JJ showing his lessons learned by working on rumored deals

Chuck 54

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JJ seems to learned his lesson in recent years. I love the way he now works FA not in a panic, but in an attempt to clear up the draft so that he has no desperation and can improve his odds of keeping the Cowboys strong with a BPA approach.

IT's obvious that our most desperate position is CB. It's also clear that we need a player at WR who can be a threat in case Glenn is truly done. RB, while many are suggesting using #22, is actually about important depth.

Picking at #22 and #28, and then again at the end of round 2 is no way to find a difference maker at any position...it happens even later than that, but the Cowboys are a contender desperate for CB help.

If the Pacman deal goes down, suddenly we're a better team in the secondary than we were last season, and the draft is all about adding depth, including CB...this sets us up to take the best player available, whether it's CB, S, WR, RB, DL, or OG. I saw a poster getting hammered yesterday for suggesting the possibility of taking the best OG in the draft at #22. That OG from UVA is likely to be rated higher than half of the CB's, WR's, and RB's that many fans hope we select in round 1.

I love the rumors, whether they work out or not...it shows me that JJ has learned what the draft is really all about and that going into the draft in desperate need for a 3rd CB or any other position is a sure way to screw it up, especially when selecting in the 20's.

I'm hoping to see a trade for Pacman because I prefer having him and a drafted CB on the team with Newman and Henry rather than just the drafted CB. I'm also hoping for a WR deal...though I'd prefer Roy Williams to Chad Johnson at this point, I'd be happy with either guy. But CB is the draft-maker...with Pacman, all options open to take the best players, even if it means waiting till rounds 2 or 3 for a CB, WR, or RB, the positions everyone has assumed would be first up, even if they weren't the best players on the board.

JJ seems to understand how to keep his team strong by keeping the draft a simple process of adding the best players you can find at any positions.
 

DBoys

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wayne motley;2008829 said:
JJ seems to learned his lesson in recent years. I love the way he now works FA not in a panic, but in an attempt to clear up the draft so that he has no desperation and can improve his odds of keeping the Cowboys strong with a BPA approach.

IT's obvious that our most desperate position is CB. It's also clear that we need a player at WR who can be a threat in case Glenn is truly done. RB, while many are suggesting using #22, is actually about important depth.

Picking at #22 and #28, and then again at the end of round 2 is no way to find a difference maker at any position...it happens even later than that, but the Cowboys are a contender desperate for CB help.

If the Pacman deal goes down, suddenly we're a better team in the secondary than we were last season, and the draft is all about adding depth, including CB...this sets us up to take the best player available, whether it's CB, S, WR, RB, DL, or OG. I saw a poster getting hammered yesterday for suggesting the possibility of taking the best OG in the draft at #22. That OG from UVA is likely to be rated higher than half of the CB's, WR's, and RB's that many fans hope we select in round 1.

I love the rumors, whether they work out or not...it shows me that JJ has learned what the draft is really all about and that going into the draft in desperate need for a 3rd CB or any other position is a sure way to screw it up, especially when selecting in the 20's.

I'm hoping to see a trade for Pacman because I prefer having him and a drafted CB on the team with Newman and Henry rather than just the drafted CB. I'm also hoping for a WR deal...though I'd prefer Roy Williams to Chad Johnson at this point, I'd be happy with either guy. But CB is the draft-maker...with Pacman, all options open to take the best players, even if it means waiting till rounds 2 or 3 for a CB, WR, or RB, the positions everyone has assumed would be first up, even if they weren't the best players on the board.

JJ seems to understand how to keep his team strong by keeping the draft a simple process of adding the best players you can find at any positions.

Great post and I am total agreement.

Like you said getting Pacman then we shift to BPA. CB is a critical need and I think people underestimate how important. Henry and Reeves killed us last year in 3rd downs. If we get Pacman I have no doubt he will start and it will be the best set of CB's we have had since the 90's. Newman/Pacman can take people on without help. I don't trust Henry as a 3rd down CB and I pray we get a top CB in the draft or one of the existing guys steps up. We could save cap space by cutting Henry.

I hope we have a shot at Limas Sweed and Desean Jackson at #28. I also hope we move up in the 2nd round and get Ray Rice.
 

tyke1doe

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The only problem with your scenario, wayne, is that we won't know until training camp whether PacMan will be able to play this season.

