Men's 200m final - SPOILERS

[thekavorka]

if they included hopping and skipping races in track and field like they have all the different strokes in swimming, then Bolt would have more gold medals.

I just don't see the point of backstroke, breaststroke, or butterfly. If they're going to have those, then they should simulate the water conditions in which those strokes are actually useful.

 

[joseephuss]

What is the more difficult challenge? To win the 200m and 100m in one Olympics or to win the 400m and 200m in one Olympics?

I vote for the 400m and 200m. I just think that is the harder combo to just compete in during one Olympics much less win both. Now having said that I think Bolt's accomplishment tops Michael Johnson's, because Bolt broke the world record in both his events.

To me the first week belonged to Phelps and the second week belongs to Bolt. I don't think one is greater than the other. They share the title of being the best at this Olympics. Phelps has done something that no one as ever done. Bolt has done something that very few have ever done. Both are just incredible.

I heard how Bolt put more effort into his 200m race and didn't let up as he did in the 100m. When I watched the race I saw him watching the clock as he came down the last 20 meters. It is amazing to think that he may have been able to run just a little bit faster if he ran with his eyes looking straight down the track the whole way.

I have enjoyed being able to witness these great accomplishments.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

All the white world perhaps, but not the entire world.

You don't have Kenyans swimming and medalling, Eritreans etc

Swimming is a rich man's sport. Track anyone can run.

If as expected Jamaica wins the 4x100 Gold, Bolt will have been in 3 events and won all three. He has just been in fewer events.

As for greatest sprinter of all time, that is debatable but no way can you put a drug cheat like Lewis up there as the best ever. Jessie Owens, yeah possible but he wouldn't even qualify today.

At this point no one has run better 100, 200m in the same competition than Bolt. I think Valery Borzov was the last non cheating guy to do it in 1972 and he probably cheated too.

Black Men Can't Swim? I don't know that this is a valid argument.

China, Russia, Australia, all of the Eastern Block countries, all of the European countries, All of your Asian countires, all of the North American and South American Countries compete in Swimming. The agrument that All The White World is interested but nobody else is ludicrous. The fact is that the Majority of the world is interested in swimming.

Bolt has been in one Olympic Games. He will have to show sustained excellence in order to get him consideration as the greatest, IMO.

There is no proof of dooping with Lewis. I have seen no reports on what he failed, why he failed or reasoning behind why he was excused. While I know it's very popular for you boys up North to convict Lewis because of what happened to Johnson, I will not buy into that line of reasoning. Lewis won 10 gold medals in multiple Olympic games spanning a competative career of 15 years. If proof is presented that he was dooping in all three Olympics, then I will conceed the point. However, at this time, there is no way I would not consider him as one of the greatest Track and Field Athletes that has ever lived. I would also point out the fact that nobody knows what might turn up with Bolt in regards to dooping.

Owens' times may not be competative now but then again, if Bolt had to run under the same conditions as Owens did, I wonder how he might fair. Same training, techniques, nutrition and lets put him in the middle of **** Germany in 1934 with SS troops lining the field and see just how well he runs. I doubt he would be throwing his arms up in victory half way through the 100. It is disengenous to say that Owens would not be competative. You don't know what Owens would or would not do in todays world of Track and Field. You only know what he was able to accomplish at the time he was competing and at that time, he accomplished more then what Bolt has accomplished thus far.

I am not saying that Bolt may not ultimatly end up being the best sprinter the world has ever seen. I'm saying he is not at this point IMO.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

if they included hopping and skipping races in track and field like they have all the different strokes in swimming, then Bolt would have more gold medals.

I just don't see the point of backstroke, breaststroke, or butterfly. If they're going to have those, then they should simulate the water conditions in which those strokes are actually useful.

This is not a valid argument IMO. If Bolt were a wrestler or boxer then I would be much more sympothetic to this line of reasoning but as I mentioned earlier, Lewis won 10 medels in Track and field. There are plenty of running events that Bolt could participate in, if he were good enough to qualify. He could run the 400. He could run distance or long jump. He elects to participate in 2 events because he excells in those events. However, he is not limited to the events he can try and participate in. If anything, this only illustrates, that much more clearly, why Phelps is the best Olympian in modern history. To be versitile enough to dominate in as many events as he does is truely remarkable.

