Offensive line shuffle

nobody

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I think our offensive line is much better than most of the other playoff teams.

Maybe in the regular season for the most part, but come playoff time? They stunk it up. It's been that way for years.

Regular season stat monsters... Failures when it matters. The entire team.
 

Cebrin

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?
Biad sucks.....LG and C is trash. I'm not sure putting Collins at LG fixes that. You're still making up for lesser play, but I HEAR you.
 

The Realist

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?

i believe their logic is Collins zero or close to zero reps at LG in camp so they play the guys who practiced their all offseason. Hope gets snaps their this off-season.
 

visionary

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Believe there's a legitimate question of whether the best 5 included Connor Williams. Believe there's also a legitimate lack of actual, solid insight into whether it didn't... we don't see what they see in practice... and no one's asked any of us to be a line coach, an OC or a HC, so the idea that any of us have some reason to believe ours is a superior insight and reasoning, that's just bluster and a petty lack of intellectual humility talkin. Speculation is fine as long as it's understood as just that.

Regardless, I don't think we need to replace the HC, nor the OC, nor anyone else... the simplest explanation for why we're not still playing is, imo, the best one... we simply didn't have consistency of push nor protection at LG and C, and worse, the penalty situation at LG specifically was, of course, damning.

That was a player problem.

Perhaps it may have been resolved with moving La'el. Maybe. Maybe not. Perhaps it may have been resolved before the trade deadline. Maybe. Maybe not.

And now, the roster unavoidably is going to take a severe flip between now and game one of 2022, so it's not even necessarily so simple to resolve for 2022 given the other potential areas of need.

But the point remains... the failure to advance in the 2021-22 playoffs can be mostly attributed to the failure to remedy that one place on the depth chart.

:lmao2:
 

quickccc

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?

i cannot understand your confusion.
- Tyron is a HOFer and still solid when healthy despite injury prone
- Collins is your best RT, not Steele.
- Tyler is your best center
- Martin not flat dominant anymore but still very solid.
- Steele is a utility swing man who serves only best as a RT.

Lead problem is we just haven't had the LG role pan out
Both Conners ... Williams and McGovern have been early round busts
Tyler was a mid round pick, that hasn't panned out - he's looking more like a backup type. Knock wood that he was able to stay healthy.
 

Reality

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I dunno about this. It seemed to me that our 2021 coaching staff was perhaps the most position-flexible staff I can remember us having in many years. Lots of guys changed positions. Lots. Lots of guys got asked to step outside their normal positional roles and do other stuff.

Safeties were playing linebacker and corner. Linebackers were playing d-line and roaming in coverage in the secondary. There was that whole Conner-to-center wet dream that we kept indulging long past the point where his inability to snap a football made it clear it wasn't viable. We had a WR who we kept scheming ways for him to throw the ball, sometimes as a forward-passer and sometimes as a lateral-passer. We were playing spare o-linemen at fullback and TE and WR.

I think our coaching staff was absolutely open to exploring and exploiting positional flexibility.

I think it was just certain entrenched veterans who were too selfish to keep an open mind about it -- Zack Martin types who obviously dug in their heels and didn't want to change their routine even if it could help the team.
I think you are misunderstanding what we are talking about.

I am not referring to occasional plays where a linemen may line up at the end and once every few dozen plays get a ball throw to them in the end zone (most teams do this at least once every year or two) nor am I referring to the occasional fullback role.

We are talking about every down positions such as Offensive Tackle, Offensive Guard, Center, etc.

The Cowboys coaches always seems to lock-in on positions. For example, "This player is a tackle" or "that player is a guard". Left/right is not important, it's the position itself that is the problem.

Collins may be better than Steele, but Collins played guard earlier in his career and Collins at left guard and Steele at right tackle would likely produce better overall results than Collins at right tackle and Williams at left guard. Steele may not play as well as Collins at right tackle but the focus should be on overall line performance, not just one position.

Can no other player play center? Biadasz struggled at times both in blocking and with snapping, so maybe Williams or McGregor could do better than him. Maybe they cannot, but at least find out some of these things and maybe make that a factor in the lineman drafting and/or signing process.

Of course this team has a lot of issues that go beyond this topic, but this is the topic of this thread which is why I will not mention the other problems.

In baseball, you may have two great shortstops on your team, but only one of them can play and you do not want the other one sitting on the bench when they are better than the second or third basemen.

The solution is simple .. best 5 offensive linemen should be on the field even if it means downgrading one of the positions because the upgrade they provide at their new position may more than make up from any downgrade from their move.
 

Creeper

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Agreed with everyone, except for the Center. I would have benched Biadasz and tried out Farniok. I truly believe Farniok could have played better.

Watch the 4th quarter and watch Farniok #68 compared to Biadasz #63 (the first 3 quarters):



I saw the same thing. I am not ready to declare Farniok ready to start. He looks slow and lumbering but he also showed he has power and some mean to his game. What I like about him is he sticks to his blocks. This is aproblem the Cowboys have blocking. They make contract and let the guy go. Farniok hits his guys and keeps driving him.

