No Respect

OmerV said:
What respect have the Vikings and Bears earned?
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The Vikings did reach the NFC title game a couple years ago and the Bears who just won their division appear to be an up-and-coming team. The Cowboys are up one year and down the next that’s been the pattern for more than a decade. Every time they make the playoffs they miss the playoffs the following year. Not saying it’s going to happen again but for them to gain respect they have to put back to back good seasons together.
 
Good

We don’t meet expectations when they’re given
 
KJJ said:
The Vikings did reach the NFC title game a couple years ago and the Bears who just won their division appear to be an up-and-coming team. The Cowboys are up one year and down the next that’s been the pattern for more than a decade. Every time they make the playoffs they miss the playoffs the following year. Not saying it’s going to happen again but for them to gain respect they have to put back to back good seasons together.
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If it matters what the Vikings did 2 years ago, then why doesn't it matter that the Bears were 5-11 2 years ago? Can't prop up one team by looking at 2017 and prop up another by ignoring 2017. And what about the Packers who have had losing records that last 2 season ... do we go back to 2016 to include them in the conversation? If so, the Cowboys have won their division 2 of the last 3 years (and 3 of the last 5), which none of those 3 teams can match.

Bottom line is I don't actually disagree that the Vikes and Bears are worthy of being in the conversation. Maybe even Packers too - hard to dismiss Aaron Rodgers. I just don't see them as any more worthy of being in the conversation than the Cowboys.
 
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aria said:
I honestly don’t think they’ll win but for those odds I can’t pass them up and would place them in the top 10 at least.
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Ya never know, I got 15-1 odds in 1992. Good luck brother!

As to the original OP, the media likes to stir things up for clicks. Vegas is setting odds for cash, that's why I tend to trust them more than the so called experts.
 
OmerV said:
Not an unreasonable thought, but what we are talking about "respect" in the form of consideration for teams that have a chance to win the conference, so should only the teams that made the conference championship last year qualify, and should teams that did not but seem to be on the rise be excluded?

And looking deeper at that standard, should Green Bay qualify since they haven't even been to the playoffs the last 2 years, haven't had a dominant regular season since 2014, and haven't gone deep into the playoffs since 2016?

Should Minnesota qualify based on a season 2 years ago even though the season before was 8-8, and last season was 8-7-1? Should Philly qualify for winning the Super Bowl in 2017 even though that is the only season where they won the division out of the last 5 years? What about Chicago, who had an outstanding season last year, but comes on the heels of 4 consecutive losing seasons and whose previous playoff season was 8 years before?

I think history has proven that aside from the Patriots, the contenders can change from year to year.
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True, to a certain extent. And the contenders do change.

But when the measurement range has consistently been between, say, Cleveland (low) and NE (high) for at least the last 20yrs, certain patterns become evident.

For instance, over my suggested 20yr span, we’ve been somewhat better than mediocre, but not quite (yet) elite. Would you agree with that?
 
Jarv said:
Ya never know, I got 15-1 odds in 1992. Good luck brother!

As to the original OP, the media likes to stir things up for clicks. Vegas is setting odds for cash, that's why I tend to trust them more than the so called experts.
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I was actually surprised, during the regular season the lines are actually grossly in favor of the Cowboys most games even when they “shouldn’t” win. They have such a big fan base and the average gambler often bets with their heart that the line moves even when it shouldn’t or even when they weren’t that good. The Yankees are good this year but it was the same way with them even when they weren’t. People were betting on the name, not the talent.
 
Blue&Silver said:
While I generally agree with that premise we did win the division last year, and by placing us behind the Eagles this year tells me they think our success last year was a fluke, and the Eagles lack of success was a fluke.
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We did defeat everyone 2 years ago and have huge injury waves last year. That counts for something.
 
Aerolithe_Lion said:
We did defeat everyone 2 years ago and have huge injury waves last year. That counts for something.
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So did the Eagles, they literally had to call guys sitting at home to play in their secondary. I believe for a good portion of the season they didn’t have one starter and only one or two second stringers playing in the secondary. They literally had an entire positional group decimated by injuries most of the season.

Commanders got it the worst though, it will be interesting to see how they do this year and NY just likes to trade away their best players and draft inappropriately.
 
like Brian Bilick once said when he was coaching the RAVENS on their way to a SB...walk up to the door, and kick it in! That's how you get respect in this league.Nothing is given, you TAKE IT.
 
aria said:
So did the Eagles, they literally had to call guys sitting at home to play in their secondary. I believe for a good portion of the season they didn’t have one starter and only one or two second stringers playing in the secondary. They literally had an entire positional group decimated by injuries most of the season.

Commanders got it the worst though, it will be interesting to see how they do this year and NY just likes to trade away their best players and draft inappropriately.
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The only healthy player they had in the secondary was Malcolm Jenkins. They lost all their other starters, and they lost all their backups and some backups to the backups...

The guys cut from other teams, and practice squad players from around the league started to figure it out towards the end of the year and they made a little run into the playoffs.

You can pretty much expect the same players that were injured to get injured again. In my mind them being healthy won't make them any better than they were with the guys that ended the season with.
 
GenoT said:
True, to a certain extent. And the contenders do change.

But when the measurement range has consistently been between, say, Cleveland (low) and NE (high) for at least the last 20yrs, certain patterns become evident.

For instance, over my suggested 20yr span, we’ve been somewhat better than mediocre, but not quite (yet) elite. Would you agree with that?
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Sure, I would agree that taken as a whole over the last 20 years the team has been mediocre, or possibly slightly better than that, but I don't really see a pattern over that 20 years other than never getting beyond the division round of the playoffs. You certainly can't look at a team at points over a 20 year period and view them as reflective of where the team is today. And that's not just true of the Cowboys. Before the Rams made the playoffs in 2017 it had been 14 years since their last playoff appearance, but that hasn't been reflective of the last 2 years. Before last year the Bears hadn't been to the playoffs in 8 years. Accordingly, while the past may be something to look at, I still think it's more important to look at where a team is today.

