Maikeru-sama
Mick Green 58
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Looks like Tim Duncan is in Playoff Form
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Danny White
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mickgreen58;1457571 said:
I know you're just looking to pick a fight here... so I guess I'll oblige.
It cracks me up that the Mavs fans... the whiniest fans of the whiniest team in the league (owned by the whiniest owner)... choose to single out Duncan for his complaining. The irony is thick!
It's also funny that you see Duncan as the villian in this situation, when universally, every commentator and objective NBA fan is outraged by Joey Crawford.
It's also funny that you would side with Crawford when his borderline psychotic personality directly affected your team a few years ago.
Oh well, if that's what you need to beat the Spurs so be it. It worked for you last year and looks like you'll be depending on it yet again.
zrinkill
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Danny White;1457606 said:I know you're just looking to pick a fight here... so I guess I'll oblige.
It cracks me up that the Mavs fans... the whiniest fans of the whiniest team in the league (owned by the whiniest owner)... choose to single out Duncan for his complaining. The irony is thick!
MC KAos
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Danny White;1457606 said:I know you're just looking to pick a fight here... so I guess I'll oblige.
It cracks me up that the Mavs fans... the whiniest fans of the whiniest team in the league (owned by the whiniest owner)... choose to single out Duncan for his complaining. The irony is thick!
It's also funny that you see Duncan as the villian in this situation, when universally, every commentator and objective NBA fan is outraged by Joey Crawford.
It's also funny that you would side with Crawford when his borderline psychotic personality directly affected your team a few years ago.
Oh well, if that's what you need to beat the Spurs so be it. It worked for you last year and looks like you'll be depending on it yet again.
theebs
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Danny White;1457606 said:I know you're just looking to pick a fight here... so I guess I'll oblige.
It cracks me up that the Mavs fans... the whiniest fans of the whiniest team in the league (owned by the whiniest owner)... choose to single out Duncan for his complaining. The irony is thick!
It's also funny that you see Duncan as the villian in this situation, when universally, every commentator and objective NBA fan is outraged by Joey Crawford.
It's also funny that you would side with Crawford when his borderline psychotic personality directly affected your team a few years ago.
Oh well, if that's what you need to beat the Spurs so be it. It worked for you last year and looks like you'll be depending on it yet again.
how are the wizards doing? And the caps?
Danny White
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theebs;1457693 said:
Not sure, here ya go...
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/standings
http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/standings
peplaw06
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Danny White;1457606 said:I know you're just looking to pick a fight here... so I guess I'll oblige.
It cracks me up that the Mavs fans... the whiniest fans of the whiniest team in the league (owned by the whiniest owner)... choose to single out Duncan for his complaining. The irony is thick!
It's also funny that you see Duncan as the villian in this situation, when universally, every commentator and objective NBA fan is outraged by Joey Crawford.
It's also funny that you would side with Crawford when his borderline psychotic personality directly affected your team a few years ago.
Oh well, if that's what you need to beat the Spurs so be it. It worked for you last year and looks like you'll be depending on it yet again.
Irony on all fronts I suppose. Almost all players whine, and almost all fans whine. You'd be hard pressed to find a player who whines more than Duncan though.
Danny White
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peplaw06;1457991 said:
Well that's certainly the rap he's gotten lately... especially from Mavs fans. I see it as him being the captain of his team and standing up for his teammates on the court. But obviously he's gotten a reputation, and it seems to be working against him... ala Jerry Crawford... so he probably should try to cool it and show less emotion on the court when he thinks things aren't going his way or his teammates way.
It's hard to argue that he's not getting a raw deal in this case though, isn't it?
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ESPN Chris Sheridan Blog
Do I Amuse You?
A little over a year ago, a little birdie who has been around the NBA almost as long as I have been alive told me a little story about Joey Crawford, who ejected Tim Duncan from Sunday's Mavs-Spurs game for laughing -- yes, laughing -- from the bench.
