La el Collins RT / OG

[xwalker]

So you think he will either be starting LG or the swing tackle?

The issue is that as a rookie he needs to concentrate on one or the other position. They need to decide early in training camp which position it will be. Leary is an established quality starter. Bernadeau is an established backup. They have no established backup OT and the starter (Free) can't even practice as of today due to ankle surgery. I can see whoever wins the Swing Tackle job ending up as the starting RT very easily considering that Free had ankle surgeries in both Jan 2014 and Jan 2015 and missed about 1/2 of last season.

I just don't see much advantage with Collins over Leary when Collins is a rookie, if any. Eventually, he could be better, but as a rookie it seems like break even at best. On the flip side, Green or Weems as the Swing Tackle and possible starter at RT is a big concern to me. Collins represents a significant upgrade over those guys.

 

[BAZ]

Man Leary had a great season last year and has shown improvement every go round, just throwing him on the scrap heap in a contract year is doing him dirty. I think Free and Leary should have their jobs going into game one and Dallas should see how injuries play out.

 

[RastaRocket]

Possible 4 All-Pro OL on Dallas next year= TOTALLY AWESOME!!!

I wouldn't expect Collins to make all-pro in year one. We got spoiled with Martin. Maybe Frederick gets all-pro this year.

 

[RastaRocket]

Man Leary had a great season last year and has shown improvement every go round, just throwing him on the scrap heap in a contract year is doing him dirty. I think Free and Leary should have their jobs going into game one and Dallas should see how injuries play out.

Start the best 5 guys, whoever that turns out to be.

 

[AsthmaField]

The issue is that as a rookie he needs to concentrate on one or the other position. They need to decide early in training camp which position it will be. Leary is an established quality starter. Bernadeau is an established backup. They have no established backup OT and the starter (Free) can't even practice as of today due to ankle surgery. I can see whoever wins the Swing Tackle job ending up as the starting RT very easily considering that Free had ankle surgeries in both Jan 2014 and Jan 2015 and missed about 1/2 of last season.

I just don't see much advantage with Collins over Leary when Collins is a rookie, if any. Eventually, he could be better, but as a rookie it seems like break even at best. On the flip side, Green or Weems as the Swing Tackle and possible starter at RT is a big concern to me. Collins represents a significant upgrade over those guys.

Cool thanks. You and I just disagree a little here (typically we seem to see things the same way).

I think that Collins is a fairly significant upgrade over Leary, pretty much from the start. You could be correct but I just think he is a much better player with much better skills than Leary (who I like BTW).

As far as him needing to settle in at one spot, I don't disagree with that. I think they will try him at both but will decide which way they want to go pretty quickly. Just like the Britt Efe. They tried him at TE day 1 and then said he's a DE and put him there for the duration. They likely will do the same thing with Collins.

I wouldn't mind seeing Collins at RT, and you're correct that it might be best to have Smith/Leary/Frederick/Martin/Collins long term. However, right now I think Smith/Collins/Frederick/Martin/Free would be the best line this year.

IMO Free is going to play this year, period. I don't think the team has any intention of getting him on the bench in 2015. And speaking for myself, I want to see Collins starting this year because he's just too damn good to sit. The best way to get him on the field (assuming I'm correct about Free) is at LG.

I don't think it matters too much that Collins has always been on the left side, but it doesn't hurt to leave him on his natural side either. The fact that he played a season at LG only serves to reinforce the idea of letting him compete against Leary.

Also, you seem to have an innate dislike for Free that I don't have, so that, IMO is coloring your decision as well. We all have those type of things too so I'm not blaming you for that. I haven't noticed you being that way about anyone but Free, so you probably have less of those disliked players than most here.

 

[erod]

To me it come down to him either competing with Leary or competing with Green/Weems. He should be able to beat out Green/Weems despite having to switch sides.

Many scouts considered him the best offensive lineman in the draft and a better prospect than what Martin was.

He's far more than a swing tackle. He's starting, it's just a matter of where.

 

[xwalker]

Cool thanks. You and I just disagree a little here (typically we seem to see things the same way).

I think that Collins is a fairly significant upgrade over Leary, pretty much from the start. You could be correct but I just think he is a much better player with much better skills than Leary (who I like BTW).

As far as him needing to settle in at one spot, I don't disagree with that. I think they will try him at both but will decide which way they want to go pretty quickly. Just like the Britt Efe. They tried him at TE day 1 and then said he's a DE and put him there for the duration. They likely will do the same thing with Collins.

I wouldn't mind seeing Collins at RT, and you're correct that it might be best to have Smith/Leary/Frederick/Martin/Collins long term. However, right now I think Smith/Collins/Frederick/Martin/Free would be the best line this year.

