Most remarkable athlete

[TellerMorrow34]

Michael Jordan might have been the best I ever saw as simply a great athlete but also great as his chosen profession.

Deion Sanders, much as people didn't like him for his attitude, was a great athlete because he was great at football (Great on defense and actually not bad, at all, on offense) but also pretty good at baseball as well. From what I understand he's not a bad basketball player either, so he's up there as well.

 

[Biggems]

Dan and Dave HANDS DOWN

 

[lewpac]

Rocky Marciano would have taken Liston.

Floyd Paterson showed up for the Liston fight (after years of running from him) with a Halloween disguise in his bag. What kind of fighter, the heavyweight champion of the world BTW, shows up with a disguise.

Oh, he used it too to get out of the joint after the fight.

I love Rocky Marciano and I respect his accomplishments. But Liston would've put him away in five or less rounds.

Liston, the son of a share-cropper, was one of 18 children. He spent the first half of his life in and out of reform schools. He was beaten with sticks and bats while growing up in Arkansas in the 50's. No person could hurt him with gloved-fists!!

Before the first Liston-Clay fight, the doctor checking the fighters said the Clay's pulse, heartbeat and disposition was like that of a man going to the guillotine!! He recommended that Clay not fight at all!!

Everyone knows that Clay never hit Liston with that "phantom punch", and that Liston was seriously implicated with the Vegas-mob. Both Clay-Liston fights were bought-&-sold, and every boxing historian knows it.

Sonny Liston was "the baddest man" ever in boxing. Had he not been so easily corrupted due to his lack of education and upbringing, not only would he have never lost a fight, he also would've had a 98% knockout rate........

 

[trickblue]

I agree... Nanu was amazing...

None of these guys could have ever CARRIED Jim Thorpe's shoes.

Can't believe it took 15 posts for Thorpe to get a mention...

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Floyd Paterson showed up for the Liston fight (after years of running from him) with a Halloween disguise in his bag. What kind of fighter, the heavyweight champion of the world BTW, shows up with a disguise.

Oh, he used it too to get out of the joint after the fight.

I love Rocky Marciano and I respect his accomplishments. But Liston would've put him away in five or less rounds.

Liston, the son of a share-cropper, was one of 18 children. He spent the first half of his life in and out of reform schools. He was beaten with sticks and bats while growing up in Arkansas in the 50's. No person could hurt him with gloved-fists!!

Before the first Liston-Clay fight, the doctor checking the fighters said the Clay's pulse, heartbeat and disposition was like that of a man going to the guillotine!! He recommended that Clay not fight at all!!

Everyone knows that Clay never hit Liston with that "phantom punch", and that Liston was seriously implicated with the Vegas-mob. Both Clay-Liston fights were bought-&-sold, and every boxing historian knows it.

Sonny Liston was "the baddest man" ever in boxing. Had he not been so easily corrupted due to his lack of education and upbringing, not only would he have never lost a fight, he also would've had a 98% knockout rate........

Very strong post. I don't know enough about the situations you're bringing up to agree or disagree but you seem to have at least done some serious research on the subject.

Maybe I'll look up some stuff on that at some point. Sounds interesting.

 

[jwhardin]

jay novacek, football, rodeo, decathelete. Earl Campbell

 

[theebs]

Bo Jackson

If he hadn't hurt his hip who knows what he could have done.

I was going to say bo jackson.

He looked ridiculous running the football and was a good guy.

 

[DallasCowpoke]

I'd like to put in a vote for Gale Sayers.

 

[lewpac]

Very strong post. I don't know enough about the situations you're bringing up to agree or disagree but you seem to have at least done some serious research on the subject.

Maybe I'll look up some stuff on that at some point. Sounds interesting.

I'm surprised that a movie hasn't been made about Sonny Liston already. It's a fascinating story and an epic tale like a Greek Tragedy.

At his autopsy, it was noted twice about the number of scars he had on his back because of whippings and beatings from his father. He spent his youth avoiding his old man as much as possible.

He was a monster of a man for his time. He was 6'1" tall, weighed in at around 235-250, and had an 84 inch reach. He learned boxing in prison. Nobody knew his age. At his last fight, some had him at 38 yrs. old, others had him at 50!! That's how mysterious the whole thing was.

After the second slaughter of Patterson, Clay jumped into the ring with his "I'm the greatest" act. Liston ignored him. Clay followed Liston to a casino, Liston was shooting dice. Clay confronted Liston at the table, and Liston fired two shots at Clay. Turned out that Liston was ready for this type of foolishness from Clay, and that he loaded the gun with blanks. Later, Clay said something like "I act crazy, he IS crazy!!"