We just have to keep in mind he was not blocking Cox and Hargrave, he was blocks some scrubs. The entire Cowboys backup OL looked good compared to the starters. But in the offseason, I think Farniok needs to be given a legitimate shot to compete for a starting position. He looked good in the pre-season games too.
 

blueblood70

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?
that and maybe more like TS being the swing tackle, steele at LT and ball at RT and Farinok pushing Biadsz in preseason. overhaul is needed and we maybe have all the parts on the team. maybe the OLC needs to be fired and et new one that's willing to do this.
 

MyFairLady

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Jerry told Collins he could play RT. That is why he is at RT. Collins does what he wants. He come in fat and gets hurt and just chills for a year. Then he gets suspended and tries to bribe the drug testers. No problem just chill for a half a year. Don't worry whenever you decide you feel like playing again you get to be instant starter at RT.

You need to understand that the team is run by a dysfunctional senile drunk.
 

quickccc

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I think you are misunderstanding what we are talking about.

I am not referring to occasional plays where a linemen may line up at the end and once every few dozen plays get a ball throw to them in the end zone (most teams do this at least once every year or two) nor am I referring to the occasional fullback role.

We are talking about every down positions such as Offensive Tackle, Offensive Guard, Center, etc.

The Cowboys coaches always seems to lock-in on positions. For example, "This player is a tackle" or "that player is a guard". Left/right is not important, it's the position itself that is the problem.

Collins may be better than Steele, but Collins played guard earlier in his career and Collins at left guard and Steele at right tackle would likely produce better overall results than Collins at right tackle and Williams at left guard. Steele may not play as well as Collins at right tackle but the focus should be on overall line performance, not just one position.

Can no other player play center? Biadasz struggled at times both in blocking and with snapping, so maybe Williams or McGregor could do better than him. Maybe they cannot, but at least find out some of these things and maybe make that a factor in the lineman drafting and/or signing process.

Of course this team has a lot of issues that go beyond this topic, but this is the topic of this thread which is why I will not mention the other problems.

In baseball, you have may have two great shortstops on your team, but only one of them can play and you do not want the other one sitting on the bench when they are better than the second or third basemen.

The solution is simple .. best 5 offensive linemen should be on the field even if it means downgrading one of the positions because the upgrade they provide at their new position may more than make up from any downgrade from their move.

I’d consider going to that solution,.. post-draft… after the draft.
Once we’ve seen what could be available in the draft (per OG and Center) in accordance to our draft board.
That solution would/should be Plan B …imo. .

- Also let me add, it does depend who the OL coach is at that time. ..(or Next new OL coach?)
Some vet coaches do not feel comfortable with rookies, much less 2 rookie starters next to each other.
While other coaches have a daring, trust our rookies approach.

- As far as Collins better than Steele at RT etc. This is a best competition league. I need My best competition vs Your best competition.
Just like I need my best man coverage CB… going up against the opposition’s best featured WR

- I’ve heard suggestions of the Steele/Collins reshuffle move brought up as to lessen the burden of using two extra high capital on the draft, in the same year, to fill 2 different positions on the same OL.

And I have to say " NFL Draft " – because we well know Stephen Jones will Not go the big pay FA vets mode either.
Which of the interior positions the greater need ,,the center or the LG ? And what valued player will be available in the high draft rounds ?
 
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keysersoze

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Biad sucks.....LG and C is trash. I'm not sure putting Collins at LG fixes that. You're still making up for lesser play, but I HEAR you.
I think Collins played better at guard than he did at RT. He and Tyron were pretty solid on that side in his rookie season. If I’m not mistaken.
 

keysersoze

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When they had Steele playing with Martin on the right side, they began to mesh well and seemed to be working on that side. As for the left side, CWilliams just never solved his penalty problems and got manhandled, and we all know TSmith and his penchant for missing games. No adequate backup for him, Steele didn't play as well on that side. Biadezsh is only average to below average as a center. Needs better technique to not get knocked onto Dak's lap,. Collins is garbage period...too inconsistent and unfocused.
Other than that, all cool. We got Alarcon and Ball coming. :)
Agreed
 

Buzzbait

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?

IMO that's the only lineup that makes sense. Williams was worthless, and Collins was excellent back when he played LG for us. I can't believe they didn't do it that way.
 

darthseinfeld

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?
I think they wanted continuity. In there defense sometimes its the right call. When you bench two LG's in 4 weeks, continuity is definitely not the right call
 

ThatJerryKid

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For the life of me I cannot understand why our offensive line wasn’t as follows. Tyron Smith (LT) L. Collins (LG) Biadash (C) Martin (RG) and T. Steele (RT) those were the best 5 Linemen and would’ve had much better success in my opinion. What do you guys think?
If you put your best 5 on the same line than your 2nd line would not be very good when they rotate in every other series. You know, because that’s a thing now…
 

BleedSilverandBlue

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:hammer::hammer:

Matt Farniok should have been put in place of Biadasz. 4th quarter performance shows Farniok #68 executing as a Center should. Similar to how the 49ers Oline has been performing.



Philbin needs to go.


Farniok actually looked very good out there. Two blocks where he took his defender onto his back. Really great job advancing to the second level as well. I would try the kid out at center and who knows, maybe he could be a good starter at left guard.

Also, that run from Hardy was really nice at the end of the 4th quarter. He had some really nice pop on his runs which makes me wonder why we didn't bother to give him or Clement a few carries during the year.
 
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