IMO Free is going to play this year, period. I don't think the team has any intention of getting him on the bench in 2015. And speaking for myself, I want to see Collins starting this year because he's just too damn good to sit. The best way to get him on the field (assuming I'm correct about Free) is at LG.

I don't think it matters too much that Collins has always been on the left side, but it doesn't hurt to leave him on his natural side either. The fact that he played a season at LG only serves to reinforce the idea of letting him compete against Leary.

Also, you seem to have an innate dislike for Free that I don't have, so that, IMO is coloring your decision as well. We all have those type of things too so I'm not blaming you for that. I haven't noticed you being that way about anyone but Free, so you probably have less of those disliked players than most here.

I expect Free to be the starter if healthy. The issue that they don't have a backup as of right now.

I would train Collins as the swing tackle, playing primarily at RT in training camp. If Free is perfectly healthy, then I would let Collins practice at Guard during the season and start giving him a few snaps per Game at Left Guard and maybe a lot of snaps in any blowout games.

If Green or Weems look spectacular at OT, then I would move Collins to LG in training camp, but then and only then.

The other issue is that if Collins trains at Guard, then the loser between him and Leary won't even be active on game day because the interior backup has to be able to play Center. That would result in a game day lineup of Green or Weems active with Collins or Leary inactive.

 

[erod]

the clock is ticking on Free and everyone knows it. Getting his successor up and running should be the number one OL concern. Closely followed by making sure we have a good swing tackle.

Imagine if Chaz Green pans out in a couple of years.

Man Leary had a great season last year and has shown improvement every go round, just throwing him on the scrap heap in a contract year is doing him dirty. I think Free and Leary should have their jobs going into game one and Dallas should see how injuries play out.

You hit the nail on the head. SOMEBODY is probably going to get hurt. The great news is, the Cowboys can absorb it even better than last year now.

 

[CashMan]

But Collins could also fit RT better than Martin could.

Why though?

 

[erod]

I expect Free to be the starter if healthy. The issue that they don't have a backup as of right now.

I would train Collins as the swing tackle, playing primarily at RT in training camp. If Free is perfectly healthy, then I would let Collins practice at Guard during the season and start giving him a few snaps per Game at Left Guard and maybe a lot of snaps in any blowout games.

If Green or Weems look spectacular at OT, then I would move Collins to LG in training camp, but then and only then.

The other issue is that if Collins trains at Guard, then the loser between him and Leary won't even be active on game day because the interior backup has to be able to play Center. That would result in a game day lineup of Green or Weems active with Collins or Leary inactive.

Collins will be one of the best five. He's a bigger, quicker version of Zack Martin.

 

[xwalker]

Many scouts considered him the best offensive lineman in the draft and a better prospect than what Martin was.

He's far more than a swing tackle. He's starting, it's just a matter of where.

That's an over-simplification of the issue. Obviously he will eventually be a starter. Even Erik Williams was not a full time starter as a rookie.

The issue is that the Cowboys could be in big trouble if they have Collins starting at LG and Green or Weems can't handle being the backup OT. On the flip side, if the have Collins training at OT and he does not beat out Free for game 1, then they still have lowered the risk with Collins as as the backup OT over Green/Weems.

 

[erod]

That's an over-simplification of the issue. Obviously he will eventually be a starter. Even Erik Williams was not a full time starter as a rookie.

The issue is that the Cowboys could be in big trouble if they have Collins starting at LG and Green or Weems can't handle being the backup OT. On the flip side, if the have Collins training at OT and he does not beat out Free for game 1, then they still have lowered the risk with Collins as as the backup OT over Green/Weems.

Collins can start and also be the swing tackle. So can Zack Martin. Both are better than Weems/Green at tackle already.

 

[xwalker]

Why though?

Bigger wingspan.

Martin would have one of if not the smallest wingspans of any starting OT in the NFL. Wingspan is not just arm length. Martin had slightly longer arms than Pugh of the Giants but his wingspan was smaller. It does not guarantee that Collins would be better at OT than Martin, but Collins is much closer to the Center of the Bell Curve of OT measurable(s) than Martin.

 

[speedkilz88]

Why though?

There were questions on Zach playing RT. Short arms/smaller wingspan and he's not considered the road grader that Collins is.

 

[Stash]

Collins will be the left guard for years to come, Gibson and Green will be battling for the future at right tackle/swing tackle, not Collins

This is how I see it too. I think they will initially start Collins out at LG. And unless Green flames out and Free struggles to return from surgery, I think he stays there for 2016. Collins might get some practice time at RT for the long term, but I think he's a guard for this year.

 

[texbumthelife]

Collins can start and also be the swing tackle. So can Zack Martin. Both are better than Weems/Green at tackle already.

