Video: Peppers: This Scout Admits He Was Wrong

[xwalker]

Watch this video and you will see all this nonsense of Peppers not being fluid or unable to cover is false. Just because he wasn't called upon to showcase these skills doesnt mean he doesnt possess them. In reality he did everything he was asked to

Peppers is the type of player that casual fans love love love, but that NFL teams will have reservations about.

He has terrific athleticism. I don't know how the guy in the video needed to see his combine performance to realize that.

The issues:
1. His job in college was very simplistic compared to playing Safety in the NFL.
2. He will have to do things that he didn't do that often in college, coverage as a Safety and taking on blocks from OLinemen when playing in the box.
3. He basically failed a drug test.

The key decision criteria for teams will be their evaluation of his mental makeup.

Bruce Carter looked like he could do anything in college and could be a superstar in the NFL, but his mental makeup held him back. Carter was probably more athletic than Peppers (Carter ran a 4.38 in college at 240 and had a 41" vertical).

While not the super athlete, JJ Wilcox has the physical ability to be a good NFL Safety, but his mental makeup was just not quite what it needed to be.

People comparing a player like Peppers to Darren Woodson are only looked at physical ability the the fact that both played LB in college but did/will play Safety in the NFL. Woodson had one of the best mental makeups of any player in NFL history. Woodson knew opposing offenses better than many of those offenses own players. He was one of the hardest working players you'll ever see.

Maybe Peppers has a great mental makeup, but as fans there is no way to know. NFL teams ability to rank players mental makeup is probably as important and maybe more important than ranking players physical ability.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Watch this video and you will see all this nonsense of Peppers not being fluid or unable to cover is false. Just because he wasn't called upon to showcase these skills doesnt mean he doesnt possess them. In reality he did everything he was asked to

I like Brett Kollmann, but he's not a scout. Just a guy playing one on the YouTubes.




YR

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

esigh...
Brett Kollman is not a scout. He is a videographer running a fundme to support is videos.
His videos are extremely well produced and done.
Now he just needs ot enlist actual scouts, lol.

His take on Peppers is completely erroneous.

Peppers had coverage duties at times and was simply bad in those match ups.
Those were generally times he was asked to play, ya know, actual safety.
When he was in the slot covering he was fine if he played tight man but if he had to play backed off he struggled.
In general he is outstanding when coming forward at the snap and not so good if asked to back pedal even a step at the snap.

A team may well find a way to use Peppers and develop him into a Pro Bowler.
But my guess is that position would be Will/Nickel backer.

Still seeing you are using emotional generalizations in place of reality.

That Colorado game you like to point to saw him not get baited by the repeated curls they ran at him to set up the go. Closing on quick ins and outs and ending receptions with sure tackles when you are playing 7+ yards off the los with no help over the top certainly was not bad coverage.

He has issues with zone awareness and play recognition. This should not be surprising. His overall ability to cover is fine. He is very stout at the top of the route, can keep up through cuts, and run with speedy receivers..

You should hate Humphries ability to cover too.

 

[jterrell]

Are you telling me that there isnt a position in the NFL for him. Go ahead keep doubting him.

Kid was a cornerback who made the transition to LB. And your telling me thats a negative. Your telling me he couldnt play saftey.

Good thing the Bears didnt think that way when they drafted Urlacher.

If you dont see that this kid is going to be a generational player then I cant convince you.

THIS kid has heart, dedication and hes selfless sacrifices for whats best for the team

Urlacher is a great example as is Darren Woodson.
Those guys were great fits in different pro positions that were very specific to certain teams.

I think Peppers is a heck of a football player.
But you don't draft guys based on that and then hope for best in R1.
Urlacher was asked to play that deep middle coverage zone underneath a cover 2. It was his Safety skills that made him successful.

I think Peppers is around pick 40-50.
People want to take that as degrading him for some reason but that's just where his skillset belongs.

I am almost identical size to Peppers and played D1 safety. I was cussed out in film review for some of the same coverage mistakes.
I have no malice towards him, he's just been mis-judged as a top of the draft guy.

 

[jterrell]

Still seeing you are using emotional generalizations in place of reality.

That Colorado game you like to point to saw him not get baited by the repeated curls they ran at him to set up the go. Closing on quick ins and outs and ending receptions with sure tackles when you are playing 7+ yards off the los with no help over the top certainly was not bad coverage.

