Kiper Mock 4.0 4/13/21

[speedkilz88]

If the Patriots were trading up for a QB then giving up only a future 1st is actually them getting the pick cheap. When trading up for QBs teams usually have to pay a premium (basically out of desperation). At minimum they should have to give their 2nd this year as well and some would expect them to throw the 3rd or 4th in as well.

 

[speedkilz88]

I think that it's pretty straight forward. If the Cowboys don't feel that there is a huge difference between Surtain and Horn, it makes great sense to make that trade and get an additional 2021 1st rounder.

But nothing is guaranteed, especially Horn still being there 5 picks later. And if he's gone, then you run the risk of being in no man's land at 15 without a player worthy of that slot that you truly covet.

If you make the deal you probably get Horn, but the team would at least need to be comfortable picking up Farley JOK or Barmore instead if he's gone.

 

[Cowboyny]

Patriots rarely trade up, with little draft capital this yr, even less of a chance. Bellicheck isn't going to force getting a QB, he will allow the draft to come to him. Probably will see them take a QB in a later rd. Chicago and Washington are the two teams looking to make a deal, where Chicago might be desperate. If we move back to 20, I want at least their 2nd & 3rd, but we maybe able to get a future one with a pick this yr.

 

[baltcowboy]

Predicting the draft seems to be more like Madame Cleo's work than something tangible. So Kiper digs and digs then comes out looking foolish more often than not.

However, this is his proposition. I'm certain you've heard it since this is not late breaking.

Dallas moves to 15 in a trade with the Patriots.
Dallas gets 15 and the Patriots next year's number one pick.

By the mysterious chart that gives a quantitative assignment to make since out of trades, this looks like the Patriots over pay for their QB.

It it suggested in an article, link posted below, that Jaycee Horn will be there for Dallas at 15. So the second best corner, as people imply, will be on the board through the picks of the Giants and Eagles.

I see no logic in this trade. At first blush you see a first round pick. But what does that do this year? It also assumes the Chargers and the Vikings would not be interested in Horn.

With the cap structure still up in the air until 2023, and the big contracts this team has on the horizon growing in 2022. I just fail to see the advantage this gives Dallas.

Opinions?

Yes, I know. Kiper is an idiot. Save your breath.

THis seems like a fan run site.

https://atozsportsdallas.com/dallas...WiKVJ--YEJkNmqPGWrMlTlBCuwO6AbylzQo2souqsFUcs

I don’t know where this trading with Cowboys is coming from. If you want one of the top 5 quarterbacks you will have to get in front of Denver at 9. Rumors are Atlanta and Carolina would like to trade their picks in the top 10 to a quarterback needy team so they can get multiple draft selections. The WFT think they are a quarterback away from making a deep run in the playoffs and the Bears are desperate because you are not winning anything with Andy “Dandy” as a full time starter. The Cowboys have 10 picks and looking at Dane’s recent draft he picked 5 guys that could impact the roster this season and solidify are secondary without any trades. For us to trade you gonna have to come up with a deal the Joneses cannot refuse.

 

[cheyennes]

Patriots want a Qb, second or thirth this year and a first 2022

 

[ErikWilliamsHeadSlap]

Patriots rarely trade up, with little draft capital this yr, even less of a chance. Bellicheck isn't going to force getting a QB, he will allow the draft to come to him. Probably will see them take a QB in a later rd. Chicago and Washington are the two teams looking to make a deal, where Chicago might be desperate. If we move back to 20, I want at least their 2nd & 3rd, but we maybe able to get a future one with a pick this yr.

Even Robert Kraft has stated what they have been doing in the draft isn't working and they will try a new approach. That is why they spent so much in F.A. So the Pats trading up is a distinct possibility. And if you saw Cam Newton play last year you would be more surprised. if they didn't try to trade up and grab a QB. Cam was downright embarrassing.

 

[Zekeats]

I think that it's pretty straight forward. If the Cowboys don't feel that there is a huge difference between Surtain and Horn, it makes great sense to make that trade and get an additional 2021 1st rounder.

But nothing is guaranteed, especially Horn still being there 5 picks later. And if he's gone, then you run the risk of being in no man's land at 15 without a player worthy of that slot that you truly covet.

