Let's talk about our Offensive Coaching

[john van brocklin]

I hope that this thread will spawn some discussions about the coaching situation with the Cowboys.
One of the things I wonder about were the discussions that Jerry and Mac had about Moore when Mac was hired.
I for one was surprised and disappointed that Mac did not install and run his offense, but that the offense was given to Moore to run.
Does anyone find this odd?
I personally think that this was a condition on Mac getting the job, but have no proof.
I think that Jerry believes that Moore is the next football genius and HC in waiting.
I really think this offense does not work for Dak and would love to see how a different offense might help him.
As someone has said, you can change offenses and coaches much easier than QB because of Dak's contract.

Thoughts and opinions please.
Thanks, John

 

[Cmac]

I would simply ask.......Can the offense be tailored to the QB and the skill players or is it the QB and skill players required to be tailored to the OC philosophy? Which one is it?

 

[john van brocklin]

I would simply ask.......Can the offense be tailored to the QB and the skill players or is it the QB and skill players required to be tailored to the OC philosophy? Which one is it?

Yep, are we trying to fit a square peg (dak) into a round hole (moore's offense) ?

 

[phildadon86]

Yep, are we trying to fit a square peg (dak) into a round hole (moore's offense) ?

They have been doing this since Garrett.

When MM was brought in I was very excited because I thought that the WCO was the perfect system for this group of players. Instead we got more of the Garrett offensive scheme.

Remember games when Dez would be forced to run 50 go routes? Until Romo literally started changing plays moving him into the slot into a slant? You have a WR whos is incredible (maybe the best in the league at the time) at RAC and YAC. Yet you send him running straight 80 percent of the game.....This is Garrett. He believed in his system so much so that his arrogance did not allow him to tailor his offense for the players he had. Instead trying to force them into his system.

Moore is doing the same thing. We have CD. YAC monster. Lets have him curls and fly routes. No slants. This entire scheme needs to be trashed and Moore sent packing because I am sick of watching this offense do something that works, only for the next week to do the complete opposite.

 

[nightrain]

I hope that this thread will spawn some discussions about the coaching situation with the Cowboys.
One of the things I wonder about were the discussions that Jerry and Mac had about Moore when Mac was hired.
I for one was surprised and disappointed that Mac did not install and run his offense, but that the offense was given to Moore to run.
Does anyone find this odd?
I personally think that this was a condition on Mac getting the job, but have no proof.
I think that Jerry believes that Moore is the next football genius and HC in waiting.
I really think this offense does not work for Dak and would love to see how a different offense might help him.
As someone has said, you can change offenses and coaches much easier than QB because of Dak's contract.

Thoughts and opinions please.
Thanks, John

I think Jerry used the same snake oil conditions for McCarthy hat he used for Wade Phillips. This type of crap is part and parcel as to why Parcells left and coaches like Payton will never work for Jerry.

 

[RonnieT24]

I would simply ask.......Can the offense be tailored to the QB and the skill players or is it the QB and skill players required to be tailored to the OC philosophy? Which one is it?

We have seen an offense where Dak absolutely excels. It involves moving the pocket, some designed QB runs and the like. It also involves handing the ball off 30-35 times a game. But that's not the offense Moore wants to run. I don't even know if Dak likes that offense more than this new one.. I just know that other offense suited his skillset and play style better.

 

[Wolfpack]

I think MM absolutely had to take KM and the offense. I also think a WCO style with a lot of play action and boots would kill it here. KM is running a version of Garrett's concepts, which are simple and stale. Yes it works against bad teams but its not going deep into the playoff level.

 

[Cmac]

We have seen an offense where Dak absolutely excels. It involves moving the pocket, some designed QB runs and the like. It also involves handing the ball off 30-35 times a game. But that's not the offense Moore wants to run. I don't even know if Dak likes that offense more than this new one.. I just know that other offense suited his skillset and play style better.

....interesting to see if Carolina FO is desperate or just "unlearned" about the words they here from the KMoore interview to take over the entire coaching staff.

 

[xwalker]

I hope that this thread will spawn some discussions about the coaching situation with the Cowboys.
One of the things I wonder about were the discussions that Jerry and Mac had about Moore when Mac was hired.
I for one was surprised and disappointed that Mac did not install and run his offense, but that the offense was given to Moore to run.
Does anyone find this odd?
I personally think that this was a condition on Mac getting the job, but have no proof.
I think that Jerry believes that Moore is the next football genius and HC in waiting.
I really think this offense does not work for Dak and would love to see how a different offense might help him.
As someone has said, you can change offenses and coaches much easier than QB because of Dak's contract.

Thoughts and opinions please.
Thanks, John

McCarthy gave up play calling in Green Bay.

The real question regarding Moore is what are the options to replace him?

Teams often have to hire an OC as their HC in order to get that coach because they cannot hire another team's OC to be their OC.

 

[Silly]

I want to know who is coaching Dak. Who helps Dak read the defense and distribute the ball? From the TV audience perspective, I never see any coaching on the sidelines during a game. For the Fans in the stands, what do you see Mike doing during the game?

 

[fivetwos]

They have been doing this since Garrett.

When MM was brought in I was very excited because I thought that the WCO was the perfect system for this group of players. Instead we got more of the Garrett offensive scheme.

Remember games when Dez would be forced to run 50 go routes? Until Romo literally started changing plays moving him into the slot into a slant? You have a WR whos is incredible (maybe the best in the league at the time) at RAC and YAC. Yet you send him running straight 80 percent of the game.....This is Garrett. He believed in his system so much so that his arrogance did not allow him to tailor his offense for the players he had. Instead trying to force them into his system.

