Pat's CB Samuel Won't Return Until Week 10 of Season

[superpunk]

Maybe it's me, but he lost a few cool points in my eyes with this...
http://patriots.bostonherald.com/patriots/view.bg?articleid=1004881

Sounds callous, but we don't actually know if the two of them were close.

On the surface, though....

 

[NextGenBoys]

Asante Samuel isn't as good as we think he is and I think he knows this. Great points.

DING DING!

Agreed. He is a product of their system.

 

[joseephuss]

It's brilliat of the Pats to go out and spend like mad in FA, while ignoring another second round pick who performed brilliantly for them.

Hey - it works so well for Washington, it was only a matter of time before everyone tried it.

Are you making a reference to Deion Branch? The Pats did at least get a 1st round pick for him. I don't think he was worth the money he wanted even though he was an asset for the Pats. It is still a little early to see how this situation plays out.

This may not be the best way to handle things, but the Pats are not the Skins. Washington throws around this free agency money and isn't close to winning. The Pats were very close to a Superbowl last season.

 

[jterrell]

Before reading this article, I would have assumed that they were lowballing him with the likes of 1 year at 2 million. Yes, nice money for anybody but for a player of his stature underpaid. THen I read they franchised him for 1 year at 7.79 mil, what is his problem. If he signed an 8 year deal he would be making roughly 60 million. That is right were he should be and matter in fact I beileve a bit much. He's nuts, and to miss a charity event is just wrong. I can see mini camp and stuff but not when they offer you 8 mil a season.

huh???

They have to pay him 8 mil for the franchise tag!
If they signed him he would get 15 mil up front at least.

The Pats have been notoriously cheap.
Because they win guys take their lumps and play for less but that wasnt gonna work with everyone forever.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Sounds callous, but we don't actually know if the two of them were close.

On the surface, though....

I can believe that quite a few team members weren't close with him, but still came to show their respects.

Just looks bad.

 

[superpunk]

Are you making a reference to Deion Branch? The Pats did at least get a 1st round pick for him. I don't think he was worth the money he wanted even though he was an asset for the Pats. It is still a little early to see how this situation plays out.

This may not be the best way to handle things, but the Pats are not the Skins. Washington throws around this free agency money and isn't close to winning. The Pats were very close to a Superbowl last season.

It is at least similar. Having Deion Branch would have worked wonders for them last year, as Reche "I can see you" Caldwell dropped critical end zone passes in the Colts game. And then, it cost them again this offseason as they felt the need to make moves for WRs like mad - changing the approach they've always taken - the one that actually works.

They appear to be doing it again with Samuel.

 

[Vintage]

It is at least similar. Having Deion Branch would have worked wonders for them last year, as Reche "I can see you" Caldwell dropped critical end zone passes in the Colts game. And then, it cost them again this offseason as they felt the need to make moves for WRs like mad - changing the approach they've always taken - the one that actually works.

They appear to be doing it again with Samuel.

Except, they've proven they can shuffle around parts in the secondary.

Ty Law, Laywer Milloy, Rodney Harrison, Asante Samuel, Ellis Hobbs, Troy Brown, etc

 

[sjordan6]

I think the Samuel situation is a perfect example of how smart the patriot organization has been and high marks should be given to the coach and GM. This organization has refused to be bullied by players and their high demands for contracts. They understand which players they must pay (Brady, Seymour) and those who they can sacrifrice. What is even more intriguing is how they are able to allow some players to leave and still get compensated with picks.

Samuel will not get paid by the Patriots and that is simply the bottom line. Although he only has one good season under his belt, it was a contract season that included 10 ints and great cornerback play on his part.

I see the patriots trading Samuels to a team for a first round pick. The Patriots will have three first round picks while having a Super Bowl calibur team, that inlcudes Randy Moss/Brady/Stallworth/....

Pure Genius!

 

[superpunk]

Except, they've proven they can shuffle around parts in the secondary.

