Kenneth Murray: The Most Beautifullest Film Study

fivetwos

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If the board came down to WR or LB I’m taking the defensive player whether it be Murray, Baun, et cetera.
I would consider taking Baun over one of the WRs, not Murray.

Trust me, I want defense with ever pick if possible, but those 3WR are special players.

Dont forget how status quo on offense looks great on paper, but beat up on some bad teams. It could use another dynamic to get it done vs good teams on the road.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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I would consider taking Baun over one of the WRs, not Murray.

Trust me, I want defense with ever pick if possible, but those 3WR are special players.

Dont forget how status quo on offense looks great on paper, but beat up on some bad teams. It could use another dynamic to get it done vs good teams on the road.

Yeah, but the quality of depth at WR to at least the 4th round. LB is not deep this year.
 

Sydla

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If the board came down to WR or LB I’m taking the defensive player whether it be Murray, Baun, et cetera.

Maybe Ruggs but if Lamb or Jeudy somehow is sitting there at 17, I wouldn't pass either of them for Murray or Baun.

And I am OK with taking Murray.
 

fivetwos

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Yeah, but the quality of depth at WR to at least the 4th round. LB is not deep this year.
I think we can agree that a WR at 17 is far from ideal, and we need defensive players in a bad way.

I do think that a guy like Ruggs in the slot on this offense could take it to another level.

I cant leave him on the board and take a lesser player because of the needs on defense. I think that's where trouble begins. Take the best guy.

Now, hopefully it works out where the clear best player left plays defense. As I said in another thread, I'm warming up to Baun being the pick. Seems more versatile than Chiasson with a lower floor.
 

xwalker

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If you find 2 or 3, it means it happens dozens of times. And no, you're wrong about both scheme and DL
This is simply missing his gap assignment:

Simply a blown coverage

Lack of reading keys

These are all the result of lack of vision/feel and have nothing to do with what the rest of the defense is doing. He is quite literally playing freely here.


I agree that his instincts are a big concern and might be "bad"; however, I don't agree that these videos prove anything.

In fact after analyzing these videos and thinking through what his assignments likely were in that scheme, the videos actually make me feel better about his instincts...

Video 1:
He needs to get outside the lead blocker #86. He does over-run the play but he is not a full gap over. I would call that more bad technique than lack of instincts. He saw the RB going inside but he couldn't stop his momentum due to poor body position when moving laterally. I'm certain he was coached to error on the side on not getting boxed inside on that type of play. If he got boxed inside he would definitely be in the wrong gap.

Video 2:
The receiver he is covering is attempting to pick the other defender coming across from the opposite direction. The DB behind him reads it as going to the other crossing receiver and that DB comes from all the way over from where the pass ended up being completed to the opposite side to cover the crossing receiver that didn't end up with the ball. I think coaches would want that DB to stay in place and would want Murray to pick up the other receiver if he definitely sees the other crossing defender get picked.

Video 3:
The DB lined up inside the slot WR (defensive right) blitzes and Murray moves over to pick up coverage on the slot WR. There are 2 DB deep to the defensive right but the one to the inside that would have to cover the slot WR is Murray didn't, stayed back and then took a horrible angle to get across the field.
 

Future

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Let me help you.

Every player has negative tape.
Every player has reps they lose. Not ever player has tape in which the problem is a) the same and b) not physical. You can coach technique, you can't coach vision/instinct.
 

xwalker

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Y’all know I’ve been advocating for this dude. Zero problems with at #17 if the board is right.



What is your analysis of these 3 video from Mosher?

I do not think these videos show a problem with instincts.

The 2nd video is the most interesting. I just don't see a scheme that has the DB in the outside left of the defense being required to come all the way across and up as a help defender when there is a receiver already coming directly into his area.

If Murray really is delayed due to awareness of the other crossing defender possibly being picked, then that would show "2nd level" type thinking on Murray's part as opposed to just being coached to run and hit.





 

cnuball21

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And yet you’re defining him based on the negative.

How are you not recognizing that?

Do you think bad tape doesn’t exist of Baun (or name your favorite player)?

I love some of Murray’s strengths and every prospect has weaknesses. Depending on the position and where you’re drafting the player the weaknesses become more important.

For an off the ball LB we’re talking about in the top 20, being slow to diagnose and questions about instincts terrify me.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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Every player has reps they lose. Not ever player has tape in which the problem is a) the same and b) not physical. You can coach technique, you can't coach vision/instinct.

So you think that because some guy in his mom’s basement decided he didn’t have the time to put together clips of all the negative plays a particular player was involved in that somehow means those plays never happened?

Highlight videos by there very definition are much easier to put together than sifting through game film looking for negative plays.

You obviously didn’t watch the video I posted that analyzed Murray in terms of instincts and anticipation.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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I love some of Murray’s strengths and every prospect has weaknesses. Depending on the position and where you’re drafting the player the weaknesses become more important.

For an off the ball LB we’re talking about in the top 20, being slow to diagnose and questions about instincts terrify me.

So you didn’t watch the clip did you?

Because if he’s put plays where he’s shown and anticipation/instincts on tape then it means he has those traits.

Negative plays happen. Every player has them if you parse through each game.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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Or it means it happened 2 or 3 times. You're speculating wildly.

Exactly.

He also seems to think if you see 2 or 3 bad plays then that means there are a dozen more of those plays, yet he doesn’t believe that’s the case when you see 2 or 3 good plays.

Rock-solid logic.
 

Future

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So you think that because some guy in his mom’s basement decided he didn’t have the time to put together clips of all the negative plays a particular player was involved in that somehow means those plays never happened?

Highlight videos by there very definition are much easier to put together than sifting through game film looking for negative plays.

You obviously didn’t watch the video I posted that analyzed Murray in terms of instincts and anticipation.
Their* smart guy.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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No, it doesn't. It is a common critique of Murray.

Just so folks know Future is the same guy that claimed Donovan Wilson sucked based on one (1) snap in Week 11 (Wilson’s only snap that game).

That’s not an exaggeration.
 

Future

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Just so folks know Future is the same guy that claimed Donovan Wilson sucked based on one (1) snap in Week 11 (Wilson’s only snap that game).

That’s not an exaggeration.
Not what I said.

I said he had done nothing to earn more playing time.
 

CalPolyTechnique

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Not what I said.

I said he had done nothing to earn more playing time.

So you’re lying now.

F59-C1-EBE-02-AA-446-E-BF80-01-AA204-C815-E.jpg
 

Future

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Oh, so you’ve been reading a lot?
Late to diagnose between the tackles with the bad habit of taking the cheese - Brugler

Needs to temper urgency with additional patience
Misdirected out of position multiple times by same play against Kansas State
Instincts and fit recognition are spotty as inside linebacker
Desire to make plays clouds judgment on angles - Zierlein

It's not made up that his vision/feel isn't great.
 
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