Barmore is worthy of the pic at 15

 

[Stash]

Barmore is worthy of the pic at 15

I respectfully disagree.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Predicting the draft seems to be more like Madame Cleo's work than something tangible. So Kiper digs and digs then comes out looking foolish more often than not.

However, this is his proposition. I'm certain you've heard it since this is not late breaking.

Dallas moves to 15 in a trade with the Patriots.
Dallas gets 15 and the Patriots next year's number one pick.

By the mysterious chart that gives a quantitative assignment to make since out of trades, this looks like the Patriots over pay for their QB.

It it suggested in an article, link posted below, that Jaycee Horn will be there for Dallas at 15. So the second best corner, as people imply, will be on the board through the picks of the Giants and Eagles.

I see no logic in this trade. At first blush you see a first round pick. But what does that do this year? It also assumes the Chargers and the Vikings would not be interested in Horn.

With the cap structure still up in the air until 2023, and the big contracts this team has on the horizon growing in 2022. I just fail to see the advantage this gives Dallas.

Opinions?

Yes, I know. Kiper is an idiot. Save your breath.

THis seems like a fan run site.

https://atozsportsdallas.com/dallas...WiKVJ--YEJkNmqPGWrMlTlBCuwO6AbylzQo2souqsFUcs

This would be the absolute #1 scenario. To get an extra 1st round to trade down 5 spots and STILL get Horn would be incredible.

Waiting another year to cash in means little. Next year with two first rounders would be incredible.

 

[jterrell]

This is a good move imo and I love Surtain like fat kids love cake.

You get QB value in that trade down and I am all about it. The Pats are not very good and with a rookie QB likely get worse not better.
Chance to be a really solid pick in 2022.

IF they did this I'd def want to see them be aggressive move up from 44 with some of the depth picks.

 

[jterrell]

I don’t know where this trading with Cowboys is coming from. If you want one of the top 5 quarterbacks you will have to get in front of Denver at 9. Rumors are Atlanta and Carolina would like to trade their picks in the top 10 to a quarterback needy team so they can get multiple draft selections. The WFT think they are a quarterback away from making a deep run in the playoffs and the Bears are desperate because you are not winning anything with Andy “Dandy” as a full time starter. The Cowboys have 10 picks and looking at Dane’s recent draft he picked 5 guys that could impact the roster this season and solidify are secondary without any trades. For us to trade you gonna have to come up with a deal the Joneses cannot refuse.

CHI/NE and others want to move up for a QB.
They can only go so far given the trade capital they are working with. They can't get to say 4. Just too costly.

Teams like Philly that moved down see a lot of guys coming off the boards so even when out on a QB you don't want to fall too far.
A trade at 10 was always going to be likely if a QB was there and it is a pretty fair chance the 5th one will be.
DEN needs talent. They could move down or they could just go get a really good player. But they will also be in that discussion with us as a move up target.

 

[Zekeats]

I respectfully disagree.

I’ll tell you this. If this team spent all of its picks on the defensive and offensive line in this draft it would be the best upgrade possible for next season.

 

[Stash]

I’ll tell you this. If this team spent all of its picks on the defensive and offensive line in this draft it would be the best upgrade possible for next season.

I don’t know if you’ve seen my morning mock thread but I do quite a bit of that.

 

[JD_KaPow]

If the Patriots were trading up for a QB then giving up only a future 1st is actually them getting the pick cheap. When trading up for QBs teams usually have to pay a premium (basically out of desperation). At minimum they should have to give their 2nd this year as well and some would expect them to throw the 3rd or 4th in as well.

That's not accurate, in a couple ways.

1. Teams don't pay a premium to trade up outside of the #1 and #2 picks. You can look at historical trades and see that nobody is paying a substantial premium to move up to the 10 range even for a QB. (Teams trading up generally do pay a slight premium, but no more than a few percent.)
2. A 2022 1st-rounder is already a substantial overpay for moving from #15 to #10. By the traditional chart, it's an overpay of around 10-15%, which teams simply don't do. It's more likely that the Cowboys would have to give something to the Patriots to balance it than the other way around.

