NY Giants 1st Rd Pick (G) Justin Pugh losing sleep

[jazzcat22]

Pugh was the higher-rated player on our draft board, so we might have taken him if he and Frederick had both been available. However since he was only rated one spot higher than Frederick, we might have preferred going with the center no matter what.

Sometimes, you're just lucky how the draft falls so you don't have to make that decision and end up choosing the wrong one.

This is so true more often than not.
Just think if we would have got Shazier, over Martin, or even to this point Donald over Martin.
Not saying those guys wouldn't have made a difference either. But anyone want a do-over at this point. I sure don't.

Everyone goes on about the greatness of Jimmy Johnson, and on that "great trade robbery" feature. They talked about how the Walker trade, as if it led directly to Emmitt. It didn't. Not aking anything away from Jimmy though.

Jimmy tried to trade up twice, once for James Francis, once for Lamar Lathon. #2 & #3 on the draft board. #1 was picked overall #1, can't remember who it was right now.
#4 was Emmitt Smith. I remember a comment, Jimmy saying since those trades didn't work to get a LB, and since they needed a RB, might as well select Emmitt. Since he was #4 on the board.
But the Giants needed a RB too, so the trade up with the Steelers. I think the Giants took Rodney Hampton after we took Emmitt.

Blair Thomas was selected at RB at #2 overall that year.

 

[AbeBeta]

He is from Philly and had a lot of family/friend distractions. Don't be surprised if he plays 100% better this week.

If a player is going to allow himself to be distracted by playing in his home town, he has a long way to go to be a pro. It isn't like he doesn't have 6 months free to see these folks in the off season

 

[AbeBeta]

From watching the Cowboy defense they've certainly been using much more press coverage underneath. It was even kind of surprising to me how much of that they used in the 2nd half of the Seattle game.

I don't think the run defense is any better than last season, but certainly the pass defense has tightened up.

I think the biggest difference is that our O is keeping the ball longer. That keeps the D from getting worn down and then exposed

 

[xwalker]

In 2013 the NY Giants spent the 19th overall pick on Syracuse (G) Justin Pugh. The media loved NY Giants were never called for a reach....it was just accepted as a good pick. The Cowboys passed on Pugh, traded out and picked up T. Frederick and T. Williams. The Dallas Cowboys were crucified in the media for reaching on Travis Frederick.

Fast Forward last week:

T. Frederick led the charge as the new #1 rushing offense pummeled the SB champs in their house.

Last week the NY Giants Justin Pugh gave up 6 sacks last week to the Eagles, now he says he's losing sleep.

Read the full story here... http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/...on_from_his_tough_game_agains_the_eagles.html

He is a smallish OT with short arms. He has to be perfect with his technique to be effective.

I was shocked that he was a first round pick.

 

[jterrell]

I thought the Pugh pick was a reach.

Pugh was a short armed RT. He is probably best suited at RG.
He was in no way worth what the Giants gave up but they were desperate for OL help and he had OG/RT flex plus was regional having played at Syracuse.

 

[guag]

I think the run defense is better overall, but there are still a few breakdowns each game. It seems like those breakdowns get lower and lower each week. I can only remember one big one in the Seattle game.

Aside from Lynch's 30+ yard run, I don't think he had much of anything over 5 or 6 yards.

 

[MrMom]

He is a smallish OT with short arms. He has to be perfect with his technique to be effective.

I was shocked that he was a first round pick.

According to the Talking Cowboys guys he would've been the Cowboys pick over Frederick had he lasted.

 

[Stash]

Aside from Lynch's 30+ yard run, I don't think he had much of anything over 5 or 6 yards.

That's how I remembered it. Not much other than that one big run.

 

[jobberone]

From watching the Cowboy defense they've certainly been using much more press coverage underneath. It was even kind of surprising to me how much of that they used in the 2nd half of the Seattle game.

I don't think the run defense is any better than last season, but certainly the pass defense has tightened up.

They had to press as part of the scheme to stop the read option. It takes away the pass option part.

 

[jterrell]

Pugh was the higher-rated player on our draft board, so we might have taken him if he and Frederick had both been available. However since he was only rated one spot higher than Frederick, we might have preferred going with the center no matter what.

Sometimes, you're just lucky how the draft falls so you don't have to make that decision and end up choosing the wrong one.

Sometimes it is situational beyond even that.
Pugh could probably be really good in Dallas as an RG.
The Giants needed him out at RT and he isn't built for it.

The OL reaches in front of Dallas is what made the TFred selection so awesome.
They traded down and didn't panic.
Got great value with TWill in r3 as a bonus.
The Escobar pick looks bad but that's almost beside the point with how well the other two have panned out.

 

[xwalker]

According to the Talking Cowboys guys he would've been the Cowboys pick over Frederick had he lasted.

Yes, they said that at the time of the draft. Luckily it didn't happen. Luckily they also didn't draft the DT Floyd.

