Jimmy Earned It

[Manwiththeplan]

Jimmy Johnson earned his way into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

Jimmy Johnson ALSO earned his exclusion from the Cowboys Ring of Honor.

It is possible for BOTH of the above statements to be true.

what?

ask yourself this question. If Jones sold the team to someone who wasn't a family member, what would be the likelihood that Jimmy doesn't get in the ROH. A non-fan who doesn't personally care about either...that will tell you if he should or should not be included.

 

[khiladi]

Also the fact Jerry doesn’t have Jimmy in the ROH, also explains why he latched on to Jason Garrett and the Garrett family for so long.

 

[khiladi]

The coach's job is to win games. Jimmy couldn't make it happen in Miami. Where were the genius trades to get a QB if that was the problem? He was a great and worthy HOF coach because of the wheeling and dealing and pushing players' buttons. He didn't actually coach any particular part of the teams he was in charge of.

Well he had a winning record in Miami. And that is because Marino was done.. and Jimmy was all about a fat check in the state he wanted to be in, without investing as much time into the team.

 

[atlantacowboy]

The coach's job is to win games. Jimmy couldn't make it happen in Miami. Where were the genius trades to get a QB if that was the problem? He was a great and worthy HOF coach because of the wheeling and dealing and pushing players' buttons. He didn't actually coach any particular part of the teams he was in charge of.

You clearly don't know much about Miami while Jimmy was there. If you want to look down from 30,000 ft and make a blanket statement. Thats fine. The great thing is that Jimmy doesn't need defending anymore. He's a HOFer........and your just some guy on a chat board with a backward opinion. All you Jimmy bashers can spin. Jimmy got his gold jacket and that says all that needs to be said about him.

 

[cern]

while it is true jimmy and landry both won 2 superbowls, jimmy left with a team good enough to win another shortly thereafter. landry left a horrible mess. and while I accept the op's premise, jerry should be the bigger man and induct jimmy in the roh. the fans would love it.

 

[cern]

Wrong. Jerry might put the members in the ROH but they earn the right to be there. The fans deserve to see it. Tired of hearing about Jerry and his petty ways. He wouldn't have his lousy 3 SB rings without Jimmy and then where would he be? Oh that's right nowhere. He sure wouldn't have the fanbase he does today. He's been living off those 90's teams for 25 years. Tom Landry didn't even like Jerry. He died a Giants fan.

tex schramm liked him even less.

 

[atlantacowboy]

while it is true jimmy and landry both won 2 superbowls, jimmy left with a team good enough to win another shortly thereafter. landry left a horrible mess. and while I accept the op's premise, jerry should be the bigger man and induct jimmy in the roh. the fans would love it.

So, you would have been fine with Jerry chopping off coach Johnsons balls.........undermining the coaches authority as he's been doing to coaches for the past 25 years.............and Jimmy should have been okay with it? The whole mess BEGAN b/c Jerry thought playing football GM would be fun. Can you imagine how insulting that was for a self-made football coach like Jimmy Johnson who came up through the football trenches and was brought to Dallas to bail Jerry out of the football mess that was the Dallas Cowboys in 1989? ...... Jimmy did his job. The job he was hired to do. .......built a back-to-back super bowl champ........and here comes the owner waiving a contract extension that takes away his authority to make roster decisions? Jimmy had every right to be insulted and walk away. Jerry has never been "the bigger man". He's been holding all the cards since day 1.

 

[dckid]

JImmy couldn't even rebuild Miami. If he had to have a HOF QB to even win games, how does that make him a HOF coach? All I'm saying is it was the perfect storm in Dallas. He and Jerry needed each other. It was more than hiring. It was Jerry challenging Jimmy, being willing to bring in certain players and make certain deals. If you don't think Jerry had a hand in the Hershall Walker deal or bringing Haley to Dallas, you're dreaming. Jimmy did not have the authority to make deals. Ultimately, Jerry had to be the type of owner/gm willing to take chances and agree with what was presented, and then he had to make the deals happen on paper.

Jimmy didn't actually do any coaching, but he was great at bringing the right people together and pushing the right buttons on players. However, even Jimmy knew that he couldn't stay in Dallas and that it wasn't just because of Jerry. He knew that his style would only work with players for a short time before they'd tune him out or get burned out. That's why he fashioned himself as a gypsy coach.