You know what? I'm wrong. There's one example of an overpay like this, and it involves a QB and #10. The Chiefs gave 22, 27 and 91 for #10 (Mahomes), which by the chart is a big overpay. So maybe we could get the Pats' 2022 1st-rounder straight up. That would be a really nice trade.

 

[john van brocklin]

Predicting the draft seems to be more like Madame Cleo's work than something tangible. So Kiper digs and digs then comes out looking foolish more often than not.

However, this is his proposition. I'm certain you've heard it since this is not late breaking.

Dallas moves to 15 in a trade with the Patriots.
Dallas gets 15 and the Patriots next year's number one pick.

By the mysterious chart that gives a quantitative assignment to make since out of trades, this looks like the Patriots over pay for their QB.

It it suggested in an article, link posted below, that Jaycee Horn will be there for Dallas at 15. So the second best corner, as people imply, will be on the board through the picks of the Giants and Eagles.

I see no logic in this trade. At first blush you see a first round pick. But what does that do this year? It also assumes the Chargers and the Vikings would not be interested in Horn.

With the cap structure still up in the air until 2023, and the big contracts this team has on the horizon growing in 2022. I just fail to see the advantage this gives Dallas.

Opinions?

Yes, I know. Kiper is an idiot. Save your breath.

THis seems like a fan run site.

https://atozsportsdallas.com/dallas...WiKVJ--YEJkNmqPGWrMlTlBCuwO6AbylzQo2souqsFUcs

Like all mocks with trade downs.

 

[DFWJC]

Predicting the draft seems to be more like Madame Cleo's work than something tangible. So Kiper digs and digs then comes out looking foolish more often than not.

However, this is his proposition. I'm certain you've heard it since this is not late breaking.

Dallas moves to 15 in a trade with the Patriots.
Dallas gets 15 and the Patriots next year's number one pick.

By the mysterious chart that gives a quantitative assignment to make since out of trades, this looks like the Patriots over pay for their QB.

It it suggested in an article, link posted below, that Jaycee Horn will be there for Dallas at 15. So the second best corner, as people imply, will be on the board through the picks of the Giants and Eagles.

I see no logic in this trade. At first blush you see a first round pick. But what does that do this year? It also assumes the Chargers and the Vikings would not be interested in Horn.

With the cap structure still up in the air until 2023, and the big contracts this team has on the horizon growing in 2022. I just fail to see the advantage this gives Dallas.

Opinions?

Yes, I know. Kiper is an idiot. Save your breath.

THis seems like a fan run site.

https://atozsportsdallas.com/dallas...WiKVJ--YEJkNmqPGWrMlTlBCuwO6AbylzQo2souqsFUcs

Correct
In this mock, the Pats do overpay and there really is mo way Belichick would do it
But whatever....just a mock

Anyhow, aNew England trade with Dallas is not out of the question, only the terms of that trade in Kiper’s mock

 

[CATCH17]

I think that it's pretty straight forward. If the Cowboys don't feel that there is a huge difference between Surtain and Horn, it makes great sense to make that trade and get an additional 2021 1st rounder.

But nothing is guaranteed, especially Horn still being there 5 picks later. And if he's gone, then you run the risk of being in no man's land at 15 without a player worthy of that slot that you truly covet.

Draft Jaelen Phillips and improve the defense more than Horn or Surtain could.

 

[Stash]

Draft Jaelen Phillips and improve the defense more than Horn or Surtain could.

Or watch an oft-injured, once ‘retired’ player get hurt once again. And potentially leave football for good this time. There’s that too.

 

[reddyuta]

It really unfortunate there is not a great DT prospect when we have a top 10 pick.

 

[CouchCoach]

If this doesn't happen prior to the draft, the Pats have to sweat another team, like WFT jumping them for a QB. Odds are the NYG, PHL, LAC, and MIN are not going QB but they would trade down.

Is there a real appreciable difference between what DAL can get at 10 and 15? This ignores the possibility that Sewell or Pitts could fall to 10 but that seems remote.

Do they have Surtain, Horn, Slater, Parsons and a couple of others graded so closely that the drop to 15 isn't a concern?

Is Belichick comfortable with giving up his 1st in 2022 and taking the 5th QB? And it makes a difference if that QB is Jones or Lance. Lance is the future QB pick of the 5 in this draft.