Late Rounds-6th and 7th Theories

[Miller]

Was just reading a story on how we conduct our 6th and 7th rounds and I'm a little...miffed. And if you disagree with me...I'm fine with it. I think it's a conversation that can go many ways. I just look at what some teams seem to do in late rounds and it seems they are still trying to fill needs while we go flyer/FA route. Here is quote from article

http://sportsday.***BANNED-URL***/d...5/03/cowboys-explain-plan-4-sixth-round-picks

Executive vice president Stephen Jones said the first two picks, Brown and Frazier, were players the Cowboys had given fourth-round grades.

"A lot of teams have different philosophies in different rounds in the NFL," Cowboys head coach Jason Garrett explained after the draft. "Our philosophy typically in the sixth and seventh round is you want to try and draft a more developmental-type player. He might not have all the skills right now to step in and play, but he is someone, with coaching, you feel like can develop into something that you really want. Sometimes, you take a shot on a guy late.

"In a lot of these cases, you buttress the sixth and seventh round up against free agency and you say, 'This guy is going to be hard to get in free agency, let's draft him, assure that we get this guy and we'll compete for someone else in free agency with some of the other teams.' You combine those things: developmental guy with high upside, you look for physical traits and then also the competition for the potential free agency situation that you might get into. Let's get the guy now rather than get into competition with other teams."

I just don't agree with that JG is talking about here. Pitt drafted late 6th and took Travis Feeney. OLB from Washington. Kid played pretty well his last year and someone who might make the team and could contribute as depth at LB. Denver takes S Will Parks who is athletic, plays well in the nickel and can compete for reps at a position of need. Why would we take a RB who is 4th-5th string and who MAY be practice squad. Rico is the same. Big time project at a position of no need right now. I get the intrigue of the next Gates but an OLB or S isn't worth more now? Am I the only one who feels this way or do you prefer projects? This isn't the old days where you are drafting in Rd 11.

 

[Common Sense]

Was just reading a story on how we conduct our 6th and 7th rounds and I'm a little...miffed. And if you disagree with me...I'm fine with it. I think it's a conversation that can go many ways. I just look at what some teams seem to do in late rounds and it seems they are still trying to fill needs while we go flyer/FA route. Here is quote from article

http://sportsday.***BANNED-URL***/d...5/03/cowboys-explain-plan-4-sixth-round-picks



I just don't agree with that JG is talking about here. Pitt drafted late 6th and took Travis Feeney. OLB from Washington. Kid played pretty well his last year and someone who might make the team and could contribute as depth at LB. Denver takes S Will Parks who is athletic, plays well in the nickel and can compete for reps at a position of need. Why would we take a RB who is 4th-5th string and who MAY be practice squad. Rico is the same. Big time project at a position of no need right now. I get the intrigue of the next Gates but an OLB or S isn't worth more now? Am I the only one who feels this way or do you prefer projects? This isn't the old days where you are drafting in Rd 11.

Thinking about free agency in the sixth round is pretty stupid, in my opinion. You should still be focusing on your board and drafting your highest rated players who might have slipped, not rounding out next year's practice squad. This is the same way they lost out on Thomas Rawls. They thought they could sign him as an UDFA, so they drafted a crappy tackle instead, even though Rawls was clearly the better player.

 

[Miller]

Thinking about free agency in the sixth round is pretty stupid, in my opinion. You should still be focusing on your board and drafting your highest rated players who might have slipped, not rounding out next year's practice squad. This is the same way they lost out on Thomas Rawls. They thought they could sign him as an UDFA, so they drafted a crappy tackle instead, even though Rawls was clearly the better player.

Right. I'd rather them say they honestly were looking at position of need vs BPA even and try and fill gaps. To me the mentality now just seems counter productive when it comes to finding talent that may actually play down the road.

 

[igtmfo]

Hey OP unfortunately if we are not Belli check or Scot Mccloughan or the kind of draft geniuses these days .. we ain't going to find them .. we haven't found them since the early Jimmy days when our scouts were so far ahead of others then we could find the Leon Letts in 9th round (?) etc .. those days are gone.

As of this morning there are 14 UDFAs signed or close to it .. they have a good a chance or hanging around awhile.

But on tryout for rookie minicamp next weekend (at least in 2014 we had about 15 guys just trying out in the rookie mini camp not even signed) who included 2015: Showers. 2014: Tyler Patmon. ..some other dudes like Chris Whaley that are still recovering from injury maybe maybe might make the team but pretty long shot but they were got in UDFA or tryout ..

Just the odds that you might get a Whitehead Heath etc. rather than the 3-7 round guys are pretty good because you might have 5-6 guys rounds 3-7 but another almost 30 guys coming in next weekend.

You have better odds finding guys in the UDFA/tryout pool of 25-30 than you do rounds 3-7 where this year you have 7 guys picked . Sad to say, but true

At least for the Cowboys.

Which gives me hope that there are some sleepers in there, and a few that will be in this weekend that we haven't heard of ..

 

[Craig]

Travis feeney is a converted safety that cant move anyone at all. Good luck to him as an olb in pittsburgh's 3-4. If he mKes that team it will be solely as a st guy...which is fine, because exactly like garrett is talking about, hell have to develop(specifically a ton of strength) in order to contribute in a few years.

The steelers pick is exactly what you are complaining about dallas doing.

Everyone at that point is developmental or they wouldnt have fallen.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Thinking about free agency in the sixth round is pretty stupid, in my opinion. You should still be focusing on your board and drafting your highest rated players who might have slipped, not rounding out next year's practice squad. This is the same way they lost out on Thomas Rawls. They thought they could sign him as an UDFA, so they drafted a crappy tackle instead, even though Rawls was clearly the better player.