For the blow-by-blow of what happened Sunday, including Duncan's claim afterward that Crawford challenged him to a fight, be sure to check out Marc Stein's latest blog entry.
What I'm here to give you is a little Insider background, as well as the following quasi-prediction: It would not surprise me if Crawford loses his whistle for the upcoming postseason.
Here's why:
That little birdie I spoke of before told me that Crawford was summoned to the league office in New York by Commissioner David Stern nearly four years ago following his antics in Game 2 of the 2003 Western Conference finals.
Crawford had called four technical fouls in the first 10 minutes, 11 seconds and ejected Mavs coaches Don Nelson and Del Harris. Here's the way I reported that story way back then when I was the pool reporter who interviewed Crawford in the officials' locker room after the game.
Stern, from what I was told, was livid that Crawford had become the story of Game 2, and Crawford was told that if it ever happened again, the consequences would be serious.
• The full Chris Sheridan blog
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime
Do I Amuse You?
A little over a year ago, a little birdie who has been around the NBA almost as long as I have been alive told me a little story about Joey Crawford, who ejected Tim Duncan from Sunday's Mavs-Spurs game for laughing -- yes, laughing -- from the bench.
For the blow-by-blow of what happened Sunday, including Duncan's claim afterward that Crawford challenged him to a fight, be sure to check out Marc Stein's latest blog entry.
What I'm here to give you is a little Insider background, as well as the following quasi-prediction: It would not surprise me if Crawford loses his whistle for the upcoming postseason.
Here's why:
That little birdie I spoke of before told me that Crawford was summoned to the league office in New York by Commissioner David Stern nearly four years ago following his antics in Game 2 of the 2003 Western Conference finals.
Crawford had called four technical fouls in the first 10 minutes, 11 seconds and ejected Mavs coaches Don Nelson and Del Harris. Here's the way I reported that story way back then when I was the pool reporter who interviewed Crawford in the officials' locker room after the game.
Stern, from what I was told, was livid that Crawford had become the story of Game 2, and Crawford was told that if it ever happened again, the consequences would be serious.
• The full Chris Sheridan blog
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ESPN Marc Stein Blog
Duncan ejected? That's no joke
by: Marc Stein
posted: Sunday, April 15, 2007 | Feedback | Print Entry
filed under: Tim Duncan
DALLAS -- Tim Duncan grabs rebounds, but never headlines. Tim Duncan never lets us inside. Tim Duncan is boring.
Accurate scouting report, right?
Wrong. Duncan's dossier needs a major rewrite after Sunday.
An afternoon that was forecast to be more letdown than showdown wound up more competitive and combustible than the Mavericks or Spurs ever imagined, capped by Avery Johnson bringing Dirk Nowitzki back in off the bench instead of letting his MVP candidate rest for the final nine-plus minutes. That helped the hosts rally for a 91-86 triumph which, more than anything, seemed to suggest that Johnson simply couldn't bear to lose a home game to the hated rivals from the south, even when the game meant virtually nothing to Dallas.
However …
Don't expect to hear much more about the on-court proceedings after Duncan (a) was apparently ejected for laughing and then (b) uncharacteristically unloaded on veteran ref Joey Crawford.
Unloaded, actually, doesn't begin to cover it, since the famously reserved Duncan (at least in his dealings with the media) not only accused Crawford of having "a personal vendetta" against him but also revealed that Crawford challenged him to a fight.
Interested yet?
Duncan arrived at the final regular-season weekend of his 10th NBA season with just one overturned ejection* in all that time and seven techs for the season. But twice in a span of 1:16 in Sunday's third quarter, Duncan was hit with T's by Crawford.
While sitting on the bench.
The first was more surprising than shocking. Manu Ginobili was called for a foul and Duncan -- still simmering after an offensive foul that sent him to the bench moments earlier -- voiced a protest from his seat at referee LeRoy Richardson. Crawford swooped in to T him up. Unusual, yes, but not unprecedented.