Jimmy deserves the HOF, but he never smells it without Jerry as his boss and owner/gm of the Cowboys....and probably not without Minnesota and Hershall Walker and Charles Haley.

I guess we can agree to disagree. I really believe Jimmy reached the pinnacle in Dallas even quicker than he expected. I think he wanted to leave because of Jerry and it wasnt just after the 2nd win, he was ready to leave after the first one. If he was working with sane, normal human being he would have stayed long term.
As far as styles not working, I have to disagree with you. Players love winning. Look at Bill in NE. He is about as cut throat as you get yet he has been in NE 20 years. It is a very easy cop out to say Jimmy would have left because of his style. I totally disagree with that.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

They actually wanted to keep Emmitt, but Emmitt didn't want to stay because they wouldn't guarantee he would keep the starting job and get the bulk of the carries. I'm not sure that he was released, I think his contract just expired.

Lost out to hammerhead lol

 

[atlantacowboy]

I don't believe he meant that as a shot at Jimmy, but rather as a statement of how good the players were... What's more, at that point, it wasn't a ridiculous statement. Switzer took over and barely coached the team, yet they made it to another SB, thanks to Aikman, Irvin, and other leaders on the team.

It was an insulting boast and was intended as such. Jerry even finished it off by dusting off Switzer who was a JJ rival.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I guess we can agree to disagree. I really believe Jimmy reached the pinnacle in Dallas even quicker than he expected. I think he wanted to leave because of Jerry and it wasnt just after the 2nd win, he was ready to leave after the first one. If he was working with sane, normal human being he would have stayed long term.
As far as styles not working, I have to disagree with you. Players love winning. Look at Bill in NE. He is about as cut throat as you get yet he has been in NE 20 years. It is a very easy cop out to say Jimmy would have left because of his style. I totally disagree with that.

I almost agree 100 percent.
I don’t think he was ready to leave.


The cowboys were Jimmy Johnson’s Dallas Cowboys in a matter of speaking.
Jerry couldn’t handle that for more than 2 years of ultimate goal accomplishment.

 

[atlantacowboy]

I guess we can agree to disagree. I really believe Jimmy reached the pinnacle in Dallas even quicker than he expected. I think he wanted to leave because of Jerry and it wasnt just after the 2nd win, he was ready to leave after the first one. If he was working with sane, normal human being he would have stayed long term.
As far as styles not working, I have to disagree with you. Players love winning. Look at Bill in NE. He is about as cut throat as you get yet he has been in NE 20 years. It is a very easy cop out to say Jimmy would have left because of his style. I totally disagree with that.

So, you don't think the contract extension Jerry offered Jimmy after the second super bowl that took away player personnel from Jimmy.........that had nothing to do with it? You gotta be kidding.

Every move Jimmy made prior to leaving Dallas was a step up the coaching ladder. The notion that he was ready to leave or would have left regardless of what Jerry did is a giant load of garbage,

 

[OmerV]

Lost out to hammerhead lol

Yep. But honestly I understood the Cowboys position. Emmitt was fading at the time, and Hambrick was truthfully looking better than Emmitt, albeit it in a limited role. As always, you never know until a RB is put in the position of carrying the majority of the load. But as I recall, the Cowboys didn't tell Emmitt he was losing his job or that he would not be the primary RB, they just said they couldn't guarantee it. That said, I don't blame Emmitt either for believing in himself enough to make a go of it with another team. Neither side is really to blame.

 

[dckid]

So, you don't think the contract extension Jerry offered Jimmy after the second super bowl that took away player personnel from Jimmy.........that had nothing to do with it? You gotta be kidding.

Every move Jimmy made prior to leaving Dallas was a step up the coaching ladder. The notion that he was ready to leave or would have left regardless of what Jerry did is a giant load of garbage,

That is what I am saying. I don't think he leaves if we have a sane owner. I will have to find where I read that Jimmy was already very ticked at Jerry for meddling even after the first win. Whether it was him coming to the locker room, or allowing camera access to the draft room, etc,etc. Jimmy only cared about the culture and winning.