No, our draft priorities won't be dependant upon trading for PacMan. We will proceed accordingly. If any corners worthy of our pick is there, we will take him. If any wide receivers .... If any running backs ....

I predict a trade of some sort, either up or down because the value might not warrant taking any of those positions where we now stand, assuming the best guys have been taken ahead of the #22 and #28 picks.
 

NeonNinja

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I'm sure if the deal goes down for Pac that Jerry has been in the commish's ear for an answer.
 

iceberg

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wayne motley;2008829 said:
JJ seems to learned his lesson in recent years. I love the way he now works FA not in a panic, but in an attempt to clear up the draft so that he has no desperation and can improve his odds of keeping the Cowboys strong with a BPA approach.

IT's obvious that our most desperate position is CB. It's also clear that we need a player at WR who can be a threat in case Glenn is truly done. .

stopped reading. why? cause a few hours ago i read jones said don't rule out glenn.

people pick and choose what to hear. simply amazing.
 

tyke1doe

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headhunterroy05;2008913 said:
I'm sure if the deal goes down for Pac that Jerry has been in the commish's ear for an answer.

I doubt the commissioner is going to tell Jerry Jones about PacMan's status. If that information got out, it would smack of favoritism for the Cowboys, and we know that Goodell is in the Patriots' hip pocket. ;) :D
 

InmanRoshi

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Pac Man should have no impact on the Cowboys draft. Building your draft around a player who is one more stupid strip club incident away from a lifetime banishment from the NFL (and who has seemingly no reservations or apologies about attending the establishments in the future) is amazingly dumb and short sighted. If Jerry wants to take the PR hit of adding him on a flier that's one thing, but to depend on him, to build around him, to make him a center piece of the puzzle is stupid.
 

heir

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I always felt the draft should be a combination of BPA and Need. If at 22 the best player available is a QB does Dallas take him? What about OLB? What about MLB?

If you have a need at CB, RB, and WR, as Dallas does and you have players in those positions rated near the value of where you are picking, then draft the BPA in the position of need. We have glaring needs at 2 positions, CB and RB, and I don't know if we can afford not to pick one, if not both, of them early.
 

theebs

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well dont forget that Jerry wasnt too thrilled with the free agent class of 06 where he gave away million dollar bonuses up front to a couple players who didnt make the team in camp! That might be part of the reason Jerry wasnt too worried about letting a guy like brian gaine go.
 

Chuck 54

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iceberg;2008919 said:
stopped reading. why? cause a few hours ago i read jones said don't rule out glenn.

people pick and choose what to hear. simply amazing.

JJ says "don't rule out Glenn" and you stop reading because I write "IF Glenn is really done"....the IF is the key factor.

I would be thrilled if Terry Glenn returned to his form of 2 seasons ago, but "don't rule him out" doesn't tell us anything...Glenn is a huge question mark for being healthy at the start of the season and just as big a question mark on staying healthy.

I don't believe Glenn's situation will have anything to do with our making a deal or drafting a WR...getting a WR is just like getting Pacman in this case...it's all about insurance and hedging your bets.
 

Woods

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InmanRoshi;2008951 said:
Pac Man should have no impact on the Cowboys draft. Building your draft around a player who is one more stupid strip club incident away from a lifetime banishment from the NFL (and who has seemingly no reservations or apologies about attending the establishments in the future) is amazingly dumb and short sighted. If Jerry wants to take the PR hit of adding him on a flier that's one thing, but to depend on him, to build around him, to make him a center piece of the puzzle is stupid.

This is how I feel.

I'd like to get PacMan on a "cheap" contract, and if he can keep his head on straight, I think he can make a big difference.

But it's that "if" part which is significant.

There is no way J Jones can afford to depend on PacMan. We HAVE to get another CB who is capable of at least being the 3rd CB, if not starting (in case Henry gets dinged up again), this Draft.

This is really a no-brainer.
 

Chuck 54

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InmanRoshi;2008951 said:
Pac Man should have no impact on the Cowboys draft. Building your draft around a player who is one more stupid strip club incident away from a lifetime banishment from the NFL (and who has seemingly no reservations or apologies about attending the establishments in the future) is amazingly dumb and short sighted. If Jerry wants to take the PR hit of adding him on a flier that's one thing, but to depend on him, to build around him, to make him a center piece of the puzzle is stupid.