Did you read the article?

Both of those guys allegedly had 4th round value on our board.

 

[Common Sense]

Did you read the article?

Both of those guys allegedly had 4th round value on our board.

We had four 6th rounders. The DB picks were fine. That's how you should draft in the late rounds, but the Rico Gathers type stuff that they always pull drives me crazy.

It's pretty obvious that I read the article since my comment was about the very last paragraph specifically.

 

[jjktkk]

I always like to reserve judgment until I see how the draft class and UDFA players look in minicamps and trainng camp. I feel the OP is unnecessarily overanalyzing the late picks. Most of these players have flaws, hence the reason they were dtafted in the later rounds. They're projects. I understand if you were mad because they did not draft a particular pet cat of yours, but like I said previously, why not wait and see how these prsoepcts looking this Summer.

 

[Miller]

I always like to reserve judgment until I see how the draft class and UDFA players look in minicamps and trainng camp. I feel the OP is unnecessarily overanalyzing the late picks. Most of these players have flaws, hence the reason they were dtafted in the later rounds. They're projects. I understand if you were mad because they did not draft a particular pet cat of yours, but like I said previously, why not wait and see how these prsoepcts looking this Summer.

Again, I specifically stated that I WELCOMED differing opinions and asked what people's thoughts are. My opinion is that there are guys that make teams from 5-7 yearly...Josh Norman by Carolina in 5th. There is no anger and none was expressed. The main point is that it might be better served to pick guys that are in the need category...S, LB, DT, DE..then a RB that will be lucky to sniff practice squad and a TE that's missed football since middle school. Simple. Thanks for thoughts

 

[waving monkey]

I love the Rico Gathers pick. he generated a lot of interest around the league.
Something like 25 teams showed for his work out. If he makes it thats really a
big deal in our two TE sets we try so hard to implement.
As mentioned up thread these rounds are generally developmental players.

 

[jjktkk]

Again, I specifically stated that I WELCOMED differing opinions and asked what people's thoughts are. My opinion is that there are guys that make teams from 5-7 yearly...Josh Norman by Carolina in 5th. There is no anger and none was expressed. The main point is that it might be better served to pick guys that are in the need category...S, LB, DT, DE..then a RB that will be lucky to sniff practice squad and a TE that's missed football since middle school. Simple. Thanks for thoughts

In a perfect world if would be great if you can find a pro bowl caliber player in the later rounds. But it's unrealistic to expect it. The later rounds are for taking chances on players deemed too small, too slow, or a project like Rico Gathers. Now I would say one later round pick, Kevon Fraiser, has a chance to compete for the SS job, maybe as soon as next year imo.

 

[Moderately_Askew]

Seems like a sound and reasonable way of drafting in the 6th and 7th rounds.

 

[casmith07]

6th/7th rounds are flyer rounds. It always cracks me up how angry people on message boards get about late round draft picks in a business where there are 53 jobs and they take 90 guys to be interviewed in the summer.

 

[Miller]

In a perfect world if would be great if you can find a pro bowl caliber player in the later rounds. But it's unrealistic to expect it. The later rounds are for taking chances on players deemed too small, too slow, or a project like Rico Gathers. Now I would say one later round pick, Kevon Fraiser, has a chance to compete for the SS job, maybe as soon as next year imo.

Right, so if you are taking guys like that, why not more?Just my thoughts. Again, there will be some that agree with the "flyer" philosophy and others who will say rely on your scouts and try and find some contributors, even as backups to start.....and I don't expect it, results, just want think it may help with a D like ours where we need bodies.

 

[Miller]

6th/7th rounds are flyer rounds. It always cracks me up how angry people on message boards get about late round draft picks in a business where there are 53 jobs and they take 90 guys to be interviewed in the summer.

Again, no anger. It was a civil question where I prefaced it by saying there would be differences of opinion. Not sure why people have to keep bringing anger or animosity into the equation. It was a simple question on philosophy.

 

[AbeBeta]

Thinking about free agency in the sixth round is pretty stupid, in my opinion. You should still be focusing on your board and drafting your highest rated players who might have slipped, not rounding out next year's practice squad. This is the same way they lost out on Thomas Rawls. They thought they could sign him as an UDFA, so they drafted a crappy tackle instead, even though Rawls was clearly the better player.

Hard to get in FA also means you think if you don't draft him that someone else will.

You certainly do have to weigh that and you likely have several guys you want and need to prioritize.

 

[AbeBeta]

6th/7th rounds are flyer rounds. It always cracks me up how angry people on message boards get about late round draft picks in a business where there are 53 jobs and they take 90 guys to be interviewed in the summer.

Seriously. Like there are great solid can''t miss guys in these rounds just sitting there.

 

[Miller]

Seriously. Like there are great solid can''t miss guys in these rounds just sitting there.

I don't think anyone is saying there are guys that are can't miss just sitting there. But do you attempt to use your scouts and pick guys that may fill needs, even as backups, or just flyers where a majority will never sniff the field? There are teams that seem to have a better batting average sniffing these guys out. I just don't think we are deep as Jerry thinks we are so would rather take D chances than Rico/RB chances.

 

[Eddie]

Our policy has definitely been effective. Look at all those 6th and 7th rounders who have turned into super stars in Dallas over the past 10 years.

 

[casmith07]

Again, no anger. It was a civil question where I prefaced it by saying there would be differences of opinion. Not sure why people have to keep bringing anger or animosity into the equation. It was a simple question on philosophy.

I'm just speaking generally, not to any specific poster. You might not get that upset about it but you have to admit that it's funny to see.