He has issues with zone awareness and play recognition. This should not be surprising. His overall ability to cover is fine. He is very stout at the top of the route, can keep up through cuts, and run with speedy receivers..

You should hate Humphries ability to cover too.

Fuzzy, no offense but you are clueless about how to scout coverage.
That's just reality man.

From PFF who grades out each play of a guys career.
School: Michigan

Position fit: Box safety, possibly cover-2 CB

Stats to know: Through three years at Michigan he gave up 58 receptions on 93 targets and broke up six passes with no interceptions when the primary defender

What he does best:

• Smooth, explosive athlete – can change directions, accelerate to top speed in a flash
• Makes plays coming forward, especially when unblocked
• Can beat blockers to the point of attack with his explosiveness when he’s able to attack downhill
• Beat WR screen blocks with his quick recognition and closing speed
• Impressive change of direction, recovery
• Tackling is much improved from 2015, where he tended to overrun plays
• Adds special teams value. Excellent elusiveness and vision as a punt returner and ranked No. 2 in PFF return grades in 2016

Biggest concern:

• Not physical in press coverage – gives too many free releases off the line of scrimmage
• Will try to run around blockers instead of address head-on, can lose fits
• Played out of position when lined up as a linebacker in 2016; lacks the strength, physicality to take on and defeat blockers at the point of attack
• In zone coverage, whether deep or in the box, he tends to attack the first thing he sees, which gets him out of position; wants to find the ball too much
• For such an elite athlete, he is consistently late to break and close on passes in front when in zone or off coverage
• Lack of bulk, strength limits his effectiveness in coverage against tight ends

Player comparison: Johnathan Cyprien, Jacksonville Jaguars

Cyprien has never graded well in coverage, but has evolved into a viable chess piece against the run who is used in a variety of alignments for the Jaguars

Bottom line:

Peppers is one of the most difficult evaluations in this draft class because outside of punt returner, he lacks a natural NFL position. While he graded well against the run each of the past two seasons, much of his success was when attacking the backfield unblocked. While he is clearly one of the elite athletes of this draft class, he was unable to translate to his coverage skills. While he clearly has the speed to play free safety, he has limited experience, and has not displayed the instincts needed to decipher plays quick enough to prevent big catches. The comparison to Cyprien works well for him, in large part because it will likely take significant time for him to find his niche in the NFL, and will likely need to play a very specialized role on defense. While many pundits have long been convinced that he is a lock for the first round, his lack of applicable NFL skills makes him a huge risk to be taken so high, especially considering the high-levels of talent and depth in this draft’s defensive backs.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Fuzzy, no offense but you are clueless about how to scout coverage.
That's just reality man.

From PFF who grades out each play of a guys career.
School: Michigan

Position fit: Box safety, possibly cover-2 CB

Stats to know: Through three years at Michigan he gave up 58 receptions on 93 targets and broke up six passes with no interceptions when the primary defender

What he does best:

• Smooth, explosive athlete – can change directions, accelerate to top speed in a flash
• Makes plays coming forward, especially when unblocked
• Can beat blockers to the point of attack with his explosiveness when he’s able to attack downhill
• Beat WR screen blocks with his quick recognition and closing speed
• Impressive change of direction, recovery
• Tackling is much improved from 2015, where he tended to overrun plays
• Adds special teams value. Excellent elusiveness and vision as a punt returner and ranked No. 2 in PFF return grades in 2016

Biggest concern:

• Not physical in press coverage – gives too many free releases off the line of scrimmage
• Will try to run around blockers instead of address head-on, can lose fits
• Played out of position when lined up as a linebacker in 2016; lacks the strength, physicality to take on and defeat blockers at the point of attack
• In zone coverage, whether deep or in the box, he tends to attack the first thing he sees, which gets him out of position; wants to find the ball too much
• For such an elite athlete, he is consistently late to break and close on passes in front when in zone or off coverage
• Lack of bulk, strength limits his effectiveness in coverage against tight ends

Player comparison: Johnathan Cyprien, Jacksonville Jaguars

Cyprien has never graded well in coverage, but has evolved into a viable chess piece against the run who is used in a variety of alignments for the Jaguars

Bottom line:

Peppers is one of the most difficult evaluations in this draft class because outside of punt returner, he lacks a natural NFL position. While he graded well against the run each of the past two seasons, much of his success was when attacking the backfield unblocked. While he is clearly one of the elite athletes of this draft class, he was unable to translate to his coverage skills. While he clearly has the speed to play free safety, he has limited experience, and has not displayed the instincts needed to decipher plays quick enough to prevent big catches. The comparison to Cyprien works well for him, in large part because it will likely take significant time for him to find his niche in the NFL, and will likely need to play a very specialized role on defense. While many pundits have long been convinced that he is a lock for the first round, his lack of applicable NFL skills makes him a huge risk to be taken so high, especially considering the high-levels of talent and depth in this draft’s defensive backs.