 

[thekavorka]

The difference between running and long jump is huge compared to something like butterfly and freestyle.

If anything, Carl Lewis is the greatest olympian in modern history.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

The fact Lewis failed three drug tests in 1988 and now won't discuss them because they "are in the past" is telling enough don't you think? If it were just one, then yeah ok maybe he accidentally took the wrong cough medicine, but three, come on.

We all know the US sprint program was dirty, no dirtier than any other country but dirty nonetheless. Leroy Burrell, Marion Jones, Tim Montgomery, Florence Griffiths-Joyner who came out of nowhere to win, then retired only to die from a disease we all know was steroid induced at a very young age), Justin Gatlin need I go on?

Johnson was stupid and got caught but that does not mean he was the only one. You know it and I know it.

I never stated black men could not swim, that is your interpretation of it and a straw man argument.

All you need to do is look at the medal winners and you will know that other than a handful of Japanese, Chinese and Koreans and the one black on your 4x100 relay, the swimming events were won by whites. It is not an all in inclusive sport like track (and yes I know the sprint finals were all black).

In any event, your argument proved my point, you only pointed to Europe, North America, South America (where they were white South Americans) and some asian countries competing in swimming. It is not all inclusive.

 

[Bizwah]

The fact Lewis failed three drug tests in 1988 and now won't discuss them because they "are in the past" is telling enough don't you think? If it were just one, then yeah ok maybe he accidentally took the wrong cough medicine, but three, come on.

We all know the US sprint program was dirty, no dirtier than any other country but dirty nonetheless. Leroy Burrell, Marion Jones, Tim Montgomery, Florence Griffiths-Joyner who came out of nowhere to win, then retired only to die from a disease we all know was steroid induced at a very young age), Justin Gatlin need I go on?

Johnson was stupid and got caught but that does not mean he was the only one. You know it and I know it.

I never stated black men could not swim, that is your interpretation of it and a straw man argument.

All you need to do is look at the medal winners and you will know that other than a handful of Japanese, Chinese and Koreans and the one black on your 4x100 relay, the swimming events were won by whites. It is not an all in inclusive sport like track (and yes I know the sprint finals were all black).

In any event, your argument proved my point, you only pointed to Europe, North America, South America (where they were white South Americans) and some asian countries competing in swimming. It is not all inclusive.

Really?

I don't know how it is in your country, but here....innocent until PROVEN guilty.

I've looked around and all I've seen are ALLEGATIONS that Lewis and several others "doped".

Do "allegations" = "fact"?

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Failed drug test = illegal substance n'est ce pas?

The fact Lewis has not gone out to deny the reports means there is something to them, n'est ce pas?

The fact he doped is not a big issue for me, it was his holier than thou attitude where he made out he was clean and it was a shame he kept losing to the drugged Johnson that is most annoying.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

http://www.theage.com.au/cgi-bin/co...?path=/articles/2003/04/20/1050777164425.html

Of course, now Lewis is running around saying he was clean etc and that his proudest Gold was the 1988 one for a race he didn't win because he showed he did it the right way etc.

Funny how Carla doesn't mind talking about the past when it serves his purpose.

 

[peplaw06]

I don't know how you can hate America so much then be a fan of "America's Team."

 

[Nors]

Didn't Howard Cosell get fired for his comments on Swimming? LOL

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

I don't know how you can hate America so much then be a fan of "America's Team."

does hating Carl Lewis now equal hating the USA? will wonders never cease

 

[DallasCowpoke]

The difference between running and long jump is huge compared to something like butterfly and freestyle.

You either don't know how to swim, or are simply brain-dead if you believe this to be true.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

The fact Lewis failed three drug tests in 1988 and now won't discuss them because they "are in the past" is telling enough don't you think? If it were just one, then yeah ok maybe he accidentally took the wrong cough medicine, but three, come on.

We all know the US sprint program was dirty, no dirtier than any other country but dirty nonetheless. Leroy Burrell, Marion Jones, Tim Montgomery, Florence Griffiths-Joyner who came out of nowhere to win, then retired only to die from a disease we all know was steroid induced at a very young age), Justin Gatlin need I go on?