I will say a team has to prove it can get over the hump, and the Cowboys certainly have to prove that. But on the plus side, over that 20 year time frame the Cowboys have been to the division round 5 times, and 3 of those have been in the last 5 years. 2 of them in the last 3 years. So that at least shows a greater level of consistency than most of those 20 years. Obviously things could go South at any time, but at least from where things stand now, the team seems to be in a good stretch, with at least a chance to take another step forward.
 
I would have thought the Cowboys had earned more respect after starting 3-5 last year but still winning the division and a playoff game.

I’m excited for the team this season.
 
Techsass said:
Why not???
Do you have something better for us to be doing besides b*tch*ng & moan*ng until the season gets here?
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:huh: come to think of it, I don't. At least it allows me to ***** and moan about the *****ers and moaners :lmao:
 
OmerV said:
If it matters what the Vikings did 2 years ago, then why doesn't it matter that the Bears were 5-11 2 years ago? Can't prop up one team by looking at 2017 and prop up another by ignoring 2017. And what about the Packers who have had losing records that last 2 season ... do we go back to 2016 to include them in the conversation? If so, the Cowboys have won their division 2 of the last 3 years (and 3 of the last 5), which none of those 3 teams can match.

Bottom line is I don't actually disagree that the Vikes and Bears are worthy of being in the conversation. Maybe even Packers too - hard to dismiss Aaron Rodgers. I just don't see them as any more worthy of being in the conversation than the Cowboys.
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It doesn't matter what the Bears did 2 years ago because they're clearly a better team that's on the rise. They were 12-4, had the #1 defense and their young QB was much better last season than he was his rookie year. All the arrows are pointing up with them. The Vikings are still a good team despite missing the playoffs last season which is why they're in the conversation. As for the Packers they have Aaron Rodgers so they're always going to be in the conversation regardless if they're coming off a down year. They've beaten the Cowboys in the playoffs at home and on the road with Aaron Rodgers. They've won a championship with Rodgers and have been a much more consistent playoff team than the Cowboys. We're never going to receive more respect than the Packers until we prove we can beat them in the playoffs. What happened 2 years ago is going to matter with some teams which is why Philly who despite missing the playoffs last season is favored by many to win the NFC East in 2019. The media and oddsmakers are looking back to the SB they won in 2017.

What happened 2 years ago is why Carson Wentz receives more respect than Dak despite Dak having won more games and having a better head to head record. Everyone keeps looking back at the MVP season Wentz was having 2 years ago. Despite Dak having the better career so far and having a playoff win, Wentz is more respected. What's happened the past 10+ years is why many are blowing off the Cowboys chances in 2019. It's this make the playoffs one year and miss the playoffs the next year that has many disrespecting the team. The Cowboys are too inconsistent from one year to the next to be taken seriously by many. To change the negative perception many have of the Cowboys they need to have a solid 2019 season and go deep in the playoffs.
 
KJJ said:
It doesn't matter what the Bears did 2 years ago because they're clearly a better team that's on the rise. They were 12-4, had the #1 defense and their young QB was much better last season than he was his rookie year. All the arrows are pointing up with them. The Vikings are still a good team despite missing the playoffs last season which is why they're in the conversation. As for the Packers they have Aaron Rodgers so they're always going to be in the conversation regardless if they're coming off a down year. They've beaten the Cowboys in the playoffs at home and on the road with Aaron Rodgers. They've won a championship with Rodgers and have been a much more consistent playoff team than the Cowboys. We're never going to receive more respect than the Packers until we prove we can beat them in the playoffs. What happened 2 years ago is going to matter with some teams which is why Philly who despite missing the playoffs last season is favored by many to win the NFC East in 2019. The media and oddsmakers are looking back to the SB they won in 2017.

What happened 2 years ago is why Carson Wentz receives more respect than Dak despite Dak having won more games and having a better head to head record. Everyone keeps looking back at the MVP season Wentz was having 2 years ago. Despite Dak having the better career so far and having a playoff win, Wentz is more respected. What's happened the past 10+ years is why many are blowing off the Cowboys chances in 2019. It's this make the playoffs one year and miss the playoffs the next year that has many disrespecting the team. The Cowboys are too inconsistent from one year to the next to be taken seriously by many. To change the negative perception many have of the Cowboys they need to have a solid 2019 season and go deep in the playoffs.
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So, the point is what happened 2 years ago doesn’t matter with the Bears, but does with the Eagles. Still a double standard, no matter how you couch it. Either a one year look is legitimate or it’s not, or a look at the last couple of years as a whole is, or it’s not. Pick a side ...

Of course, with GB we are talking about a 3rd standard - 3 years ago. But it seems 3 years ago doesn’t apply when looking at the Cowboys vs the Bears and Eagles.

And it apparently matters that Rodgers has been the victor against Dak, but doesn’t matter that Dak has been the victor against Wentz. Yet another standard carefully crafted to fit a certain point of view.

And further still, it matters that Wentz started off 2 years ago with better stats than Dak, but doesn’t matter that Trubisky has never had better stats than Dak.

Hmmm....seems the standard is whatever works most against the Cowboys, even if it requires the standard being a moving target that can land anywhere and everywhere as long is it fits the desired narrative.

By the way, as for the Dak vs Wentz discussion, and the Dak vs Rodgers discussion, that was never the topic. The topic was about the teams, not individual players.
 
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