And your evidence that you can is by regurgitating someone else's take? Nice ad hominem though.

I also do not see how he disagrees with me. He talks about zone awareness and play recognition as his issues after all : he has limited experience, and has not displayed the instincts needed to decipher plays quick enough to prevent big catches.

I also disagree with his take regarding breaking on plays in front of him --and I am not the only one to do so-- given that he is on an island. You can hammer my acumen but if you don't have help and you sell out on underneath routes then you open yourself over the top in a big way nonetheless. Lack of help should result in more conservative reads as a rule.

Then of course you are talking about PFF and their coverage stats where "primary defender" means the guy closest to the catch. Their stats are completely arbitrary and obtuse.

Peppers should have no issue stepping into the Barry Church role who always had help over the top if not elsewhere without issue.

 

[NotForLong]

And your evidence that you can is by regurgitating someone else's take? Nice ad hominem though.

I also do not see how he disagrees with me. He talks about zone awareness and play recognition as his issues after all : he has limited experience, and has not displayed the instincts needed to decipher plays quick enough to prevent big catches.

I also disagree with his take regarding breaking on plays in front of him --and I am not the only one to do so-- given that he is on an island. You can hammer my acumen but if you don't have help and you sell out on underneath routes then you open yourself over the top in a big way nonetheless. Lack of help should result in more conservative reads as a rule.

Then of course you are talking about PFF and their coverage stats where "primary defender" means the guy closest to the catch. Their stats are completely arbitrary and obtuse.

Peppers should have no issue stepping into the Barry Church role who always had help over the top if not elsewhere without issue.

If Barry Church was an insanely freakish athlete

 

[jterrell]

And your evidence that you can is by regurgitating someone else's take? Nice ad hominem though.

I also do not see how he disagrees with me. He talks about zone awareness and play recognition as his issues after all : he has limited experience, and has not displayed the instincts needed to decipher plays quick enough to prevent big catches.

I also disagree with his take regarding breaking on plays in front of him --and I am not the only one to do so-- given that he is on an island. You can hammer my acumen but if you don't have help and you sell out on underneath routes then you open yourself over the top in a big way nonetheless. Lack of help should result in more conservative reads as a rule.

Then of course you are talking about PFF and their coverage stats where "primary defender" means the guy closest to the catch. Their stats are completely arbitrary and obtuse.

Peppers should have no issue stepping into the Barry Church role who always had help over the top if not elsewhere without issue.

This isn't hard.
Not sure why we are going back to A, B, C here.

Peppers is not average in coverage. He's poor.
He allowed an astounding percentage of completions because he has no swivel to his hips.
He's fast and explosive.
But he has terrible reaction times and no idea how to play with his back to the ball.
His college tape from 2016 is eerily similar to Roy Williams at OU. RW31 went top 10. But the NFL has learned since then that this is passing league.

Samuel from OSU wore him out. He not only stopped in front of him and turned to catch the ball, he then ran away from him.

Safeties don't generally help in coverage. That's the point. They are the safety....
So it's pointless to cry that he was asked to play without help versus largely spare WRs who won't make the NFL. Michigan was blitzing and not helping anyone when they sent Peppers.

His two best skills are kick returns and blitzing. Those are both R1 worthy. Now find a way to take advantage of those 2 without asking him to cover much and you will win the draft. Good Luck with that plan.

Here's another very honest take.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...rs-is-2017-nfl-drafts-most-overrated-prospect

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This isn't hard.
Not sure why we are going back to A, B, C here.

Peppers is not average in coverage. He's poor.
He allowed an astounding percentage of completions because he has no swivel to his hips.
He's fast and explosive.
But he has terrible reaction times and no idea how to play with his back to the ball.
His college tape from 2016 is eerily similar to Roy Williams at OU. RW31 went top 10. But the NFL has learned since then that this is passing league.

Samuel from OSU wore him out. He not only stopped in front of him and turned to catch the ball, he then ran away from him.

