Onside Kick Stays

[jazzcat22]

Not me because we may need to recover one. One of the greatest comebacks in the history of the Cowboys was during the 2020 season against Atlanta with the aid of a recovered onside kick.

Agree.
They need to change the rules to create a higher % of success. They got scared and changed too many rules over injury issues.
Maybe not going back to overload one side like it was. But to allow a few extra on one side, to allow more success. It was part of the game for years. It is up to the other team counter as usual.

 

[Cowboy_svt]

I mean they essentially have.

feels like the only reason its there is to have 5 minutes of commercials before and after it.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

feels like the only reason its there is to have 5 minutes of commercials before and after it.

Basically. Just to keep the cash coming in.

 

[KJJ]

Agree.
They need to change the rules to create a higher % of success. They got scared and changed too many rules over injury issues.
Maybe not going back to overload one side like it was. But to allow a few extra on one side, to allow more success. It was part of the game for years. It is up to the other team counter as usual.

The league shouldn’t be so worried about injuries on an onside kick, because players are running from a short distance. They should go back to the way they had it. The rate of recovery for the kicking team is too low with the new rule.

 

[csirl]

Retain the rule that the ball must go 10 yards before kicking team can recover, but make the receiving team line up 20yds from the kick off line.

 

[JD_KaPow]

With PI still available that would literally be 50/50 so no thanks

Literally?

Since 2000, teams have gone for it on 4th and 18-22 (I expanded it a bit to get more plays) on 248 occasions. They've converted 40, which is 16%. Now, a lot of these are almost certainly garbage time plays when the team is down by a gazillion and the team playing defense doesn't care about giving up yards. So I would guess the percentage would be lower in situations where everyone is playing it straight. But 16% isn't too far off their target number, which seems like a reasonable target (1 in 8 feels about right).

I would consider amending the 4th-and-20 play to say that, yes, PI can happen and give you the ball, but if you convert via penalty you get the ball at the same LOS you had for the 4th-and-20 play, there's no advancement. I'm sure there are unintended consequences to that--say, the ball carrier is running free for a TD so a defender just punches the QB in the face to get a penalty--but I wonder if those couldn't be ironed out.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Move the kickoffs back five yards, there's nothing more boring in the NFL than the constant endless touchbacks

I'm with you.

If they want this...just stop kickoffs all together. Just place the ball and lets get on with it.

 

[Loso86]

Literally?

Since 2000, teams have gone for it on 4th and 18-22 (I expanded it a bit to get more plays) on 248 occasions. They've converted 40, which is 16%. Now, a lot of these are almost certainly garbage time plays when the team is down by a gazillion and the team playing defense doesn't care about giving up yards. So I would guess the percentage would be lower in situations where everyone is playing it straight. But 16% isn't too far off their target number, which seems like a reasonable target (1 in 8 feels about right).

I would consider amending the 4th-and-20 play to say that, yes, PI can happen and give you the ball, but if you convert via penalty you get the ball at the same LOS you had for the 4th-and-20 play, there's no advancement. I'm sure there are unintended consequences to that--say, the ball carrier is running free for a TD so a defender just punches the QB in the face to get a penalty--but I wonder if those couldn't be ironed out.

So are we trying to help out thr offense more or Defense?

 

[_sturt_]

Seems to me the more you can set it up pre-snap so that there ends up being a race to the ball... more like a mad scramble than a rock-em-sock-em-robots thing as it's always been... and with the receiving team having some advantage but not an extraordinary one, then you can accomplish the desired 13-14% while also retaining a legitimate effective constraint embedded in the rules to ****** full-steam head-on collisions.

(Problem is, you have to have a testing ground to determine the exact parameters... ie, what yard lines are most ideal... that get you at the number you're seeking, so until you have that, it's all just a theoretical conversation.)


And for example, you could say...

• Kickoff from 35 (as current).

