Lessons in winning

[dckid]

How do you think the Cleveland Browns were able to get their foundational players (QB & DE) on Offense & Defense? By winning?

Nope.

By being the worst in back-to-back years.

Try again.

You get an F for the day.

Browns definitely tanked for several years! They have had some great analytics guys in their front office since Haslem took over as the owner.
But having said all this the Browns have equaled what Dallas has done since 1996...
I never thought I would see the day we compare ourselves to the Browns.

 

[The Fonz]

1-they have now a better management
2-better coaching staff
3-some good core of players( having high drafts in the past helped).

compare that with what we have and you get the picture

 

[Risen Star]

Since 2014 Browns had these Draft Picks:

2014 2x 1st Round (Pick 8 and 22)
2015 2x 1st Round (Pick 15 and 19)
2016 2x 1st Round (Pick 15 and 32)
2017 3x 1st Round (Picks 1, 25, 29)
2018 2x 1st Round (Pick 1 and 4 aswell as Pick 33 and 35)
2020 1x 1st Round (Pick 10)

So in the last 6 years they had 12 First Round Picks including 8 Top 20 Picks. Twice the 1st Overall. 3 Picks in the Top 10 and that doesnt include a ton of early 2nd Round Picks.

They just built smartly through the Draft, hired good Coaches and got Lucky with Some Picks.

Nope. The Browns won because of their history of winning. It's just a way of life up there.

Good thread.

 

[visionary]

Cleveland succeeded in getting to the playoffs by being winning winners. They beat the Pittsburgh Steelers today because of a constant winning environment. No teams can tank and transform into winners. It doesn't happen because of what it does in the locker room (like a losing character infection). Most great teams start by being champions and then just continuing being awesome. Winning begets winning. Losing begets losing. Here endeth the lesson to anyone saying that losing can equal wins in the future.

So I assume that because of all this “winning “ you’re picking Cleveland to beat KC?

 

[visionary]

1-they have now a better management
2-better coaching staff
3-some good core of players( having high drafts in the past helped).

compare that with what we have and you get the picture

better than Jerry?

not possible

 

[HungryLion]

What??????

 

[gjkoeppen]

No offense, but what does this current Cowboys team and its fans know about winning? We haven’t “won” anything significant in over 20 years. Leave the winner talk to the actual winners.

Some of us fans have been around a very long time. I've been a Cowboys fan since the very first day they came into the league. Until now, the fans and team never advocated tanking for draft position. Every year the fans and team were in win mode only regardless what their record ended up being. Landry would never put up with intentional losing and if a player even as much as whispered that he would have been given his walking papers. Even after Jones bought the team and the Cowboys only won 1 game, 2 less than the year before, but they never were in tanking for draft position. 1989 the Cowboys were a bad team with a rookie QB that even though today is in the HOF, he was really bad his rookie year. To use a Parcell saying, you are what you record says you are and I think that could also pertain to if you start to intentionally lose and are a losing team, than that is what your culture will be. All tanking does is give some players incentive to get off that team as soon as possible or turn them into I don't care players. If offense is taken, to bad.
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[Doomsday101]

So I assume that because of all this “winning “ you’re picking Cleveland to beat KC?

I can say I am pulling for Cleveland to pull off the upset. I doubt many felt Cleveland would beat Pitt but that is what is great about sports, what is supposed to happen does not always happen. lol

 

[gjkoeppen]

You lie. The Browns were tankers for years and now it has transformed them into a winner.

If that is true and if it isn't really a case of a combination of things like new coaches every other year and not drafting well and just being bad teams, then remember if what you say is true they were tankers for at least a decade so is that what you want? A decade of have one of the worst teams in the NFL?
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[visionary]

I can say I am pulling for Cleveland to pull off the upset. I doubt many felt Cleveland would beat Pitt but that is what is great about sports, what is supposed to happen does not always happen. lol

thank you for missing the point which was, culture and winning are important but you have to start with talent and coaching

 

[Whyjerry]

Cleveland succeeded in getting to the playoffs by being winning winners. They beat the Pittsburgh Steelers today because of a constant winning environment. No teams can tank and transform into winners. It doesn't happen because of what it does in the locker room (like a losing character infection). Most great teams start by being champions and then just continuing being awesome. Winning begets winning. Losing begets losing. Here endeth the lesson to anyone saying that losing can equal wins in the future.