Safeties don't generally help in coverage. That's the point. They are the safety....
So it's pointless to cry that he was asked to play without help versus largely spare WRs who won't make the NFL. Michigan was blitzing and not helping anyone when they sent Peppers.

His two best skills are kick returns and blitzing. Those are both R1 worthy. Now find a way to take advantage of those 2 without asking him to cover much and you will win the draft. Good Luck with that plan.

Here's another very honest take.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...rs-is-2017-nfl-drafts-most-overrated-prospect

So you have abandoned the Colorado tape and are now moving the goalposts when you are not relying on emotional generalizations. Waving your hands at a missed tackle anecdote as if he is not superb at tackling and pursuit is fun though.

You completely disregarded how PFF determines "primary defender" and of course there are not any yardage stats provided anyway. In short, I don't find PFF DB stats credible.

S help in coverage all the time and when they do so they are sharing coverage responsibilities. For example, if a S is helping over the top that means they take the deep routes and the underneath guy takes the underneath routes. Bracket coverage implies they split the field into lateral sides. SS routinely take intermediate zones with help all around them when they try to buzz routes.

That is neither here nor there though because he was playing LB and covering without help at Michigan. It's very seldom that you see an NFL S left on an island like he was routinely at Michigan.

The takeaway here is that he would be playing Barry Church's role who always had help. I would expect that they would keep him there and allow him to learn the reads and techniques without being left on an island down in and down out.

 

[NotForLong]

This isn't hard.
Not sure why we are going back to A, B, C here.

Peppers is not average in coverage. He's poor.
He allowed an astounding percentage of completions because he has no swivel to his hips.
He's fast and explosive.
But he has terrible reaction times and no idea how to play with his back to the ball.
His college tape from 2016 is eerily similar to Roy Williams at OU. RW31 went top 10. But the NFL has learned since then that this is passing league.

Samuel from OSU wore him out. He not only stopped in front of him and turned to catch the ball, he then ran away from him.

Safeties don't generally help in coverage. That's the point. They are the safety....
So it's pointless to cry that he was asked to play without help versus largely spare WRs who won't make the NFL. Michigan was blitzing and not helping anyone when they sent Peppers.

His two best skills are kick returns and blitzing. Those are both R1 worthy. Now find a way to take advantage of those 2 without asking him to cover much and you will win the draft. Good Luck with that plan.

Here's another very honest take.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...rs-is-2017-nfl-drafts-most-overrated-prospect

Honest take? Just more of the same opinions.

 

[NotForLong]

So you have abandoned the Colorado tape and are now moving the goalposts when you are not relying on emotional generalizations. Waving your hands at a missed tackle anecdote as if he is not superb at tackling and pursuit is fun though.

You completely disregarded how PFF determines "primary defender" and of course there are not any yardage stats provided anyway. In short, I don't find PFF DB stats credible.

S help in coverage all the time and when they do so they are sharing coverage responsibilities. For example, if a S is helping over the top that means they take the deep routes and the underneath guy takes the underneath routes. Bracket coverage implies they split the field into lateral sides. SS routinely take intermediate zones with help all around them when they try to buzz routes.

That is neither here nor there though because he was playing LB and covering without help at Michigan. It's very seldom that you see an NFL S left on an island like he was routinely at Michigan.

The takeaway here is that he would be playing Barry Church's role who always had help. I would expect that they would keep him there and allow him to learn the reads and techniques without being left on an island down in and down out.

Great analysis and reasoning. Its refreshing to hear the opinions of someone who has eyes to see. Your spot on

 

[tyke1doe]

Woodson had one of the best mental makeups of any player in NFL history. Woodson knew opposing offenses better than many of those offenses own players. He was one of the hardest working players you'll ever see.

For what it's worth, I remember Jimmy Johnson saying after Super Bowl 27 that Darren Woodson was so far ahead of other rookies in terms of absorbing the scheme and understanding his role that he should have started him at the beginning of season.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Peppers is the type of player that casual fans love love love, but that NFL teams will have reservations about.

He has terrific athleticism. I don't know how the guy in the video needed to see his combine performance to realize that.

The issues:
1. His job in college was very simplistic compared to playing Safety in the NFL.
2. He will have to do things that he didn't do that often in college, coverage as a Safety and taking on blocks from OLinemen when playing in the box.
3. He basically failed a drug test.

The key decision criteria for teams will be their evaluation of his mental makeup.

