Ok it's that time again...

[BrAinPaiNt]

Oh, I'll agree the Ramones were highly influential -- the funny thing is they are at least as "radio friendly" if not more than the Clash - especially in the U.S. as (mostly) Joey was so completely seeped in the Brill Building sound. That was a pop band if ever there was one.

Pistols -- their influence was more cultural than anything -- not that Bollocks isn't a great album. But there is only 1 album there.

Misfit and Black Flag aren't just a blip on the scene compared to the Clash. I don't really see either influencing so many other bands. They likely influenced the harder core stuff more, but they don't have the broad influence of the Clash.

Problem is...no Ramones, probably no Clash...so who would be more influential and important as an influence on punk?

If I remember correctly there were loads of wanna be punkers, who eventually got to be punkers, waiting for the Ramones when they came to London back in the day. Not sure about the clash but I do remember seeing that some members of the sex pistols even talked to the ramones and seen them as idols.

 

[Duane]

Not exactly new, but Jeff Buckley's a big favorite of mine, if you hadn't heard him. Some of the songs released after his death are great. Vancouver is a great song.

Grace is just absolutely amazing as well. I always get chills listening to it.

 

[AbeBeta]

Problem is...no Ramones, probably no Clash...so who would be more influential and important as an influence on punk?

If I remember correctly there were loads of wanna be punkers, who eventually got to be punkers, waiting for the Ramones when they came to London back in the day. Not sure about the clash but I do remember seeing that some members of the sex pistols even talked to the ramones and seen them as idols.

Ramones, Clash, and Sex Pistols all idolized one another -- as the story goes the guys from the Clash and Pistols snuck into that Ramones show together through a bathroom window.

I think we are talking about two different things here -- you are focus on "influence on punk" whereas I'm talking about influence on music in general.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Ramones, Clash, and Sex Pistols all idolized one another -- as the story goes the guys from the Clash and Pistols snuck into that Ramones show together through a bathroom window.

I think we are talking about two different things here -- you are focus on "influence on punk" whereas I'm talking about influence on music in general.

Influence of one to influence another, who influences another and so on.

Where would it end? To say the clash was the one who influenced so many is to not give the credit to the ones that influenced them. And if someone had a profound influence on them...should they not get the credit as well?

Either way...the clash are boring. Have nowhere near the influence as other bands before them on music.

Nowhere near the influence of say the beetles, zep, stones, black sabbath, clapton, van halen and so on or you can go back further and talk about who those groups were influenced by like a great deal of blues artists whose never got the credit they deserved at that time because they were black and america did not want to play too much black music. So many were better known overseas.

So in the grand scheme of things...meh on the clash...sure they had influence, but not to the extent of many other bands and maybe not even the most influence in their own genre.

In other words, the clash are over rated IMO.

 

[AbeBeta]

Influence of one to influence another, who influences another and so on.

Where would it end? To say the clash was the one who influenced so many is to not give the credit to the ones that influenced them. And if someone had a profound influence on them...should they not get the credit as well?

Either way...the clash are boring. Have nowhere near the influence as other bands before them on music.

Nowhere near the influence of say the beetles, zep, stones, black sabbath, clapton, van halen and so on or you can go back further and talk about who those groups were influenced by like a great deal of blues artists whose never got the credit they deserved at that time because they were black and america did not want to play too much black music. So many were better known overseas.

So in the grand scheme of things...meh on the clash...sure they had influence, but not to the extent of many other bands and maybe not even the most influence in their own genre.

In other words, the clash are over rated IMO.

I think perceptions of their influence come down to what you listen to now. For the bands I'm into the Clash are clearly a top influence as would be Joy Division and more recently the Pixies. But that seems to be a more alternative bent than the folks you are citing -- e.g., Clapton.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

I think perceptions of their influence come down to what you listen to now. For the bands I'm into the Clash are clearly a top influence as would be Joy Division and more recently the Pixies. But that seems to be a more alternative bent than the folks you are citing -- e.g., Clapton.

