Linebackers, IL and OLB

gimmesix said:
I don't think Parker has mentioned using 3-4 gapping at all. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

I do think we could have some alignments where we have three bigs out there without having two OLBs/DEs, but I'm not sure anyone will consider that a 3-4 front. Most likely, it will look like a 4-3 with a big end (Ogbonnia) and a small end (Gary or Eze) with the extra linebacker/DB playing off the line and then possibly moving down before the snap.

I would consider this an atypical alignment, though, and not our base. If the three bigs are out there, then I would bet we'll have two DEs/OLBs out there with them on most downs because the purpose of having the three bigs out there is to stop the run. Neither Ogbonnia or Bullard are going to be out there much when we are in pass defense because they are not pass rushers. Not sure Clark is going to be either. I think we'll have Gary as the other DT a lot (next to Quinnen) when we are in nickel, but probably not until we're almost certain the play will be a pass.
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I could be off but simply as a spectator to the conversation thus far I think you’re overthinking Lou’s point. Basically the cowboys are going to play some odd fronts in nickel. It may not be a true 3-4 by definition but anything with nickel personnel won’t fit 4-3/3-4 parameters.

Just going to nickel doesn’t necessarily mean you’re in a pass prevention defense either. Many teams love to run on lighter boxes created by 3 wr sets, and we saw an uptick in passing last year out of multi te sets.
 
gimmesix said:
I don't think Parker has mentioned using 3-4 gapping at all. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

I do think we could have some alignments where we have three bigs out there without having two OLBs/DEs, but I'm not sure anyone will consider that a 3-4 front. Most likely, it will look like a 4-3 with a big end (Ogbonnia) and a small end (Gary or Eze) with the extra linebacker/DB playing off the line and then possibly moving down before the snap.

I would consider this an atypical alignment, though, and not our base. If the three bigs are out there, then I would bet we'll have two DEs/OLBs out there with them on most downs because the purpose of having the three bigs out there is to stop the run. Neither Ogbonnia or Bullard are going to be out there much when we are in pass defense because they are not pass rushers. Not sure Clark is going to be either. I think we'll have Gary as the other DT a lot (next to Quinnen) when we are in nickel, but probably not until we're almost certain the play will be a pass.
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I think we've lost the thread a little bit here lol. Maybe gapping isn't the right word - but alignment or shape.

What we traditionally call a 3-4 or 5-2 is going to be done with nickel personnel, is my point. It doesn't matter how many DTs or DEs, explicitly, are on the field. You can throw a passrusher at 1T to shoot a gap or a nickel at edge to cover a tight WR.

The value of this approach is that it allows you to adjust to offenses without changing the structure of your defense. But that means having a very loose definition of 3-4.
 
LouBrown said:
I think we've lost the thread a little bit here lol. Maybe gapping isn't the right word - but alignment or shape.

What we traditionally call a 3-4 or 5-2 is going to be done with nickel personnel, is my point. It doesn't matter how many DTs or DEs, explicitly, are on the field. You can throw a passrusher at 1T to shoot a gap or a nickel at edge to cover a tight WR.

The value of this approach is that it allows you to adjust to offenses without changing the structure of your defense. But that means having a very loose definition of 3-4.
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Maybe by shape, but I'm still not sure I'm in agreement. The 3-4 as an alignment has three down linemen and four linebackers, which are typically defensive ends in the 4-3. I think when we have a DB in for a linebacker we will generally be in a 4-3 or 4-2-5 look. I don't expect us, for instance, to have Quinnen, Clark and Ogbonnia in there with Gary and Downs at outside linebacker. I think Ogbonnia and Bullard, in particular, are run defense players, so we're not going to put a 5-11, 200-player on the edge and have him take on pulling guards, tackles and tight ends. When those three bigs are in there, I expect us to have guys like Gary and Eze out there so we can stop the run first since that is all Ogbonnia and Bullard are good for.

Now, we might have Eze/Lawrence out there with Quinnen, Clark and Gary and bring Downs down to the line of scrimmage, giving us a five-man look, but that's still a 4-3 with a blitzer moving up to create confusion. I don't think that is what Parker is referring to when he says we're using a 3-4 front. Maybe I'm wrong because of the 4-3 spacing comment, but I don't think we'll see a 3-4 nickel. I think, like he has said, our nickel will be 4-2-5.
 
CT Dal Fan said:
So we're writing off Barham's career because of poor combine results??

By the way, look at this list: Calias Campbell, Vontaze Burfict, Jarvis Landry, Tom Brady, Terrell Suggs, Cooper Kupp, Navarro Bowman, and Anquan Boldin.

What do they have in common? All became NFL all-pros after failing the underwear olympics.
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Kinda.

Especially when we need a LT who can actually pass block.

Barham’s combine/draft profile is a disaster.

But CP blew up Jerry’s phone to get the pick.

Shoulda picked Trost.
 
gimmesix said:
Maybe by shape, but I'm still not sure I'm in agreement. The 3-4 as an alignment has three down linemen and four linebackers
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You're equating alignment to personnel.

In nickel personnel, the 3-4 alignment effectively has a slot at Edge (OLB) on the LOS. It's still 4-2-5 personnel, but lined up as a 3-4.
 
LouBrown said:
Slot - x - 5T - x - 1T - x - 3T - x - Edge
ILB - x - ILB​

That's pretty much the base defense. What we're calling a 3-4 mostly includes a passrushing edge and a slot, not two OLBs.
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When they are in nickel though that 5t is probably going to be out further in either 7 or 9 like the other edge. If it's a passing down for sure then the 1T will likely be playing 3t too and it could even be Gary kicked inside.
 
CowboysFaninHouston said:
Rashan Gary probably deisgnated for that side, but can he drop to cover TEs. he did run a 4.6, but being fast not necessarily the same as covering recievers.....

I heard Braham is one of the ILBs, but he ran a 4.65, which is kind of slow and will he get exposed as a pass defender.
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So a 4.6 is fast. But a 4.65 is kind of slow? Lay off the weed and make it make sense.
 
diamonddelts said:
So a 4.6 is fast. But a 4.65 is kind of slow? Lay off the weed and make it make sense.
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4.6 as a DE. Pass rusher

Vs.

4.65 as a MLB, having to drop into coverage often.

Position matters.

But with that said, learned that there are a lot of LBs that are about same speed. Still a concern, so its about instincts, play recognition that becomes key
 
xwalker said:
Fred Warner ran a 4.64 forty.

He's been the best Off-Ball LB on the planet this decade.
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he has great instincts and recognition skills..and I had had several exchanges along the way in this thread about speed.

it will come down to his instincts, play recognition. which will impact his change of direction (timeliness). will he be in the play or trailing.
 
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