There's no physical way that Clay could've beaten Liston. Wasn't possible. It was like a battleship fighting a bar of soap!!! Even if Clay was faster and slicker and tricky, he could IN NO WAY hurt Liston.

Anyway, I'm a boxing guy. Ask me any question going back to the 20's, and I probably know the answer without Googling it! About 30 years ago, I got the "Liston bug", and it got my attention. Especially because I have no use for Muhammed Ali...............Sorry, I know it's not the popular opinion, but from my vantage point, he was a good fighter who was full of **** with his mouth. He TALKED people into thinking he was "the greatest".

THE GREATEST Heavyweight Champion EVER was either Joe Louis or Rocky Marciano...................according to the numbers and the records. Of course, it's an undying argument about WHO was the greatest ever. But, simply saying "I'M THE GREATEST, I'M THE GREATEST" over and over again doesn't make it so.......................

 

[CF74]

None of these guys could have ever CARRIED Jim Thorpe's shoes.

Jim Thorpe came to mind. Thorpe and Sweetness, pillars of the game no doubt...

 

[burmafrd]

Lew maybe you ought to go do a little more research. Most of the people who were around when both Liston and Rocky were fighting think it would have been a great fight but that Rocky's quickness would have gotten the deal done. Liston was a top fighter but he was not the monster you make him out to be.
I do agree that there certainly was something going on in the second fight. But then boxing from the early 50's through the early 70's was probably as dirty a sport as there ever has been.

 

[lewpac]

Lew maybe you ought to go do a little more research. Most of the people who were around when both Liston and Rocky were fighting think it would have been a great fight but that Rocky's quickness would have gotten the deal done. Liston was a top fighter but he was not the monster you make him out to be.
I do agree that there certainly was something going on in the second fight. But then boxing from the early 50's through the early 70's was probably as dirty a sport as there ever has been.

It's hard to say....................

Rocky just kept on coming..............and coming and coming..........

The rap on Marciano is that he fought during a time that wasn't exactly the "golden era" of the heavyweight division. His biggest outings were against a shot-out and 40-something Jersey Joe Walcott, and an aging and washed up Ezzard Charles. He fought Joe Louis when Joe had to come out of retirement to pay his taxes.................

In between, during the 50's, he fought another 45 "nobody's". I'm a fan of Rocky, but that's the rap against his undefeated record.

The thing about boxing, is that the "debate" will go on forever, because the handfull of "greatest evers" fought in different era's. So, technically, there's never a way of ever knowing without going "toe-to-toe". Some say that Jack Johnson or Dempsey may have been "the greatest ever".

I DO THINK that Rocky would've knocked Ali into yesterday..........easily. Probably would've taken out most others too. Joe Louis, Liston, and Mike Tyson in his prime would've been a good test for Marciano. Say what you want about Tyson, another "Greek Tragedy". But, for a moment in time, he also may have been unbeatable.

Technically, the most superb "fighter" in history was Roy Jones Jr. Speed, power, footwork, defense, inside, outside, knockout power, etc.........you name it, and Roy Jones was the total package at his peak. Sugar Ray Robinson is probably second.......................

 

[lewpac]

When Roy Jones Jr. fought James "Lights Out" Tony in November of 1994, I remember a pre-fight debate I had with this guy.

He was talking about what a great fight it would be, really close, could go either way, etc..................

I remember telling him, "I'll betcha' $100.00 that Toney never even touches Jones"!!! He didn't take the bet. Good thing for me, because I think Toney connected maybe a half dozen times over twelve rounds with Jones.

THAT'S how great Roy Jones Jr. was, for a decade or so. It wasn't until the Carver fights, Jones now well past his prime, that Roy started to go a little down hill.

I took my wife to see Roy Jones Jr. defeat Ruiz for the heavyweight championship of the world in Vegas in March of '03. It was the first fight my wife ever saw "live", and it was worth every dollar.............

So, IMO, the BEST Heavyweight to ever lace up the gloves was Liston.
The purest and most perfect fighting machine to ever live was Roy Jones Jr.
My FAVORITE fighter ever, personally, was Thomas "The Hit Man", "The Motor City Cobra" Hearns.
The fighters I dislike the most are Bugar Ray Leonard, Pernell Whitaker, Clay/Ali, and Aaron Pryor. I hate the "pretty boys" pitter-patter dancers. I like the "bangers" like Tyson and Frazier and Hagler and Hearns...................

 

[burmafrd]

Tyson truly was a tragedy. If Gus had not died, who knows. He was the only one Tyson ever listened to. I remember when Tyson took out Spinks- talk about a guy who was terrified and looking for a place to fall!!!!
AND Tyson was just 20 years old. He could have been the greatest of all since he had ALL the physical tools and the mentality to kill in the ring.

