PFF Season Defense stats

[805BoysInBlue]

People laughed when I said to trade our first for Quennin a few years back.

 

[atlantacowboy]

For that, You have to understand how PFF grades players. This is not a cumulative achievement stat, but an average value stat when they’re on the field.

Graham had 11 sacks 21 pressures, 16 QB hits in 474 snaps

Reddick had 16 sacks, 41 pressures, 26 Qb hits in 817 snaps

Then you factor in which player PFF determined had the better year in run defense. I don’t have PFF membership to see, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Graham was quite a bit higher in that category, as is his wont.



I agree Reddick had the much better year in totality, but on a per snap basis I can understand how PFF came to this conclusion.

Thank you for explaining these grades.

I wouldn't even say PFF drew any "conclusions". These are just how guys graded out.

 

[atlantacowboy]

Yeah that’s a big one. Like they’ll rate if a DL player had a positive or negative play in a run play that goes away from them… how do you determine that? And can that be different depending on who see it

Plus with the sheer number of snaps and players to evaluate, they need to have a lot of low pay employees to get that out promptly. Quality control would be even harder

Thats why their grades gain validity over the course of a season as the sample size grows. As you have pointed out, they add context to "dumb" straight up stats. The Ware example when comparing him to Brandon Graham is a great one. If are just looking at sack numbers, you might conclude they had equivalent seasons. But once you know that Ware had 200+ more snaps, you see why Graham had a better season. And you can further tease these grades out by pass defense or run defense.

 

[atlantacowboy]

PFF has little consistency because it’s not the same guy watching all the players. It’s subjective.

Their grades look a lot like the AP all pro team actually, so how bad could they be?

 

[Cmac]

PFF player grades are worthless.

....they were worthless against Green Bay and Jax to hold leads.

 

[Hennessy_King]

Top 10 defenders

1. Chris Jones KC 92.6
2. Myles garret CLE 92.5
3. Micah Parson 91.8
4. Dexter Lawrence NYG 91.6
5. Bobby Wagner LA 90.7
6. Nick Bosa SF 90.6
7 Aaron Donald 90.5
8 Bryce Huff. NYJ 90.4
9. Quinnen Williams/Brandon Graham/ Max crosby 90.1

No other Cowboy player made the top 100

I said it all year. Its micah or no1. This defense still needs some real talent outside of Micah

 

[RonnieT24]

I won't bore everyone with my usual tirade about the uselessness of PFF grades and why but I will chime in and say that awarding a guy like Graham points for playing fewer snaps is just silly. Tank's ability to move inside and still be productive allowing others to eat on the outside was extremely valuable to our defense. There are simply not 100 better defensive players in the NFL than Demarcus Lawrence. There just aint.. but however they wanna do their grades is their business. I don't have to buy into them or the false narratives they foster amongst fans.

 

[atlantacowboy]

I won't bore everyone with my usual tirade about the uselessness of PFF grades and why but I will chime in and say that awarding a guy like Graham points for playing fewer snaps is just silly. Tank's ability to move inside and still be productive allowing others to eat on the outside was extremely valuable to our defense. There are simply not 100 better defensive players in the NFL than Demarcus Lawrence. There just aint.. but however they wanna do their grades is their business. I don't have to buy into them or the false narratives they foster amongst fans.

Well, find us a metric to support your hot opinion.

 

[Ken]

Their grades look a lot like the AP all pro team actually, so how bad could they be?

Gee...i wonder where they get their info to decide who gets all pro?

These are not the best of the best that vote on this honor.

 

[gimmesix]

This is why this site sucks and has no value to me....ready?

Brandon Graham- tied for 9th

Dlaw...can't even crack the top 100.

				Tack					Fumb				Def
Rk	Player	Year	G	Solo	Ast	QBHits	TFL	Sk	FF	FR	Yds	TD	Int	Yds	TD
1	Brandon Graham	2022	17	19	16	16	11	11.0	2	0	0	0	0	0	0
2	DeMarcus Lawrence	2022	17	43	22	13	9	6.0	3	2	19	1	0	0	0

[thead] [/thead]


Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
Generated 2/6/2023.

They definitely do tend to overvalue sacks.

 

[gimmesix]

Context is important. This is not a cumulative totality stat, it’s a per play performance stat. What their value was when they were on the field.

Brandon Graham had 11 sacks, 21 pressures, and 16 QB hits in only 474 snaps

Demarcus Lawrence had 6 sacks, 21 pressures, 13 QB hits in 697 snaps. That is a significant difference

So let's say a player got on the field for one play and got a sack. Does that mean he's the top defender in the league?