I agree 100%, and frankly, I was disgusted when I first heard we were looking at Pacman; however, there's a reason we're trying to make that deal. We will still draft a CB, but we won't be desperate...while we can't count on Pacman behaving himself for the year, we will be hoping for it...all I'm saying is that without signing any CB before the draft, we'll be somewhat desperate in round 1 whether the guy deserves that spot or not. Pacman can't be counted on, but he does give you the extra body that allows you to avoid reaching in round 1...instead possibly taking a CB in round 2 or 3, possibly a guy no one has even talked about but a guy who would still be an upgrade over Reeves....it's just a theory. I don't think Jones is banking his SB dreams on Pacman, but I do think he's hedging his bets and giving himself more room on draft day to do what's best instead of thinking, "omg...I don't even have an option at nickel CB yet."
 

Redball Express

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..and I'd spin your points different yet.

If Jones is able to do a deal for a WR such as some are suggesting he's wanting to do using one of our #1's..

..and if Pacman is indeed traded for...

and this can all get done by pre-draft..

..then that leaves us one of our #1's..probably #28.

Which depending on how the draft falls..gets us a CB or RB..depending on how it shakes out. And seeing how Pacman would be signed for 2008, I think that targets RB as our biggest need at that point with #28.

And failing that the right player drops to us at #28..we then trade out of the 1st rd. and trade our #28 for somebodies #1 next year and pick up another mid-rd. pick for doing it..

..and then get the RB and the CB in Rds. 2 and 3..in that order.

So we again try to double up on the draft next year and try to again grow our #28 into something higher next year...while taking a WR and CB in trades as you suggest..getting a RB at #28 or dropping out and fertilizing for next year's draft with again having 2 #1's.

This is especially important because if we are able to get back to the playoffs and win at least one game or more in 2008..

..then our #1 next year turns into a 30th+ or something like that. Not really much of a #1.

But with an extra #1 from some team below that to add again to our own next year..we continue to build for the future and grow draft picks.

Parcells has instilled in Jones that you try to get 2 #'s and try to always be growing one and using one where possible and if they both end up low picks..then you are going to use them both.

If they both end up being low picks next year..we're in trouble anyway and will need them...meaning we bombed in 2009.

I can see Jones continuing to use FA and the draft as our 2 headed monster to get ahead..again this year and next.

But there are a lot of big 'but's there. A WR trade and a Pacman trade have to be crystalized first.

We'll see.

:starspin ReDBaLL ExPreSS :starspin
 

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First, a great post, and i totally agree, we need to get Pacman,

To me, if the cowboys, with calvin hill show that they can help Pacman to the commissioner and that his agent does show Goodell that some other NFL players werent suspended due to drinking, fights, jail time, etc, even the big OT from Minnesotta McKinnie i think, has been arrested 4 times now, etc, and you dont see him suspended. Granted, he didnt go to strip clubs that I know of, but most times when you drink, your at those type of clubs, but as we all know Pacman was involved in a shooting, etc. Yet, if the cowboys, calvin hill, pacmans agent show Goodell he didnt enforce suspensions on those other players like he should have. Now, i do agree that pacam needed to be shown you cant do those things and be in the NFL, but he did serve his one year suspension.

The NFL at same time should be about giving guys a chance IF THEY SHOW LEARNING FROM THEIR WAYS, AND BE A MODEL CITIZEN. SO, I SAY GIVE PACMAN A CHANCE.

Then like the post, this will give us the chance to take the best player available, and what i think is important, trade up from the 22nd pick, our cowboys history shows that the 22nd pick hasnt been lucky, and if you loook at the drafts above us in recent years, emmitt smith was taken with the 17th pick, warren sapp was taken 17th, shawn andrews was taken 16th, where the eagles traded above us to take him,and all reports showed that Parcells wanted Andrews. Then, later in draft years, Vince Wolfolk was taken with the 21st pick, and what did we do then, we traded out of the first round.