 

[OmerV]

That is what I am saying. I don't think he leaves if we have a sane owner. I will have to find where I read that Jimmy was already very ticked at Jerry for meddling even after the first win. Whether it was him coming to the locker room, or allowing camera access to the draft room, etc,etc. Jimmy only cared about the culture and winning.

That would have been interesting to find out. Jimmy never stayed anywhere very long. 5 years at OK State, 5 years at U of Miami, 5 years with the Cowboys and 4 years with the Dolphins. And I believe I've heard Jimmy say he wouldn't have stayed a lot longer anyway, and the incident with Jerry just sped things up.

 

[atlantacowboy]

That is what I am saying. I don't think he leaves if we have a sane owner. I will have to find where I read that Jimmy was already very ticked at Jerry for meddling even after the first win. Whether it was him coming to the locker room, or allowing camera access to the draft room, etc,etc. Jimmy only cared about the culture and winning.

Sorry, I skimmed your response and misread it.

 

[Runwildboys]

It was an insulting boast and was intended as such. Jerry even finished it off by dusting off Switzer who was a JJ rival.

I honestly didn't care enough at the time to commit it all to memory, so this happened after the dinner party episode?

 

[CouchCoach]

When I think of Jimmy Johnson the HC, I don't think he was in it long enough to garner HOF; however, when I add to it that he was actually doing the talent part of the GM job as well, that makes all the difference. He built the team that turned it around before teams were able to do that with FA.

I am sure there are voters that credit that 3rd ring to his team as well and think they might have gone 4 in a row with him at the helm because there was no relaxing with him.

Yes, the Walker trade was the catalyst as was the fact he didn't have the traditional owner or GM that was more talent focused, he had one trying to get out of the red so he wouldn't have to sell the team. However, he turned that Walker trade into gold and built the youngest team to ever win a SB and had the #1 D without one pber on it. A team mentioned with only a few others as a candidate for best ever, that's HOF stuff. Had he stayed two more years, that team was more than a candidate.

I don't think there's any question he does get a job in the NFL but I don't think he has as much authority as Booger gave him. And that Walker trade was just magical. Jimmy happened to land on the one team that had the one player the GM in MIN wanted so badly, his missing piece.

And while I think Booger is a total awesome person there is one more part to this. He bought a team losing 1M a month and allowed his HC to pull that deal together knowing he was losing his only draw and would be lucky to win one game. Say what you will, takes big brass ones and a hell of a strong belief in a person to attach your dream to them. If that had backfired, no jacket for either of them and most likely, no team for Booger.

 

[CouchCoach]

I honestly didn't care enough at the time to commit it all to memory, so this happened after the dinner party episode?

They were drunk and I was drunk when I heard about it so I don't remember either. I think I sided with the bartender. They know stuff.

 

[atlantacowboy]

I honestly didn't care enough at the time to commit it all to memory, so this happened after the dinner party episode?

So, your team was being blown up and you didn't care? lol

I'm too lazy to check the timeline but the "500 coaches comment" was the last straw and Johnson was gone the next week. Interestingly, Jerry has done a few mea culpas recently. He regrets not being more tolerant in regard to jimmy and had this to say at his HOF induction:

"
"There was no real easy way to do it. I wanted someone I knew, I wanted someone I knew well. I wanted someone that could get it done to be our coach. I wanted Jimmy Johnson. I said he'd be worth five first-round draft choices or five Heisman Trophy winners. Of course, I sure did get laughed out of town when I said it. It was my first experience as an owner and general manager making a difficult and very unpopular decision. Jimmy, it was a great decision.


"You were a great teammate, you were a great partner. To the contrary of popular belief, we worked so well together for five years and restored the Cowboys' credibility with our fans. We were back to back, we were driven, we had thick skin, we took all the criticism they could dish out. I thank you."

In my opinion, Jimmy is going to get his ROH induction b/c Jerry doesn't like the bad press his omission is creating.

I would love to see Jerry induct him b/c that would be full circle. Aikman would be divisive b/c he's recently become Jerry's most famous public critic. I think if Jimmy lets Jerry do it, he gets his ROH next year. If Aikman does it, then it might be awhile longer.