Murder of the 2 soldiers in Iraq-- I'm very sad and angry...

[Concord]

I am of the opinion that there is no higher support of the troops, than to wish them to get out of harms way.

Too many fail to see this and just think that anyone that does not support the war do not support the troops.

I know and nothing could be further from the truth.

 

[Hostile]

I am of the opinion that there is no higher support of the troops, than to wish them to get out of harms way.

Too many fail to see this and just think that anyone that does not support the war do not support the troops.

In principle I agree with this BP. In practice I don't think it works. I was never in the military, so maybe I'm speaking about something I know nothing about. However, I am pretty sure that if I was in the military I'd be offended by commentary not supporting the war. In fact I know I would be, and I'm not saying that because I support the war. I'm saying that because I've seen the effects of the Viet Nam protests on members of my own family.

There are people who can separate the politics from the soldier, but there just as many who won't. That's why protesters shout "baby killer" at our soldiers. They're trying to guilt people into supporting their politics. Please note that in saying this I am not making a political statement. This practice has been done in military engagements undertaken by both political parties.

Are there people who just want our soldiers home? Yeah, but nobody wants them home more than their own families and their families with rare exceptions are not protesting them being there. Our military have jobs to do. If it wasn't in Iraq and Afghanistan it would be somewhere else. They are always going to be targets of radicals, even when we aren't at war. Personally I'd rather be shot at by insurgents than reviled at home the way our Viet Nam vets were. I'd rather die for my country on foreign soil than listen to their taunts on land I defended.

Sorry, didn't mean to stand on a soapbox and rant. I hope no one is offended by my words.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

In principle I agree with this BP. In practice I don't think it works. I was never in the military, so maybe I'm speaking about something I know nothing about. However, I am pretty sure that if I was in the military I'd be offended by commentary not supporting the war. In fact I know I would be, and I'm not saying that because I support the war. I'm saying that because I've seen the effects of the Viet Nam protests on members of my own family.

There are people who can separate the politics from the soldier, but there just as many who won't. That's why protesters shout "baby killer" at our soldiers. They're trying to guilt people into supporting their politics. Please note that in saying this I am not making a political statement. This practice has been done in military engagements undertaken by both political parties.

Are there people who just want our soldiers home? Yeah, but nobody wants them home more than their own families and their families with rare exceptions are not protesting them being there. Our military have jobs to do. If it wasn't in Iraq and Afghanistan it would be somewhere else. They are always going to be targets of radicals, even when we aren't at war. Personally I'd rather be shot at by insurgents than reviled at home the way our Viet Nam vets were. I'd rather die for my country on foreign soil than listen to their taunts on land I defended.

Sorry, didn't mean to stand on a soapbox and rant. I hope no one is offended by my words.

Not a soapbox rant IMO and you bring up some good points.

With any group you will get those that lose the original point and take things way to far.

You use the protesters during Viet Nam to express your point and you are dead on using them. They flat out lost the point and just took things WAY too far.

No returning vet deserved what they got. Those protestors were so far gone they forgot that those men were drafted, not voluntary guys.

However I still hold true to my statement. The best support for the troops is to hope they are out of harms way. Now if people stick to that general principal and not let other things get in the way they are fine.

It is just too bad people get too caught up in their own agenda and they forget the point and are just protesting to be protesting.

Acutally IMO the troops never get enough respect when coming back, and not just from the citizens, but also from the very people that sent them in the first place. I will leave it at that as not to turn it political.

 

[Hostile]

Not a soapbox rant IMO and you bring up some good points.

With any group you will get those that lose the original point and take things way to far.

You use the protesters during Viet Nam to express your point and you are dead on using them. They flat out lost the point and just took things WAY too far.

No returning vet deserved what they got. Those protestors were so far gone they forgot that those men were drafted, not voluntary guys.

However I still hold true to my statement. The best support for the troops is to hope they are out of harms way. Now if people stick to that general principal and not let other things get in the way they are fine.