The second? Call it a full-blown stunner.
Duncan was still seated and laughing animatedly on the bench after a foul had been whistled on Fabricio Oberto. Undoubtedly feeling he was being shown up, Crawford hit Duncan with T No. 2.
It was a scene reminiscent of the Western Conference finals in 2003 when Crawford ejected then-Mavs coach Don Nelson for standing silently (but defiantly) near the scorer's table in San Antonio after Nelson had been ordered to return to the bench.
The real show, though, would take place at Duncan's locker … after the Spurs fizzled without him in the fourth.
An extended look at the quotes can be found here, but the summary is plenty good: Duncan explained in great detail how he feels Crawford "has a personal problem with me" and asserted that Crawford repeatedly asked him before the technicals, "Do you want to fight?"
Duncan also insisted that he barely spoke to Crawford during the game and that he thinks he can play through any carryover when the Spurs and Crawford inevitably cross paths in the playoffs.
"I got to watch what I do, I guess," Duncan said. "I guess I can't laugh anymore. I can't enjoy the game. I'll have to sit there and put my head between my legs."
My best guesses from courtside:
1. Even though the second technical was one too many -- and even though you suspect that pretty much all public opinion is going to accumulate on Duncan's side -- he's a lock to get fined for his comments.
In December, remember, Jason Kidd was docked $20,000 for lashing out after a bungled call in Detroit sealed a one-point loss for the Nets. Didn't matter that Kidd was right about Vince Carter drawing a foul on Rasheed Wallace. Didn't matter that the league office deemed it a missed call as well. Kidd referred to the refs that night as "three blind mice" and Duncan just said a lot more than that.
2. Crawford will be disciplined as well. The difference: Punishments for referees generally aren't made public, so we might not immediately know about any fines and/or suspensions. Yet there's no way this can be downplayed in the league office, since this was no mere missed call. Duncan does have a well-chronicled rep as one of the league's most frequent complainers to referees and probably did say more to Crawford over the course of the afternoon than he claims. But a referee suggesting a fight to settle things, even in jest, is no way for a referee to calm tensions, which is one of his jobs.
And with players on both sides telling me they heard the word "fight" tossed around on the floor, I have no reason to doubt the veracity of Duncan's account.
3. I'm guessing that this whole episode, sadly, will crank up the conspiracy-theory talk before we even get to the playoffs, which didn't seem possible. But how can something like this not turn fans off? Refs having it in for certain players or teams … Tim Duncan isn't exactly known for publicly registering that kind of complaint.
How can it not come up before, during and after the next Spurs game Crawford officiates? How will David Stern react to some pretty strong claims from one of his finest citizens? Pretty interesting stuff, with Duncan at the center of it all.
*About that overturned ejection? Some good trivia I had forgotten, courtesy of our pal Johnny Ludden from the San Antonio Express-News: Duncan's only other career ejection -- on Feb. 4, 2002, after an exchange with Kevin Garnett got both guys tossed -- was rescinded by the league a day later.
Duncan ejected? That's no joke
by: Marc Stein
posted: Sunday, April 15, 2007 | Feedback | Print Entry
filed under: Tim Duncan
DALLAS -- Tim Duncan grabs rebounds, but never headlines. Tim Duncan never lets us inside. Tim Duncan is boring.
Accurate scouting report, right?
Wrong. Duncan's dossier needs a major rewrite after Sunday.
An afternoon that was forecast to be more letdown than showdown wound up more competitive and combustible than the Mavericks or Spurs ever imagined, capped by Avery Johnson bringing Dirk Nowitzki back in off the bench instead of letting his MVP candidate rest for the final nine-plus minutes. That helped the hosts rally for a 91-86 triumph which, more than anything, seemed to suggest that Johnson simply couldn't bear to lose a home game to the hated rivals from the south, even when the game meant virtually nothing to Dallas.
