2002 - Andre Gurode

Ummm, see my point? How many complete bust years did with have once the talented talent evaluators left? :bang2:

EDIT: And as noted there are some names listed that werent that great a players and one that ended up being pretty good (Godfrey) yet we just let him walk because Jerry didn't pay linebackers. (Ken Norton Jr.)