Ty Law, Laywer Milloy, Rodney Harrison, Asante Samuel, Ellis Hobbs, Troy Brown, etc

Maybe. Those guys were kept around til their downsides. Samuels appears to be peaking.

 

[Vintage]

Maybe. Those guys were kept around til their downsides. Samuels appears to be peaking.

If anything, shouldn't we be lauding their approach?

They chose to invest the money into Adalius Thomas (money that could have gone to Asante Samuel). They seem to be saying a pass rush is more important that CB's (and they got a very good DL).

Isn't that what we are counting on this season? A pass rush to help our secondary out.

And NE has had success with Troy Brown in their secondary. If they can do that, they can probably manage to get good play from Hobbs, Gay, Wilson (can move back to CB if needed) and Meriweather (can play some CB if needed).

 

[YosemiteSam]

I can believe that quite a few team members weren't close with him, but still came to show their respects.

Just looks bad.

While I do not know the situation here as to why he did not show up, I also do not attend funerals or wakes. My not attending them is something personal to me and has nothing to do with selfishness or disrespect for the dead.

 

[superpunk]

If anything, shouldn't we be lauding their approach?

They chose to invest the money into Adalius Thomas (money that could have gone to Asante Samuel). They seem to be saying a pass rush is more important that CB's (and they got a very good DL).

Isn't that what we are counting on this season? A pass rush to help our secondary out.

And NE has had success with Troy Brown in their secondary. If they can do that, they can probably manage to get good play from Hobbs, Gay, Wilson (can move back to CB if needed) and Meriweather (can play some CB if needed).

Why would anyone laud it? Aggravating your home-grown players until they leave or are traded, recently just as they are hitting their stride? Getting rid of a player who your star QB loved, stringing him out for a year, and then going nuts the following offseason with eye-popping acquisitions? Using "you're not as good as you think you are" as a bargaining tool?

We'll see how it works. They're going against what made them great. That has never worked, for anyone. I doubt they'll buck that trend.

 

[Vintage]

Why would anyone laud it? Aggravating your home-grown players until they leave or are traded, recently just as they are hitting their stride? Getting rid of a player who your star QB loved, stringing him out for a year, and then going nuts the following offseason with eye-popping acquisitions? Using "you're not as good as you think you are" as a bargaining tool?

We'll see how it works. They're going against what made them great. That has never worked, for anyone. I doubt they'll buck that trend.

I meant the part of choosing to invest in a pass rush to help alleviate secondary concerns.

You took it too literal.

 

[superpunk]

Oh, I see.






Your mom takes it too literal. Hmph.

 

[Vintage]

Oh, I see.






Your mom takes it too literal. Hmph.

Now you see?

Not as well as your sister does...

 

[jterrell]

A few things:

1. The Pats have been as combative as anyone with players over salaries. Its a fight they do not shy away from. It HAS taken its toll at times but mostly have been a good model because they have fought against overpaying older players. Still players recognize they will get that fight when they want to get paid and al players want to get paid.

2. They seem to be willing to bring in malcontents or thugs provided they play cheap; for them cheap is the key.

3. The biggest tool used by successful front offices has been the early resigning of young talent to long term deals. They waited too long with Samuel and he had a breakout year. Is he overrated? Probably. Does that mean he is easily replaceable? Absolutely not. Lotsa folks thought Troy Aikman was overrated but we haven't replaced him yet.

4. The Pats will change courses at some point because they'll see the same light Jerry Jones did that is tied to the age of their franchise QB. They'll pay extra to get another legit Super Bowl shot or two.

5. The Pats have not been great consistently. They have been consistently good. Since they won the 3 Lombardi's in 4 years they haven't won the AFC since. Ultimately I suspect their front office is a bit overrated. They got lucky with Brady who has made everyone on the offense better players. Belichek is a talented defensive guy who has good results on that side of the ball regularly but the offense is largely Brady.