However …
Don't expect to hear much more about the on-court proceedings after Duncan (a) was apparently ejected for laughing and then (b) uncharacteristically unloaded on veteran ref Joey Crawford.
Unloaded, actually, doesn't begin to cover it, since the famously reserved Duncan (at least in his dealings with the media) not only accused Crawford of having "a personal vendetta" against him but also revealed that Crawford challenged him to a fight.
Interested yet?
Duncan arrived at the final regular-season weekend of his 10th NBA season with just one overturned ejection* in all that time and seven techs for the season. But twice in a span of 1:16 in Sunday's third quarter, Duncan was hit with T's by Crawford.
While sitting on the bench.
The first was more surprising than shocking. Manu Ginobili was called for a foul and Duncan -- still simmering after an offensive foul that sent him to the bench moments earlier -- voiced a protest from his seat at referee LeRoy Richardson. Crawford swooped in to T him up. Unusual, yes, but not unprecedented.
The second? Call it a full-blown stunner.
Duncan was still seated and laughing animatedly on the bench after a foul had been whistled on Fabricio Oberto. Undoubtedly feeling he was being shown up, Crawford hit Duncan with T No. 2.
It was a scene reminiscent of the Western Conference finals in 2003 when Crawford ejected then-Mavs coach Don Nelson for standing silently (but defiantly) near the scorer's table in San Antonio after Nelson had been ordered to return to the bench.
The real show, though, would take place at Duncan's locker … after the Spurs fizzled without him in the fourth.
An extended look at the quotes can be found here, but the summary is plenty good: Duncan explained in great detail how he feels Crawford "has a personal problem with me" and asserted that Crawford repeatedly asked him before the technicals, "Do you want to fight?"
Duncan also insisted that he barely spoke to Crawford during the game and that he thinks he can play through any carryover when the Spurs and Crawford inevitably cross paths in the playoffs.
"I got to watch what I do, I guess," Duncan said. "I guess I can't laugh anymore. I can't enjoy the game. I'll have to sit there and put my head between my legs."
My best guesses from courtside:
1. Even though the second technical was one too many -- and even though you suspect that pretty much all public opinion is going to accumulate on Duncan's side -- he's a lock to get fined for his comments.
In December, remember, Jason Kidd was docked $20,000 for lashing out after a bungled call in Detroit sealed a one-point loss for the Nets. Didn't matter that Kidd was right about Vince Carter drawing a foul on Rasheed Wallace. Didn't matter that the league office deemed it a missed call as well. Kidd referred to the refs that night as "three blind mice" and Duncan just said a lot more than that.
2. Crawford will be disciplined as well. The difference: Punishments for referees generally aren't made public, so we might not immediately know about any fines and/or suspensions. Yet there's no way this can be downplayed in the league office, since this was no mere missed call. Duncan does have a well-chronicled rep as one of the league's most frequent complainers to referees and probably did say more to Crawford over the course of the afternoon than he claims. But a referee suggesting a fight to settle things, even in jest, is no way for a referee to calm tensions, which is one of his jobs.
And with players on both sides telling me they heard the word "fight" tossed around on the floor, I have no reason to doubt the veracity of Duncan's account.
3. I'm guessing that this whole episode, sadly, will crank up the conspiracy-theory talk before we even get to the playoffs, which didn't seem possible. But how can something like this not turn fans off? Refs having it in for certain players or teams … Tim Duncan isn't exactly known for publicly registering that kind of complaint.
How can it not come up before, during and after the next Spurs game Crawford officiates? How will David Stern react to some pretty strong claims from one of his finest citizens? Pretty interesting stuff, with Duncan at the center of it all.
*About that overturned ejection? Some good trivia I had forgotten, courtesy of our pal Johnny Ludden from the San Antonio Express-News: Duncan's only other career ejection -- on Feb. 4, 2002, after an exchange with Kevin Garnett got both guys tossed -- was rescinded by the league a day later.