Well you listen a minority genre it would seem...so how much of an influence were they if they seemed to influence a minority of bands.

I have actually found that for the most part, like an earlier poster indicated and you jumped onto, newer music today just does not stack up. Once again I said for the most part, not all.

Actually I think the only CDs I have bought this year have been in a genre that is not that main stream and I could not even find a radio station (am/fm not on the net) in my neck of the woods that would even consider playing either of them.

That genre is kind of death metal but it has split into so many categories that who knows what it is actually called from the CDs I have gotten this year.

Behemoth - the apostasy
Amon Amarth - With Oden on our Side
Nile - Ityphallic

----

Now if I listen to radio station in the car it seems like if they are playing a newer song, more times than not it just seems generic. If I watch MTV, well when I come home the wife is watching it, It seems the same. Generic or some kind of rap and dance stuff.
Heck even my beloved hardcore metal from days gone by seems to be generic now. The 3 bands I mentioned have their own niche they created, even if the words are silly.

Music today just not seem to be as good as it was at one time. Not as much originality. I think a great deal of it can be blamed on the music industry finding a band that works and trying to copy it from other bands and so on. Most of the main stream pop now days sounds like pre packaged bubble gum tennie bopper stuff to me.

 

[AbeBeta]

Well you listen a minority genre it would seem...so how much of an influence were they if they seemed to influence a minority of bands.

I have actually found that for the most part, like an earlier poster indicated and you jumped onto, newer music today just does not stack up. Once again I said for the most part, not all.

Actually I think the only CDs I have bought this year have been in a genre that is not that main stream and I could not even find a radio station (am/fm not on the net) in my neck of the woods that would even consider playing either of them.

That genre is kind of death metal but it has split into so many categories that who knows what it is actually called from the CDs I have gotten this year.

Behemoth - the apostasy
Amon Amarth - With Oden on our Side
Nile - Ityphallic

----

Now if I listen to radio station in the car it seems like if they are playing a newer song, more times than not it just seems generic. If I watch MTV, well when I come home the wife is watching it, It seems the same. Generic or some kind of rap and dance stuff.
Heck even my beloved hardcore metal from days gone by seems to be generic now. The 3 bands I mentioned have their own niche they created, even if the words are silly.

Music today just not seem to be as good as it was at one time. Not as much originality. I think a great deal of it can be blamed on the music industry finding a band that works and trying to copy it from other bands and so on. Most of the main stream pop now days sounds like pre packaged bubble gum tennie bopper stuff to me.

Oh I don't disagree that radio sucks -- but I think one of my original points was that radio sucks because people insist on listening to older music. How long would it have to take you to hear 20 new bands on the radio?

As my initial post indicated - there are a ton of good CDs out there right now. Doubt you'd hear any of them on the radio.

I think if folks are honest with themselves, most who say "nothing new is good" aren't putting the same sort of effort into finding new stuff as they were in the past -- you likely don't have as many friends passing stuff on to you, etc. We all naturally close off to new stuff at some point but there is a value to opening back up.

 

[vta]

Grace is just absolutely amazing as well. I always get chills listening to it.

Grace is fantastic. The guy was just overall a great talent. Too bad he had to die; who know's what other kind of things he would have done?

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Not liking them is fine.

Denying their importance like others in the thread are doing is what I find silly.

So is trying to put them above Zeppelin.
I am not even a Zeppelin homer and I know that the Clash arent/werent/never will be MORE influential than Zep.

Fine, you like the Clash a whole lot and you have Favre-erized them. I respect that but you cant post it as fact. People are too smart for that.

I'm not particularly fond of it myself.

Regardless, The Clash are hardly "important."

Perhaps in their Genre there is a significant amouht of importance. Thats all I could see.

Except for being one of the biggest influences on nearly every band that has followed...

Laughable.

Problem is...no Ramones, probably no Clash...so who would be more influential and important as an influence on punk?