It is just too bad people get too caught up in their own agenda and they forget the point and are just protesting to be protesting.

Acutally IMO the troops never get enough respect when coming back, and not just from the citizens, but also from the very people that sent them in the first place. I will leave it at that as not to turn it political.

If it stopped at that, I'd agree. I really would. It will never stop at that with far too many people.

Thanks for the great repsonse.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

If it stopped at that, I'd agree. I really would. It will never stop at that with far too many people.

Thanks for the great repsonse.

First and foremost I am for the support of the troops and only want them out of harms way.

 

[Hostile]

First and foremost I am for the support of the troops and only want them out of harms way.

I believe that 100%, but it's because I know you BP. Albeit through the void of the Internet, but I know you. I have no reason to be skeptical of you.

Given what has happened in the past to our soldiers I feel they have every right to be skeptical of people they don't know. That's all I'm saying. I wouldn't want to hear these things if I were a soldier because it would remind me of the past and put me on guard immediately.

You put it extremely well. They "lost the point" and went too far. I can't say it any better than that. Sometimes losing the point is innocent and it can still hurt.

Let me give you an example, and I hope this makes sense. I have a friend named Jack. Jack's a Viet Nam vet. We were at a party about a year ago and someone brought up something about a Jane Fonda movie. Jack is a rather gregarious guy, but he got real quiet.

So someone asks Jack if he'd seen the movie. Jack replied that he would never watch a movie she was in. Turns out Jack was in the Hanoi Hilton. None of us knew that except his wife and daughter. He doesn't talk about it. His son-in-law, who is one of my best friend's, didn't even know.

One of our group of partiers, Laurie, is a sweet lady who wouldn't harm a fly. She is very much anti war, and similar to what you are saying she does care about our troops. Naturally people wanted to know about Nam. Laurie was no different. She asked what seemed like innocent questions, but the intent was to find out why Jack served in the first place.

It's like a light went off in my head that day. People actually think soldiers have the option of just walking away from their sworn duty with no repurcussions at all. I know Laurie's intent in asking the things she did and feeling the way she does is because at heart she is a good person. I'm not saying she would call Jack a baby killer. I know she wouldn't. But as tame and innocent as she is, her words and ideas and most of all her probing questions about why he was there hurt Jack.

The thought that wanting them home safe is the highest form of support is a great thought. In principle I agree, there is no higher thought. Not thoughts of honor or duty or praise. Those aren't higher. Sometimes our thoughts and actions don't measure up to our priciples.

I'd better stop talking about this. I worry I'll offend someone and I have no intentions of doing that.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Yes I understand.

And really we are lucky as a country to have a Volunteer military as compared to a drafted army.

It is much different as time changes.

WWII to Viet Nam was a big difference IMO.

Viet Nam to now is much different as well.

And for the record...I don't, to my knowledge, watch Jane either.
The wife bought that movie Monster and law and started watching it. I came in after it started and said is that Jane and she said yes.

I went to another room to read until the movie was over LOL.

I think many people have learned from that era. Not all, but much more now compared to then.

 

[Hostile]

Yes I understand.

And really we are lucky as a country to have a Volunteer military as compared to a drafted army.

It is much different as time changes.

WWII to Viet Nam was a big difference IMO.

Viet Nam to now is much different as well.

And for the record...I don't, to my knowledge, watch Jane either.
The wife bought that movie Monster and law and started watching it. I came in after it started and said is that Jane and she said yes.

I went to another room to read until the movie was over LOL.

I think many people have learned from that era. Not all, but much more now compared to then.

I consider myself very lucky. That's one of the reasons why I am not political or into discussing politics.

I see no benefit to griping about a country that gives me a life I couldn't have anywhere else.

Could things be better? Sure, but accomplishing better has never begun from hatred, and right now the political parties and their sheep hate each other.

What a waste of good life. It's theirs to waste. I have no room to judge how they fill their lives with propoganda. To each his own.