Kind of my thinking. He has already spent significant time at OT. Why not let him split time in camp. Since he probably won't be asked to start at either position initially, there is no rush.

 

[AsthmaField]

I expect Free to be the starter if healthy. The issue that they don't have a backup as of right now.

I would train Collins as the swing tackle, playing primarily at RT in training camp. If Free is perfectly healthy, then I would let Collins practice at Guard during the season and start giving him a few snaps per Game at Left Guard and maybe a lot of snaps in any blowout games.

If Green or Weems look spectacular at OT, then I would move Collins to LG in training camp, but then and only then.

The other issue is that if Collins trains at Guard, then the loser between him and Leary won't even be active on game day because the interior backup has to be able to play Center. That would result in a game day lineup of Green or Weems active with Collins or Leary inactive.

I understand and there are probably a dozen different ways they can incorporate the guy into the line. Will be interesting to see what they do.

I do think that Collins is a day one starter just like Martin was though. If he shows in camp like Martin did last year, they'll start him IMO.

However, I do like the idea of letting him get a few snaps per game and working his way into the lineup over the first few games of the season.

The only bad thing about this is that I really do like Leary quite a bit.

Maybe they will work Leary some at center and if he's ok there let him be the guard/center backup and let Green be the swing tackle on game days.

 

[speedkilz88]

• • Zack Martin
    
  • 6'4" Height
  • 32 7/8" Arm Length
  • 308LBS. Weight
  • 9 1/2" Hands
  • Bottom Line
    Athletic, smart, competitive, dependable college left tackle whose length dictates a move inside, where he has plug-and-play ability in a zone-blocking scheme. One of the cleanest prospects in this year's draft.
  
  
• La'el Collins
  
• 6'4" Height
• 33 1/4" Arm Length
• 305LBS. Weight
• 10 3/8" Hands
• Bottom Line
  Brawling right tackle or guard prospect in the NFL who has had a level of success in hyper-competitive SEC West. Lacks athleticism to be a consistent left tackle, despite his snaps there in college. Collins plays with a mean streak that is evident in every game, and could come in and start right away in a power-running game as a guard. Collins has a first-round grade, but with the ongoing investigation into the death of his ex-girlfriend Mills unresolved at the time of the draft, no one would be surprised if he went undrafted.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/profiles/zack-martin?id=2543480
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/la'el-collins?id=2552361

 

[xwalker]

Collins can start and also be the swing tackle. So can Zack Martin. Both are better than Weems/Green at tackle already.

Collins has not played the Right Side. He needs practice reps there if he if going to be considered for the Swing Tackle position. As a rookie he needs to focus on Guard or Tackle in training camp.

If he is that great, then he should be able to push Free for the starting position.

IMO, they only have Collins focus on Guard if Weem/Green look spectacular OR they have Martin train as the backup OT in training camp. I'm certain that will have Martin cross train at a 2nd position, but I would prefer to see him become the backup Center option. If Martin could serve as the game-day backup Center, then Bernadeau could be inactive which would allow them to have Leary, Collins and Green/Weems active.

 

[Stash]

Cool thanks. You and I just disagree a little here (typically we seem to see things the same way).

I think that Collins is a fairly significant upgrade over Leary, pretty much from the start. You could be correct but I just think he is a much better player with much better skills than Leary (who I like BTW).

As far as him needing to settle in at one spot, I don't disagree with that. I think they will try him at both but will decide which way they want to go pretty quickly. Just like the Britt Efe. They tried him at TE day 1 and then said he's a DE and put him there for the duration. They likely will do the same thing with Collins.

I wouldn't mind seeing Collins at RT, and you're correct that it might be best to have Smith/Leary/Frederick/Martin/Collins long term. However, right now I think Smith/Collins/Frederick/Martin/Free would be the best line this year.

IMO Free is going to play this year, period. I don't think the team has any intention of getting him on the bench in 2015. And speaking for myself, I want to see Collins starting this year because he's just too damn good to sit. The best way to get him on the field (assuming I'm correct about Free) is at LG.

I don't think it matters too much that Collins has always been on the left side, but it doesn't hurt to leave him on his natural side either. The fact that he played a season at LG only serves to reinforce the idea of letting him compete against Leary.

Also, you seem to have an innate dislike for Free that I don't have, so that, IMO is coloring your decision as well. We all have those type of things too so I'm not blaming you for that. I haven't noticed you being that way about anyone but Free, so you probably have less of those disliked players than most here.

I completely agree with you all around on this one.

And I've seen reports that said, while Collins did play some RT at the bowl game practices, it was obvious that he had no experience there. So while he didn't look terrible, he didn't look comfortable either.