I think the Cowboys draft board doesn't have the same meaning of other teams draft boards. They passed on Floyd that year and they passed on Manziel this year despite both being on their draft board.

Also, it's possible that the Cowboys had him on their draft board as a Guard instead of a Tackle.

 

[jterrell]

I think the run defense is better overall, but there are still a few breakdowns each game. It seems like those breakdowns get lower and lower each week. I can only remember one big one in the Seattle game.

But I'm liking seeing the secondary having a better understanding of playing both man and zone. Other than the occasional mistake from Wilcox, they look to be playing pretty solid now that Claiborne is out of the picture.

Definitely a better, more physical run game. It is hardly perfect because we still have safeties that can whiff and give up a big play but when Ro is in the game we are strong up the middle and generally deliver thumps.
Because the backers are making more plays guys have to release the DL earlier and those guys are also getting in some licks.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

To the Giants credit, it was not a promising looking draft class except for on the O-line. Everybody went after O-Linemen early and if you needed one like the Giants and Dallas did, then you had to 'reach' because in the end it wasn't likely to be a reach if somebody else was going to take them.

That's why I didn't think the Frederick pick was a reach. We badly needed O-Line help and even more importantly a new center. Most experts had Frederick as a mid-2nd. But at the pace that O-Linemen were going even ahead of the experts' projections...I think Frederick would have been snatched up by the 40th pick, if not earlier, has the Cowboys passed on him. IIRC, Pugh was considered a late first round early second round pick and the Giants decided to take him with how the draft was going.

I think the big thing about Frederick is that it shows how combine numbers can be deceiving for guards and centers. You really don't need a good 40-time if you're playing guard or center (I can see that more applying to tackles) and the bench press numbers can be useless because of how the player trains in weight lifting.

In today's game, if you want a good O-Line you must have a very good center. You can't have a great O-Line with an average center.





YR

 

[Joe Realist]

If a player is going to allow himself to be distracted by playing in his home town, he has a long way to go to be a pro. It isn't like he doesn't have 6 months free to see these folks in the off season

call it a lesson learned

 

[DFWJC]

I thought on draft day that most people thought Justin Pugh was a 1/2 to 1 rd reach.
That's revisionist history saying everyone loved them picking him in the middle of the first round.

Of course, many thought Freddy was a reach late in the 21st too. But at least Dallas traded down from mid 1st round to get him (and got Williams also) vs taking him right there...like NY did w/ Pugh.
They did need line help badly, so you can understand why they may have not wanted to risk it.

 

[Stash]

Definitely a better, more physical run game. It is hardly perfect because we still have safeties that can whiff and give up a big play but when Ro is in the game we are strong up the middle and generally deliver thumps.
Because the backers are making more plays guys have to release the DL earlier and those guys are also getting in some licks.

Yeah, it seems like we're good for at least one whiff (typically Wilcox and his growing pains) that goes for a big gain.

 

[ConstantReboot]

Pugh is a clone of Costa. Im so glad we didn't pick him.

 

[ConstantReboot]

I think the run defense is better overall, but there are still a few breakdowns each game. It seems like those breakdowns get lower and lower each week. I can only remember one big one in the Seattle game.

But I'm liking seeing the secondary having a better understanding of playing both man and zone. Other than the occasional mistake from Wilcox, they look to be playing pretty solid now that Claiborne is out of the picture.

The defense no longer has a weak link. Mo was the weak link which earlier in the year tried to take advantage of. With Scandrick in there and his ability to play press and zone, its not become a strength. Wilcox is quite possibly the weak link now. But he has stepped up his game and made some pretty big plays sniffing out screens, etc. His going to play a factor down the line when we play Phili and other teams that like to throw short in order to try and beat the pressure our dline puts out.

 

[gimmesix]

Sometimes it is situational beyond even that.
Pugh could probably be really good in Dallas as an RG.
The Giants needed him out at RT and he isn't built for it.

The OL reaches in front of Dallas is what made the TFred selection so awesome.
They traded down and didn't panic.
Got great value with TWill in r3 as a bonus.
The Escobar pick looks bad but that's almost beside the point with how well the other two have panned out.

That's a good point on Pugh. I think he was looked at for his position flex at tackle and guard, but is definitely more suited to guard.

I'm very thankful that teams did not value Frederick higher. Same with Williams. It would have been disappointing if Dallas had missed out on Williams because it chose to go with Escobar in the second round even though Williams was rated a spot higher on its board.

Not that Escobar's career ultimately might not turn out better. (We probably won't know how he'll turn out until either Witten retires or Escobar goes to a team where he's the No. 1 tight end ... which, of course, is the reason spending a second-round pick on him doesn't seem like a wise investment.)

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I remember everyone saying Pugh was a reach as well. I remember hearing the reason why we took Fredericks was because linemen were being drafted too early and while Frederick's had a 3rd round grade on him he would've been taken earlier.