Johnson was stupid and got caught but that does not mean he was the only one. You know it and I know it.

I never stated black men could not swim, that is your interpretation of it and a straw man argument.

All you need to do is look at the medal winners and you will know that other than a handful of Japanese, Chinese and Koreans and the one black on your 4x100 relay, the swimming events were won by whites. It is not an all in inclusive sport like track (and yes I know the sprint finals were all black).

In any event, your argument proved my point, you only pointed to Europe, North America, South America (where they were white South Americans) and some asian countries competing in swimming. It is not all inclusive.

The point of your argument was that Lewis should not be considered as one of the Greatest Sprinters in the History of the Olympic Games. Your reasoning behind this is that he was dirty. If you can't produce proof of this, then your argument holds no validity. It's as simple as that. You make the point that every track and field team is dirty but your ready to proclaim Bolt as the greatest ever and no information on if he is dooping or not has even been produced. Your Biased and that's fine. Just so long as we are all clear here. Your Biased.

You never stated Black Men Can't Swim. You said Swimming is only important to White People. I did not prove your point for you. You shoot your own theory so full of holes by making that statement that you can not recover. That's the truth. The problem here is that we are not talking about who won gold medals in Swimming. We are talking about who is interested in Swimming. Those are two different things. The countries I mentioned are not all white and they are clearly interested in Swimming. Your statement is BS. That is the truth. This is something we do both know.

I basically mentioned every country in the world, other then Middle Eastern and African Countries. I am some what surprised that I would have to bring this to your attention but the majority of the people who live in the countries mentioned are not White. Shocker huh?

The fact of the matter is that each region of the world has there own qualifying groups and meets that are held for the specific purpose of producing athletes that can compete in the Olympic Games. So, if Japan, China, Korea, whomever else might be included in that world region, produces fast enough times, then they can send there swimmers to the games. If they can not, then they don't. The winners of these events are irrelivant. That was not the point of the discussion. The point of the discussion was if the world is interested in Swimming or not. Clearly they are or they would not be trying to qualify swimmers for the Games. There really is no arguement here.

As a side note, I was listening to Fox Sports this morning and they were say that Track and Field, over the past decade or so, has enjoyed a steady decline of interest World Wide. The attribute this to the fact that the sport is so riddled with drug enhancing issues that the World is just not as interested in it as it once was. Now, I'm not saying that's correct or incorrect but I am saying that somebody, other then posters on this board apparently feel as if Track and Field is not as popular as it once was. They also mentioned that Phelps and his performances are showing effects already. They were saying that pools, at least in this country, are over run with young children who are immulating Phelps. I don't know how you would come to the conclusion that this is, in fact, the case. Especially since it is the middle of summer and pools are busy this time of year anyway but, they did specifically make the point that interest in swimming is up and the specifically said that young children of all ethnic backrounds were interested. Not just White. I thought that was very interesting.

 

[peplaw06]

does hating Carl Lewis now equal hating the USA? will wonders never cease

Yeah that's all

You berate all things American at every opportunity. It's not just about sprinters. When people question the age of Chinese gymnasts, you question the age of Shawn Johnson despite no evidence of even a suspicion that she is underage. You apparently can't stand Michael Phelps.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

You either don't know how to swim, or are simply brain-dead if you believe this to be true.

In my view, both are amazing accomplishments. Three WRs and three golds for Bolt in three events, Seven WRs, eight golds in eight event for Phelps.

Arguing over who gave the best performance is an exercise in futility. If you like track, you will pick Bolt. If you like swimming you will pick Phelps.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

In my view, both are amazing accomplishments. Three WRs and three golds for Bolt in three events, Seven WRs, eight golds in eight event for Phelps.

Arguing over who gave the best performance is an exercise in futility. If you like track, you will pick Bolt. If you like swimming you will pick Phelps.

I ran track in HS. I love Track and Field. Sometimes, when I have time, I still go out and watch HS track meets. I'd still pick Phelps and his accomplishments over Bolt. As a young boy, I never thought I would see anything to match what Mark Spitz did. I was wrong. Phelps was unbelievable. Bolt was impressive, to say the least, but Phelps did things that have never been seen before. Remarkable.