Makes sense to me.

 

[AbeBeta]

Laughable.

Tell me what "genre" you follow then. Because certainly for the huge and now totally mainstream genre called alternative, the Clash are one of the major touchstones.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Tell me what "genre" you follow then. Because certainly for the huge and now totally mainstream genre called alternative, the Clash are one of the major touchstones.

Eclectic would describe my following in music.

With that said.


If you can find me a few reputable sources that validates your post...

Except for being one of the biggest influences on nearly every band that has followed...

... and places them ahead of Zeppelin... then I will concede my argument.

 

[AbeBeta]

Eclectic would describe my following in music.

With that said.


If you can find me a few reputable sources that validates your post...



... and places them ahead of Zeppelin... then I will concede my argument.

What exactly would you consider a "reputable" source?

 

[jem88]

The new music today stinks. Stick with the Beatles, Stones, Zep, Who, Eagles, Creedence Clearwater, Doobie Bros, Skynyrd, etc.

Glad to see you are still around. Long time no see.

Can't argue with that list (although I'm not the biggest Doobie Bros fan.) It certainly has been a long time!

 

[jem88]

Should I Stay or Should I Go, Rock the Casbah, Magnificent Seven, Clampdown... all things I've heard on the radio recently. MIA sampled Straight to Hell heavily on her last album...

And the funny thing is that 3 of those tunes are pretty sub-par by the Clash's standards. Clampdown of course is a classic.

Quick Clash top 5 (in no order)

Bankrobber
Rudy Can't Fail
White Man in Hammersmith Palais
Guns of Brixton
Safe European Home

 

[jem88]

I'm not particularly fond of it myself.

Regardless, The Clash are hardly "important."

That's just ridiculous.

 

[jem88]

Saying The Clash isn't important is the musical equivalent of saying Terence Newman isn't a good CB. It's that ridiculous.

And by the way, I'm a huge Zeppelin fan. I actually couldn't choose between The Clash and Led Zeppelin

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

What exactly would you consider a "reputable" source?

If you are going to elevate their status to an unreasonable level then YOU need to be able to back it up with something. Figure it out.

Saying The Clash isn't important is the musical equivalent of saying Terence Newman isn't a good CB. It's that ridiculous.

And by the way, I'm a huge Zeppelin fan. I actually couldn't choose between The Clash and Led Zeppelin

I dont think I have ever said they werent important anywhere in this thread. My dispute is the inflated view of who they were and how influential/important they were/are.... however it wants to be stated.


The latter part of your post is baffling. But hey... thats why we have preferences.

 

[AbeBeta]

If you are going to elevate their status to an unreasonable level then YOU need to be able to back it up with something. Figure it out.

Here's quote from arguably the world's biggest band...

"The Clash was the greatest rock band. They wrote the rule book for U2." Bono

Influential?

 

[jem88]

If you are going to elevate their status to an unreasonable level then YOU need to be able to back it up with something. Figure it out.





I dont think I have ever said they werent important anywhere in this thread. My dispute is the inflated view of who they were and how influential/important they were/are.... however it wants to be stated.


The latter part of your post is baffling. But hey... thats why we have preferences.

It really shouldn't be baffling. Numerous critics have voted London Calling as the most important album of the 1980's; A documentary on the late Joe Strummer was in cinemas recently. The Clash are widely considered to be one of the most important/influential bands of all time. There's really no inflation going on.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Here's quote from arguably the world's biggest band...

"The Clash was the greatest rock band. They wrote the rule book for U2." Bono

Influential?

Before I respond.... Is that a serious response? U2?

It really shouldn't be baffling. Numerous critics have voted London Calling as the most important album of the 1980's; A documentary on the late Joe Strummer was in cinemas recently. The Clash are widely considered to be one of the most important/influential bands of all time. There's really no inflation going on.

Your reponse doesnt fit what is baffling to me.

Ok... what baffled me is you not being to choose the better of the two between Zep and Clash.

No biggie though.