I understand that you have to look at the per-play performance, but I think if you are ranking the players, you also have to consider the totality of the performance. There are reasons Graham played more than 200 fewer snaps than Lawrence. Frankly, having him ahead of Reddick is an insult. I know PFF is just using their grading for this compilation, but there needs to be some kind of differentiation between full-time players and part-timers. There are a lot more demands and responsibilities for full-time players than players who come in around 20 snaps a game just to rush the passer.

 

[jterrell]

For that, You have to understand how PFF grades players. This is not a cumulative achievement stat, but an average value stat when they’re on the field.

Graham had 11 sacks 21 pressures, 16 QB hits in 474 snaps

Reddick had 16 sacks, 41 pressures, 26 Qb hits in 817 snaps

Then you factor in which player PFF determined had the better year in run defense. I don’t have PFF membership to see, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Graham was quite a bit higher in that category, as is his wont.



I agree Reddick had the much better year in totality, but on a per snap basis I can understand how PFF came to this conclusion.

You are describing why their system sucks and doing a good job of it.
A player who plays half the snaps of another player is rarely if ever BETTER.
That is why snaps should factor in on a positive way to overall grades.

DLaw is a top 5 DE versus the run and was literally the only Cowboys DL plus run stopper for much of the season.
Comparing him to Graham is hilarious.

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

So let's say a player got on the field for one play and got a sack. Does that mean he's the top defender in the league?

I understand that you have to look at the per-play performance, but I think if you are ranking the players, you also have to consider the totality of the performance. There are reasons Graham played more than 200 fewer snaps than Lawrence. Frankly, having him ahead of Reddick is an insult. I know PFF is just using their grading for this compilation, but there needs to be some kind of differentiation between full-time players and part-timers. There are a lot more demands and responsibilities for full-time players than players who come in around 20 snaps a game just to rush the passer.

They have a minimum number of snaps to be qualified that reduces the possibility of aberrational statlines like that… so if you did that and qualified then yes.

Keep in mind I’m not saying I in any way agree with this system of ranking; I simply explained how to understand how they came to this number to the people who were puzzled by the methodology.

 

[Nova]

PFF is dumb. That said, Chris Jones is a monster.

In another universe, maybe we draft the athletic 6'6" 310lb from the SEC instead of the linebacker with severe knee injury.

 

[LatinMind]

For that, You have to understand how PFF grades players. This is not a cumulative achievement stat, but an average value stat when they’re on the field.

Graham had 11 sacks 21 pressures, 16 QB hits in 474 snaps

Reddick had 16 sacks, 41 pressures, 26 Qb hits in 817 snaps

Then you factor in which player PFF determined had the better year in run defense. I don’t have PFF membership to see, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Graham was quite a bit higher in that category, as is his wont.



I agree Reddick had the much better year in totality, but on a per snap basis I can understand how PFF came to this conclusion.

The armchair gms will never like anything that doesn't say they're right 100% of the time.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Top 10 defenders

1. Chris Jones KC 92.6
2. Myles garret CLE 92.5
3. Micah Parson 91.8
4. Dexter Lawrence NYG 91.6
5. Bobby Wagner LA 90.7
6. Nick Bosa SF 90.6
7 Aaron Donald 90.5
8 Bryce Huff. NYJ 90.4
9. Quinnen Williams/Brandon Graham/ Max crosby 90.1

No other Cowboy player made the top 100

Wagner was the guy we should have signed. Would have made. Huge difference solidifying the middle and the run.

 

[RonnieT24]

Well, find us a metric to support your hot opinion.

You mean like when they rated Diggs like the 97th best corner in the league last year? That wasn't enough for you?

 

[Stash]

I'm gonna ask for you to be permanently banned, how 'bout dat?

 

[Stash]

Mods, do something about this lying troll before it gets seriously ugly! Tired of his lies.

 

[BleedSilverandBlue]

This is why this site sucks and has no value to me....ready?

Brandon Graham- tied for 9th

Dlaw...can't even crack the top 100.

				Tack					Fumb				Def
Rk	Player	Year	G	Solo	Ast	QBHits	TFL	Sk	FF	FR	Yds	TD	Int	Yds	TD
1	Brandon Graham	2022	17	19	16	16	11	11.0	2	0	0	0	0	0	0
2	DeMarcus Lawrence	2022	17	43	22	13	9	6.0	3	2	19	1	0	0	0

[thead] [/thead]


Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
Generated 2/6/2023.

Anyone who knows and watched football knows that D-Law is easily a top-50 defender in the entire NFL. I don't know what film PFF was looking at.