So, I say if we can trade up if need be, go get that quality player, but history says you dont have to trade up high, just from the 16th pick to the 21st pick range. Then, trade down with our 28th pick if a big name player isnt there, but the cowboys know we can get just as good a player in the high 2nd round, trade down with someone like Atlanta that may want a QB, get their 2nd, 3rd and 5th to 6th rounder. Someone showed on a post, we give up our 1st ronder 28th for 2 of Atlantas high 2nd, plus we give up our 2nd 61st pick. I dont like that ideal, Id rather have 2nd, 3rd and 5th to 6th possibly a future pick from atlanta.

Then, on top of that, i am not sure how you guys feel about Akin Odoyle, but I say trade him too, you might get a 3rd rounder, and he once played for Smith, now head coach of atlanta. And Smith is a defensive guy.

Then, we can make that trade if the rumors are true, a trade for Chad Johnson or Roy Williams or Cardinals other WR Bouldin. WE DO NEED AN IMPACT OTHER WR, AND YOU WONT GET ONE IN THIS DRAFT. NOT AN IMPACT WR. DONT GET ME WRONG I LIKE SWEED IN SOME WAYS, BUT HIS WRIST WORRIES ME. YOU CANT TAKE CHANCE WITH THOSE 2 NUMBER ONE PICKS.

I am going by what tony romo said, that glenn, whom i loved as a player, his grit, toughness, etc, said that glenn couldnt cut, and we all saw that in the playoff game, which would make it seem he couldnt cut till more surgery, and everyone said, his next surgery would end his career most likely. So, we do need an impact veteran wr, granted we have Stanback, but we cant count on a player that really hasnt played WR, and he had some injury problems last year.

Granted, i love stanback, and i met him at san antonio, but we need a vet wr opposite T O. WE ALL SAW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE COWBOYS LAST YEAR, WHEN T O WENT DOWN, AND CRAYTON IS JUST A # 3 WR, NOT A 2ND OR 1ST, HE JUST DOESNT HAVE THE SPEED.

So, if we do those things, go get pacman, which then we dont have to pick for need, but with the 22nd pick, take best player available, trade down with 28th pick, if a super player isnt there, get extra picks from someone like atlanta, trade for chad johnson or roy williams or bouldin, get good quality players in the draft, not quanity, maybe even use some of our 2009 draft picks to get such players if need be. Remember now, Jerry Jones said, that he realized that you cant get good players in low rounds in 1st round, that you may have to package your picks to get such players to move up, not down so much.

THIS TEAM DOESNT NEED TO MUCH, BUT IN MY MIND WE NEED IMPACT PLAYERS, AND PACMAN ALONG WITH BOULDIN OR CHAD JOHNSON OR ROY WILLIAMS WILL BE A STEP IN THAT DIRECTION. ALONG WITH OUR DRAFT PICKS.
 

theebs

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Then, on top of that, i am not sure how you guys feel about Akin Odoyle, but I say trade him too, you might get a 3rd rounder, and he once played for Smith, now head coach of atlanta. And Smith is a defensive guy.

O'doyle rules!!!!

image_01.jpg


just kidding that made me laugh..
 

Arch Stanton

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InmanRoshi;2008951 said:
Pac Man should have no impact on the Cowboys draft. Building your draft around a player who is one more stupid strip club incident away from a lifetime banishment from the NFL (and who has seemingly no reservations or apologies about attending the establishments in the future) is amazingly dumb and short sighted. If Jerry wants to take the PR hit of adding him on a flier that's one thing, but to depend on him, to build around him, to make him a center piece of the puzzle is stupid.


:hammer:
 

FLcowboy

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wayne motley;2009142 said:
JJ says "don't rule out Glenn" and you stop reading because I write "IF Glenn is really done"....the IF is the key factor.

I would be thrilled if Terry Glenn returned to his form of 2 seasons ago, but "don't rule him out" doesn't tell us anything...Glenn is a huge question mark for being healthy at the start of the season and just as big a question mark on staying healthy.

I don't believe Glenn's situation will have anything to do with our making a deal or drafting a WR...getting a WR is just like getting Pacman in this case...it's all about insurance and hedging your bets.

Terry Glenn is one twisted knee from IR. While Crayton played okay in his stead last year, nobody stepped up to take Crayton's place. The Cowboys need some good depth on offense. They don't have it now.
 
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