The all too comfortable culture is the biggest issue in Dallas.

 

[Doomsday101]

thank you for missing the point which was, culture and winning are important but you have to start with talent and coaching

I responded to it above about the importance of winning. Sorry my post offended you. lol I forget how sensitive some are around here. My mistake

 

[Blitzen]

Totally disagree. Who are you trying to kid? No way they could have gotten talents like Baker Mayfield and Myles Garrett everywhere in all of the rounds those particular years.

There are Lebron James and Michael Jordan's type players every NBA draft. You just have to have the correct culture, winning attitude, and quality coaching to unlock that awesomeness. Thank goodness Phil Jackson could unlock Jordan's talent into becoming a pretty good player. Same goes for the NFL.

 

[Hennessy_King]

Exactly. I'm prepared to believe that the Cowboys winning totals towards the end of the year will definitely lead to the success that Cleveland is currently enjoying. It's something like 10 parts winning environment and coaching, 0.5 parts talent, 20 parts good health, 50 points kick *** attitude. I'm not good at intangible math so give or take 50 points on any of these.

lol if we would have made the playoffs tampa would have hung 50 points on us

 

[Blitzen]

lol if we would have made the playoffs tampa would have hung 50 points on us

Incorrect. If the Cowboys had won the last game, and made the playoffs, they would have parlayed that winning confidence and attitude into a dance on Brady's face.

 

[Creeper]

Since 2014 Browns had these Draft Picks:

2014 2x 1st Round (Pick 8 and 22)
2015 2x 1st Round (Pick 15 and 19)
2016 2x 1st Round (Pick 15 and 32)
2017 3x 1st Round (Picks 1, 25, 29)
2018 2x 1st Round (Pick 1 and 4 aswell as Pick 33 and 35)
2020 1x 1st Round (Pick 10)

So in the last 6 years they had 12 First Round Picks including 8 Top 20 Picks. Twice the 1st Overall. 3 Picks in the Top 10 and that doesnt include a ton of early 2nd Round Picks.

They just built smartly through the Draft, hired good Coaches and got Lucky with Some Picks.

This is especially important if your team has a philosophy of not signing top tier free agents. With 7 draft picks per year, by the time you can keep up with the players you lose to free agency.

 

[gjkoeppen]

There are Lebron James and Michael Jordan's type players every NBA draft. You just have to have the correct culture, winning attitude, and quality coaching to unlock that awesomeness. Thank goodness Phil Jackson could unlock Jordan's talent into becoming a pretty good player. Same goes for the NFL.

There is some truth in that but in the NBA a single player has and does completely take over games. The NFL is the ultimate team sport. The NFL has to many moving parts that have to be working to win games. Jordan could take over a game and score 50 points and single handed win games. But you're right that if teams don't have a winning culture they won't win and in the NFL teams that tank don't have a winning culture.
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[Blitzen]

If that is true and if it isn't really a case of a combination of things like new coaches every other year and not drafting well and just being bad teams, then remember if what you say is true they were tankers for at least a decade so is that what you want? A decade of have one of the worst teams in the NFL?

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I would rather attempt winning and have 50 decades of inconsequential mediocre seasons, than suck for 1 decade then win a super bowl.

 

[FiveSuperBowls]

Cleveland succeeded in getting to the playoffs by being winning winners. They beat the Pittsburgh Steelers today because of a constant winning environment. No teams can tank and transform into winners. It doesn't happen because of what it does in the locker room (like a losing character infection). Most great teams start by being champions and then just continuing being awesome. Winning begets winning. Losing begets losing. Here endeth the lesson to anyone saying that losing can equal wins in the future.

Tell that to the Eagles.

 

[JoeKing]

Cleveland was not taking they just were not good which is why they also fired coaches, why the hell would you fire a coach if the organization was trying to tank? . Losing on purpose is not a solution and only enforces the notion that it is alright to lose. You may want that many of us don't. You hit the field you play to win the damn game.

More lies. Cleveland was tanking for years! It's okay to lose a game when the system rewards it by giving you a better draft position the following year... this IS how you play the game.