Bruce Carter looked like he could do anything in college and could be a superstar in the NFL, but his mental makeup held him back. Carter was probably more athletic than Peppers (Carter ran a 4.38 in college at 240 and had a 41" vertical).

While not the super athlete, JJ Wilcox has the physical ability to be a good NFL Safety, but his mental makeup was just not quite what it needed to be.

People comparing a player like Peppers to Darren Woodson are only looked at physical ability the the fact that both played LB in college but did/will play Safety in the NFL. Woodson had one of the best mental makeups of any player in NFL history. Woodson knew opposing offenses better than many of those offenses own players. He was one of the hardest working players you'll ever see.

Maybe Peppers has a great mental makeup, but as fans there is no way to know. NFL teams ability to rank players mental makeup is probably as important and maybe more important than ranking players physical ability.

You don't get to speak for NFL teams given that you are just a fan yourself. You talking about fans as if you are not part of us is amusing. Appealing to authority is bad enough but evoking someone else's that you have no right to is plain garbage.

Given that he was crashing down the los as a LB this notion that he did not take on OL or that playing S will cause him to have to take on more is pretty ignorant.

You have no idea how intelligent he is. The issues he has relate to experience or the lack thereof. I do find it interesting that you just gave Parnell a pass and listening to him talk and execute assignments it was obvious he had little to speak of.

You and your agendas.

 

[xwalker]

You don't get to speak for NFL teams given that you are just a fan yourself. You talking about fans as if you are not part of us is amusing. Appealing to authority is bad enough but evoking someone else's that you have no right to is plain garbage.

Given that he was crashing down the los as a LB this notion that he did not take on OL or that playing S will cause him to have to take on more is pretty ignorant.

You have no idea how intelligent he is. The issues he has relate to experience or the lack thereof. I do find it interesting that you just gave Parnell a pass and listening to him talk and execute assignments it was obvious he had little to speak of.

You and your agendas.

Your agenda is to argue with everyone. That's why few if anyone here takes you seriously.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Your agenda is to argue with everyone. That's why few if anyone here takes you seriously.

There you go speaking for others. You don't get to speak for anyone but yourself. Try appealing to reason as opposed to the bandwagon or authority. It really does make you look inconsequential.

And people asking questions and arguing over the answers to come to a conclusion is called the Socratic method. It is indeed my method and these public forums with the concept of an OP are a perfect format.

Your method is to choose a pet cat or to dislike a pet rat and argue for the conclusion mindlessly. The disciples of Socrates hated such sophistry. The truth is the truth no matter how repugnant you find it. I find myself with the same demeanor.

Not all "agendas" are created equal and not all agendas are bad.

I find your take that he did not take on OL blocks when he was playing as a LB to be laughable. I can see why you would try to deflect from it.

 

[xwalker]

And people asking questions and arguing over the answers to come to a conclusion is called the Socratic method.

This one thinks he's smart.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This one thinks he's smart.

You don't need to be smart to engage in the socratic method but it does take a measure of courage. At least you are not spouting nonsense about Peppers.

I wouldn't stand by your stance about him taking on OL blocks or your claims about what NFL clubs really think either.

 

[xwalker]

You don't need to be smart to engage in the socratic method but it does take a measure of courage. At least you are not spouting nonsense about Peppers.

I wouldn't stand by your stance about him taking on OL blocks or your claims about what NFL clubs really think either.

I'm not going to reply to you with anything but laughter on any topic.

 

[xwalker]

Watch this video and you will see all this nonsense of Peppers not being fluid or unable to cover is false. Just because he wasn't called upon to showcase these skills doesnt mean he doesnt possess them. In reality he did everything he was asked to

I stand by my original statement that Peppers on many occasions struggled to shed blocks. Most of his success was due to running around blockers. Yes, he did take on and shed some blocks, but it's a concern if he is going to be a box player in the NFL.

His coverage as a Safety is a question mark.

There is no doubt that he has the athletic ability to do the job, but that's far from a guarantee. Bruce Carter should have been an All Pro based on athletic ability.

I do think he can perform the Barry Church role, but I don't want to use a 1st round pick for that. He would need to be drastically better than Barry Church to justify #28.

He would be a fun player to watch and I would root for him if he is drafted by the Cowboys. I would just much prefer that they get him with the 2nd round pick than with their 1st round pick.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I'm not going to reply to you with anything but laughter on any topic.

That's fine. I will continue to argue your nonsense on merit.