• Receiving team may only have players lined-up between the 40-45 (kicking team's side of field) and beyond their own 25 (... current, they can be no closer than the 45). Thus, the 25-50 on their side of the field is no man's land, pre-snap. So, in the screenshot below, imagine all the LAC players shifted about 5 yards up

• Kicked ball becomes live once it passes the 50 yard line (instead of kicking team's 45).

Would look something like this...

 

[Mannix]

------I would consider amending the 4th-and-20 play to say that, yes, PI can happen and give you the ball, but if you convert via penalty you get the ball at the same LOS you had for the 4th-and-20 play, there's no advancement. I'm sure there are unintended consequences to that--say, the ball carrier is running free for a TD so a defender just punches the QB in the face to get a penalty--but I wonder if those couldn't be ironed out.


If the NFL ever adopts an asinine rule that allows the team THAT JUST SCORED....THE OPTION TO AGAIN GO ON OFFENSE AND TAKE OVER POSSESSION....I will NEVER watch another NFL game....and that is a promise. Who here thinks that if Dallas was in a big game, they would be allowed to convert a 4th and 20 without a flag nullifying it....or make a stop on a 4th and 20 conversion without a flag allowing the drive to continue.....yeah, you know the answer. And PLEASE tell me if you are behind with little to no time left, WHAT IS THE RISK of attempting to keep the ball??? There is ZERO risk and it is BLATANTLY unfair to the team that deserves to be on offense.

 

[Flamma]

Not me because we may need to recover one. One of the greatest comebacks in the history of the Cowboys was during the 2020 season against Atlanta with the aid of a recovered onside kick.

I think the recovery back in 2007 against Buffalo was better. For some reason I was way more excited about that one than against Atlanta. Maybe because we didn't suck back then.

 

[KJJ]

I think the recovery back in 2007 against Buffalo was better. For some reason I was way more excited about that one than against Atlanta. Maybe because we didn't suck back then.

We didn’t suck back then until the playoffs.

 

[Flamma]

We didn’t suck back then until the playoffs.

Yeah. How is it that every time we get the #1 seed we're always going up against some titan. Even back in the 90s, regardless of what seed we were, we always had to get past some really tough teams.

 

[KJJ]

Yeah. How is it that every time we get the #1 seed we're always going up against some titan. Even back in the 90s, regardless of what seed we were, we always had to get past some really tough teams.

The Giants were no Titan, we beat them twice that season. They simply peaked at the right time while we were fading. We played our best football early while they played their best football late.

 

[JustChip]

Not me because we may need to recover one. One of the greatest comebacks in the history of the Cowboys was during the 2020 season against Atlanta with the aid of a recovered onside kick.

Or the Divisional Playoff game against the 49ers in ‘72. I was as excited at the end if that game as I’ve been about any game.

 

[JustChip]

The Giants were no Titan, we beat them twice that season. They simply peaked at the right time while we were fading. We played our best football early while they played their best football late.

Coughlin was all but fired after the first 2 games and a “players only” meeting. But they didn’t really hit their stride until the playoffs although their week 16 close loss to the Patriots gave them some confidence.

 

[gtb1943]

Just put skirts on everyone.

Eventually that will happen.

Get it over with.

 

[KJJ]

Or the Divisional Playoff game against the 49ers in ‘72. I was as excited at the end if that game as I’ve been about any game.

I remember that one well! That was my first season following the Cowboys.

 

[KJJ]

Coughlin was all but fired after the first 2 games and a “players only” meeting. But they didn’t really hit their stride until the playoffs although their week 16 close loss to the Patriots gave them some confidence.

They got some injured players back which ignited their pass rush.

 

[Flamma]

The Giants were no Titan, we beat them twice that season. They simply peaked at the right time while we were fading. We played our best football early while they played their best football late.

I don't dispute that. But they were a really good team late in the season. That Peak still had to get through a wildcard game, two 13-3 teams, and an undefeated team in the SB. You still have to be a really talented team. Unlike last year's Giants.