 

[lewpac]

I agree.............

Cus DeAmoto also trained Floyd Patterson out of the Catskill Mountains in NY. Patterson also had a troubled youth, in and out of reform schools, getting in trouble.

Cus did the same thing with both Patterson and Tyson. He took them both in, almost adopting them both, and they just lived with DeAmoto since their early teens.

Patterson "got it". By all accounts, Floyd Patterson was a gentleman and sportsman, well spoken and great with the media and fans. Tyson never fully exorcized his street demons I guess. Plus, Cus did pass away when Tyson was about 19 I think. Still, Teddy Atlas, who also worked with Cus for decades, was certainly up to the task to keep the Tyson ship afloat. Until Mike hit on Atlas's wife. That about did it for THAT deal................

No matter what there reason or why, the Tyson saga is a true tragedy and waste of what could've been the legitimate "greatest ever".............

 

[Rampage]

When Roy Jones Jr. fought James "Lights Out" Tony in November of 1994, I remember a pre-fight debate I had with this guy.

He was talking about what a great fight it would be, really close, could go either way, etc..................

I remember telling him, "I'll betcha' $100.00 that Toney never even touches Jones"!!! He didn't take the bet. Good thing for me, because I think Toney connected maybe a half dozen times over twelve rounds with Jones.

THAT'S how great Roy Jones Jr. was, for a decade or so. It wasn't until the Carver fights, Jones now well past his prime, that Roy started to go a little down hill.

I took my wife to see Roy Jones Jr. defeat Ruiz for the heavyweight championship of the world in Vegas in March of '03. It was the first fight my wife ever saw "live", and it was worth every dollar.............

So, IMO, the BEST Heavyweight to ever lace up the gloves was Liston.
The purest and most perfect fighting machine to ever live was Roy Jones Jr.
My FAVORITE fighter ever, personally, was Thomas "The Hit Man", "The Motor City Cobra" Hearns.
The fighters I dislike the most are Bugar Ray Leonard, Pernell Whitaker, Clay/Ali, and Aaron Pryor. I hate the "pretty boys" pitter-patter dancers. I like the "bangers" like Tyson and Frazier and Hagler and Hearns...................

that's a bold statement for a guy who really couldn't take a punch.

 

[lewpac]

that's a bold statement for a guy who really couldn't take a punch.

Bullshirt.....................

Roy Jones Jr. was impenetrable, unbeatable, and pert'near perfect in his prime. He could take a punch alright, but you never would know it because no one could ever actually hit him.

The game is all about "hit, and don't get hit". Don't blame Jones because he was so superb that he never got hit.

No one comes close to the total package. He had speed, defense, power, a jab, a right, a left hook, knockout power, footwork, ring generalship, etc..........you name it. Jones is THE TEXTBOOK for any fighter wanting to learn the craft. He was like a praying mantice, a cobra, and a gorilla all at once in the ring. No one ever comes close to Roy Jones Jr. ............

 

[Hoofbite]

Roy Jones Jr.
Dr. J
Derek Jeter
Lynn Swann
Tommy Hearns

Roy Jones should have known when to quit.

 

[Hoofbite]

Bullshirt.....................

Roy Jones Jr. was impenetrable, unbeatable, and pert'near perfect in his prime. He could take a punch alright, but you never would know it because no one could ever actually hit him.

The game is all about "hit, and don't get hit". Don't blame Jones because he was so superb that he never got hit.

No one comes close to the total package. He had speed, defense, power, a jab, a right, a left hook, knockout power, footwork, ring generalship, etc..........you name it. Jones is THE TEXTBOOK for any fighter wanting to learn the craft. He was like a praying mantice, a cobra, and a gorilla all at once in the ring. No one ever comes close to Roy Jones Jr. ............

What are you talking about?

Maybe if that textbook was called "keeping it real in the ring". The way he hung his hand, danced around, and left himself open while tauting the other fighter is pretty much exactly what you DO NOT want to do in a fight.

That would work for no one else because no one else is gifted enough to pull it off. The man was a hell of fighter, fun to watch and put on a show but I dare anyone to try and emulate that and have the same success.

 

[Hoofbite]

Muhammed Ali is considered the most recognized man in the world. Even more than the Pope or the President.

Tiger Woods is nearing that kind of aura.

Tiger is pretty nuts. Before it is all said and down, Tiger should be on everyone's list.

I don't care if you agree with it being a sport or not. I've heard Skip Bayless say it isn't but what Lance Armstrong did was unbelievable.