Maikeru-sama
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WoodysGirl;1458177 said:
Still doesn't change the fact that Duncan, along with Mark Cuban are two of the biggest whiners in professional sports.
I am a Mavs fan and Mark Cuban and Tim Duncan are extremely annoying individuals.
Watching Tim Duncan during the playoffs run the opposite way after missing a shot with both of his hands up begging for a call sickens me to my stomach.
It was almost as bad as Tony Parker doing interviews on the sidelines during the Mavs/Sun Series after being booted out of the Playoffs by the Mavs professing his man love for Boris Diaw and calling the Mavs dirty
. No wonder the Spurs fans sound bitter, because crap rolls downhill.- Mike G.
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theebs;1457693 said:
I dont think he got that joke Theebs, but trust me, I did
.- Mike G.
Danny White
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NBA talks to Spurs' Duncan about role in ejection
Web Posted: 04/17/2007 12:08 AM CDT
Johnny Ludden
Express-News
MEMPHIS, Tenn. — NBA officials interviewed Tim Duncan about his ejection in Sunday's loss to Dallas as the league's investigation appeared to focus on the actions of referee Joey Crawford.
Duncan said he spoke with an NBA security representative Monday by phone and told him the same thing he told reporters the previous day when he was ejected by Crawford while sitting on the bench:
Crawford asked him if he wanted to fight before either technical foul was issued; he made only one verbal complaint to Crawford about a call; and he was laughing about a call against Fabricio Oberto when Crawford ejected him.
Duncan also admitted he cursed at Crawford but only after he had been ejected and had started to leave the court. Crawford said Duncan called him a "piece of (expletive)."
"I called him that," Duncan said. "But I wanted to make sure (league officials) knew that wasn't why I was ejected."
Spurs officials said they wouldn't be surprised if Duncan is fined for his comments to reporters. The NBA frowns on players publicly critiquing the referees, particularly when they single them out by name.
Dallas guard Jerry Stackhouse had to pay $30,000 last season when he unleashed a profanity-laced tirade about referee Dick Bavetta after a loss to the Spurs. New Jersey point guard Jason Kidd was fined $20,000 this season after he called an officiating crew "three blind mice."
"I'll pay a fine," Duncan said, "if it's a fine for laughing."
Duncan accused Crawford on Sunday of having a "personal vendetta" against him. Spurs coach Gregg Popovich and some of the players also said they heard Crawford shout, "Do you want to fight?" when Duncan was speaking with Popovich near the team's bench.
Crawford also could be heard telling Popovich he thought Duncan was mocking the officials by laughing. When Popovich told Crawford that sounded like a personal complaint, Crawford gestured to the other two members of the officiating crew and said, "It is. It's personal to all three of us."
NBA commissioner David Stern has tried to reduce the amount of on-court complaining by players this season by instructing officials to issue technical fouls when warranted. But he also doesn't like having the referees upstage the players, which is one reason he is said to be taking a close look at Crawford's actions.
Crawford has been an NBA referee for more than 30 seasons, and this isn't the first time he has drawn the ire of league officials. After Crawford hit Dallas with four technical fouls, including the ejection of then-coach Don Nelson, in the first quarter of Game 2 of the 2003 Western Conference finals against the Spurs, Stern summoned him to New York for a meeting.
Officials with knowledge of the meeting said Stern was incensed about Crawford's quick trigger and described the commissioner's rant against the veteran referee as "an all-timer." The NBA usually doesn't announce any reprimands of its referees, and league officials wouldn't comment on the possibility of Crawford being suspended.
Crawford once quickly ejected Popovich during a game in Sacramento, then later apologized to the team, saying he had erred.
Duncan has had issues with another veteran referee, Jack Nies, after he was suspended one game three seasons ago for pushing Nies out of the way after a jump ball. But Duncan said he doesn't know when his trouble began with Crawford, who gave him a technical April 1 in Indiana.