Moore is doing the same thing. We have CD. YAC monster. Lets have him curls and fly routes. No slants. This entire scheme needs to be trashed and Moore sent packing because I am sick of watching this offense do something that works, only for the next week to do the complete opposite.

Yeah but Jerry wanted “creativity.”

Moore took that to mean Garrett’s offense with some very bad trick plays installed.

 

[phildadon86]

Yeah but Jerry wanted “creativity.”

Moore took that to mean Garrett’s offense with some very bad trick plays installed.

That is honestly what it looks like. Not even kidding.

I have been seeing this offense for so long now that on the field I can tell you what the team is going to run. Imagine what a DC whos been watching film their whole life can see.

 

[fivetwos]

I hope that this thread will spawn some discussions about the coaching situation with the Cowboys.
One of the things I wonder about were the discussions that Jerry and Mac had about Moore when Mac was hired.
I for one was surprised and disappointed that Mac did not install and run his offense, but that the offense was given to Moore to run.
Does anyone find this odd?
I personally think that this was a condition on Mac getting the job, but have no proof.
I think that Jerry believes that Moore is the next football genius and HC in waiting.
I really think this offense does not work for Dak and would love to see how a different offense might help him.
As someone has said, you can change offenses and coaches much easier than QB because of Dak's contract.

Thoughts and opinions please.
Thanks, John

The offense laid a total egg with the season on the line in 2019, yet Moore had to be retained because they didn’t want to disrupt what he and Dak had going, as if they were killing it.

Nah, not really. That was Jerry hedging his bet and keeping one of his guys running the offense and therefore more control.

Moore was only brought in because at the time, bright young minds like McVay, Shanahan and McDermott were all the rage, so Jerry had to find his own genius, but didn’t want to fire Garrett.

It’s been patchwork with coordinators going back a very long way, with Jerry always making sure he had control. He wasn’t about to feel as helpless as the Parcells years ever again.

This is the price. Hope you’re happy and having fun Jerry. We aren’t.

 

[CATCH17]

The Cowboys believe in continuity and that’s why they keep getting the same results.

Heck we got a decade of Garrett because of their belief in continuity.

Meanwhile Philadelphia can win a Super Bowl and make big changes and be on the cusp of another.

 

[fivetwos]

That is honestly what it looks like. Not even kidding.

I have been seeing this offense for so long now that on the field I can tell you what the team is going to run. Imagine what a DC whos been watching film their whole life can see.

Agreed. It truly stuns me that an actual NFL offensive coordinator could not see that those predictable curl routes aren’t going to work against zone.

I mean how many time are our opponents going to say they knew what was coming before something is done about it??

 

[phildadon86]

Agreed. It truly stuns me that an actual NFL offensive coordinator could not see that those predictable curl routes aren’t going to work against zone.

I mean how many time are our opponents going to say they knew what was coming before something is done about it??

I worry that Jerry take that as a compliment because it means we are popular.

 

[fivetwos]

The Cowboys believe in continuity and that’s why they keep getting the same results.

Heck we got a decade of Garrett because of their belief in continuity.

Meanwhile Philadelphia can win a Super Bowl and make big changes and be on the cusp of another.

They aren’t capable. They need help. Hopefully they are off somewhere discussing exactly that.

Hoping to take all the credit for something they may never get is beyond foolish. At some point Jerry is going to truly wish he settled for being Bob Kraft.

That’s how deeply desperately hopeful I am.

Losing is one thing and fine, just not this way.

Before you laugh hysterically, understand that I expect nothing more than the same, and the conclusion that they are SO close and will try the same approach yet again.

Meanwhile they are three VERY difficult wins away from a title. That ain’t close. Sorry.

They COULD be with the right moves, but not going all in the last two years may very well have blown our best shots.

 

[fivetwos]

I worry that Jerry take that as a compliment because it means we are popular.

It means there’s serious incompetence at high levels.

 

[Cowboy_svt]

They have been doing this since Garrett.

When MM was brought in I was very excited because I thought that the WCO was the perfect system for this group of players. Instead we got more of the Garrett offensive scheme.

Remember games when Dez would be forced to run 50 go routes? Until Romo literally started changing plays moving him into the slot into a slant? You have a WR whos is incredible (maybe the best in the league at the time) at RAC and YAC. Yet you send him running straight 80 percent of the game.....This is Garrett. He believed in his system so much so that his arrogance did not allow him to tailor his offense for the players he had. Instead trying to force them into his system.

Moore is doing the same thing. We have CD. YAC monster. Lets have him curls and fly routes. No slants. This entire scheme needs to be trashed and Moore sent packing because I am sick of watching this offense do something that works, only for the next week to do the complete opposite.

If im remembering right the Patriots D couldn't stop him in the slant at all

 

[SexyDexy52]

I like to point out that the offensive coaching staff needs to be replaced. We have an oline with 2 Hall of Famers (Martin and Smith), a 1st round pick (Smith), a guy that has risen from undrafted to being considered near the top of his game (Steele) as well as a much improved Biadaz. Yet so many times the RBs were being hit in the backfield or having to make a guy miss in the backfield, as well as other times they were running into a brick wall as the line got stood up.
In the passing game, it seems like WRs aren’t being told important things like, cross the defenders face before breaking back that way you make him change his momentum and it will create more space for you to be open. Simple details that players need to know that make a big difference in whether or not a pass is completed or tipped for an interception, as we saw on the 2nd and 2 play on Sunday.

Attention to details and discipline need to be instilled in this offense and then you’d have a real championship caliber offense. How many games have we seen them shoot themselves in the foot? We say the players need to execute but the also need to be taught that discipline in your craft leads to great execution.