 

[Pats Fan]

Sorry boys and girls this is a guy that had one good year and only because his contract was up. Oh gee, time to play now.

Can I show you the door bud??? Out, you do not belong in New England. Look up Washington or some other sucker team willing to pay for a player that only plays when the money is on the table.

Oh, now I got money on the table, got it, now I can just be average.

Pats, do NOT give him a dime. Rather give him the boot. The Pats were fair with him. Way too fair in my eyes. What, does this fool think he is the top guy in the league??? Over Champ -- sorry.

To me, this is where a line in the sand needs to be drawn. I don't even care if Samuel crossed it, it is over. MOVE on Pats. We don't need him.

And you know what, we don't.

Whoever gets him will not be happy campers. I just hope it is not the Pats. I remember Law saying, hey, a man has to eat making millions. Where are you now Law???

Some of these guys are just out of control. Sorry one is a Patriot. May I give you the boot guy???

 

[Pats Fan]

Post from patsfans.com. I agree completely. 100%.

BB/SP, masters of the cap game, are quietly thanking their lucky stars that Asante has announced his intention to hold out.

Here's why:

If Asante plays for us next year it is a one year $7.8M bet on his on the field performance.

If Asante plays at the level of an average pro bowl corner back, the bet is a push. We paid $7.8M, and we got roughly the same amount of talent.

If Asante plays like the best CB in the NFL, he's worth $10M-12M. We win the bet by $2-4M.

If Asante plays like he did during the first 75% of his NFL career (or worse, get injured) he's worth maybe $2M of cap space. We lose $6M (or more).

Unless you think that Asante is a future hall of famer, this is a lousy bet.

Factoring in a few our need for Asante this season, I think it would be a modestly positive event if he plays for us on the tag this season. But nobody should be jumping up and down at the prospect of paying $7.8M for one year of Asante. The expected value of his talent is roughly equal to (probably a little less than) what we'd be paying him.

But as trade bait, Asante could fetch us a first rounder. If you look at our last 5-10 first rounders, I think its conservative to say that, on average, each of them has supplied us with (or is on pace supplying us with) over $10M more value than salary cap cost over their first five years. Trading "roughly zero" for $10M would be a huge win for the Pats.

By telling the whole world that he wants a trade, Asante makes it easier for us to ship him to another team. If we offered another team a straight up trade for Asante, they'd know that we have doubts about his ability to reprise his 2006 performance. But with Asante whining at the top of his lungs, we can actively talk trade and the "fortunate" team that receives him will be none the wiser.

There's only one small catch to all of this. Which team is going to be stupid enough to trade a #1 pick for Asante Samuel AND give him the huge money he's looking for? Surely after last year's Seattle trade, teams are going to be wary of giving the Patriot's another #1 pick for an overpriced player.

I don't know if there is anyone out there who is that stupid, but I do know that the louder Asante screams, the easier it will be to part them from their #1 pick in 2008.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

So now Samuel was average other than last year? Funny, I remember some Pats shills (and even some others) claiming he was better than Newman in 2003.

Pats Fan, who is going to play corner for you if you let him go or he holds out?

IMO Samuel is pretty darn good. Maybe not great, but very good. It sounds great to plan to let good young players go and oh well, we'll replace them in the draft. But no one, not even Scott Pioli, drafts great forever.

 

[Pats Fan]

So now Samuel was average other than last year? Funny, I remember some Pats shills (and even some others) claiming he was better than Newman in 2003.

Pats Fan, who is going to play corner for you if you let him go or he holds out?

IMO Samuel is pretty darn good. Maybe not great, but very good. It sounds great to plan to let good young players go and oh well, we'll replace them in the draft. But no one, not even Scott Pioli, drafts great forever.

The guys name is Wilson -- and I have thought for years he was better than Samuel. Just has to stay healthy. This is not like the loss of Branch -- that in my opinion hurt us bad. This guy needs to go.