Crawford routinely officiates high-profile playoff games, and Spurs officials have privately wondered how he will act if assigned to work one of their games this postseason.
"I don't worry about something like that lingering with Timmy at all because he doesn't have a vengeful bone in his body," Popovich said. "I think it will just be gone from his perspective."
Web Posted: 04/17/2007 12:08 AM CDT
Johnny Ludden
Express-News
MEMPHIS, Tenn. — NBA officials interviewed Tim Duncan about his ejection in Sunday's loss to Dallas as the league's investigation appeared to focus on the actions of referee Joey Crawford.
Duncan said he spoke with an NBA security representative Monday by phone and told him the same thing he told reporters the previous day when he was ejected by Crawford while sitting on the bench:
Crawford asked him if he wanted to fight before either technical foul was issued; he made only one verbal complaint to Crawford about a call; and he was laughing about a call against Fabricio Oberto when Crawford ejected him.
Duncan also admitted he cursed at Crawford but only after he had been ejected and had started to leave the court. Crawford said Duncan called him a "piece of (expletive)."
"I called him that," Duncan said. "But I wanted to make sure (league officials) knew that wasn't why I was ejected."
Spurs officials said they wouldn't be surprised if Duncan is fined for his comments to reporters. The NBA frowns on players publicly critiquing the referees, particularly when they single them out by name.
Dallas guard Jerry Stackhouse had to pay $30,000 last season when he unleashed a profanity-laced tirade about referee Dick Bavetta after a loss to the Spurs. New Jersey point guard Jason Kidd was fined $20,000 this season after he called an officiating crew "three blind mice."
"I'll pay a fine," Duncan said, "if it's a fine for laughing."
Duncan accused Crawford on Sunday of having a "personal vendetta" against him. Spurs coach Gregg Popovich and some of the players also said they heard Crawford shout, "Do you want to fight?" when Duncan was speaking with Popovich near the team's bench.
Crawford also could be heard telling Popovich he thought Duncan was mocking the officials by laughing. When Popovich told Crawford that sounded like a personal complaint, Crawford gestured to the other two members of the officiating crew and said, "It is. It's personal to all three of us."
NBA commissioner David Stern has tried to reduce the amount of on-court complaining by players this season by instructing officials to issue technical fouls when warranted. But he also doesn't like having the referees upstage the players, which is one reason he is said to be taking a close look at Crawford's actions.
Crawford has been an NBA referee for more than 30 seasons, and this isn't the first time he has drawn the ire of league officials. After Crawford hit Dallas with four technical fouls, including the ejection of then-coach Don Nelson, in the first quarter of Game 2 of the 2003 Western Conference finals against the Spurs, Stern summoned him to New York for a meeting.
Officials with knowledge of the meeting said Stern was incensed about Crawford's quick trigger and described the commissioner's rant against the veteran referee as "an all-timer." The NBA usually doesn't announce any reprimands of its referees, and league officials wouldn't comment on the possibility of Crawford being suspended.
Crawford once quickly ejected Popovich during a game in Sacramento, then later apologized to the team, saying he had erred.
Duncan has had issues with another veteran referee, Jack Nies, after he was suspended one game three seasons ago for pushing Nies out of the way after a jump ball. But Duncan said he doesn't know when his trouble began with Crawford, who gave him a technical April 1 in Indiana.
Crawford routinely officiates high-profile playoff games, and Spurs officials have privately wondered how he will act if assigned to work one of their games this postseason.
"I don't worry about something like that lingering with Timmy at all because he doesn't have a vengeful bone in his body," Popovich said. "I think it will just be gone from his perspective."
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Just sharing info... You know I have no stake in the Mavs-Spurs. But I love to see both sides go at it. Makes for interesting reading.mickgreen58;1458189 said:Still doesn't change the fact that Duncan, along with Mark Cuban are two of the biggest whiners in professional sports.
I am a Mavs fan and Mark Cuban and Tim Duncan are extremely annoying individuals.
Watching Tim Duncan during the playoffs run the opposite way after missing a shot with both of his hands up begging for a call sickens me to my stomach.
It was almost as bad as Tony Parker doing interviews on the sidelines during the Mavs/Sun Series after being booted out of the Playoffs by the Mavs professing his man love for Boris Diaw and calling the Mavs dirty
- Mike G.
Danny White
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mickgreen58;1458190 said:I dont think he got that joke Theebs, but trust me, I did
- Mike G.
Was it supposed to have been some kind of burn?
If so, it fell way short of the mark.
Am I just supposed to root for the local teams where I live? That makes no sense, especially given that this is posted on a Cowboys site. If that were the case, I figure the Cowboys would lose about 90% of their fans.
I freely admit... I don't get the "joke."
peplaw06
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I don't doubt that you think that... you're biased towards him. I on the other hand am biased against him. I think he's a good player, but I don't like what I perceive to be him asking for calls.Danny White;1458032 said:
I think Joey Crawford probably got his feelings hurt and lashed out. But I don't believe for one second that Duncan was an "innocent," as he would have us believe. "I was only laughing, enjoying the game..." Bull. He was laughing at the call, and I believe Crawford thought that Duncan was trying to show him up.
An offense worthy of being T'd up a second time and tossed? Probably not. But he wasn't innocent in the whole thing.
And it's not like Joey Crawford is a beloved individual in Dallas. He's got this reputation around the league. You have to know that about him, and react accordingly. You know he can go off, so once you get the first tech, better settle down, or you know what's going to happen.
theebs
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Danny White;1458205 said:
I was just asking, since your bashing all mavs fans and calling Dallas fans whiny, how are your local teams doing?
You realize that these same people root for the cowboys too? So calling them whiny is probably misguided.
oh and 90% of the cowboys fans dont live out of the market. There are a ton of them, formerly me around the country, but its not 90%.
MC KAos
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peplaw06;1457991 said:
how about dirk nowitsky, rasheed wallace, rip hamilton, vince carter and ray allen among others, the reason you think duncan is the biggest whinner is becuase of what just happened and because of the fact he plays for the team you hate and envy. By the way the whinniest players in the league are BY FAR ray allen and rasheed wallace.
Danny White
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Got it.theebs;1458228 said:
I'm just calling it as I see it. As peplaw correctly observed, however, I'm sure a lot of it has to do with our own personal biases.
I like the Cowboys, so I don't see our fans as whiny or complaining. I don't feel the same way about the Mavs, so maybe I focus on some of the behavior that I overlook in Cowboys fans, even if it's coming from the same person.
There are a couple of differences, however. The Cowboys have enjoyed a level of success over the years that the Mavs never had. And I think that may account for some of the acrimony and bitterness that I sense in some of the Mavs fans that doesn't exist in the same Cowboys fans. Also, to have an in-state rival have so much success I think breeds a little jealousy and resentment.
I also think that some vocal Mavs fans take their cue from Cuban, unfortunately. I never disliked the Mavs before Cuban.
When you get right down to it, though, when you have a rivalry like the Mavs and Spurs have developed, especially when they meet in the playoffs time and time again, you're going to have some strong feelings and biases on both sides. I think we all recognize that, and hopefully it doesn't get in the way of our fraternity as fellow Cowboys fans. :toast:
As for me and my local teams, I think my abject hatred for the Redsk*ns speaks for itself. Maybe it's because I'm a transplant to the area, and had my favorite teams already established before I moved here... or maybe it's because I live in Virginia as opposed to the District... but I've never developed an affinity for the local teams.
I have enjoyed going to some Wizards games, and I typically pull for them versus other teams in the East, but I certainly wouldn't call myself a fan. Hockey I could really care less about. You forgot to insult the Nationals... they suck pretty bad too, you know!
Lastly, you're probably right that 90% is too high. But I would venture to guess that it's a solid majority.