Players moving to oust Upshaw

[Randy White]

Guaranteed contracts are the right thing to do. How can you justify a team being able to tear up a contract whenever they want to by cutting a player? The player isn't allowed to opt of his contract whenever he wants, so why should the team be able to? That's not how contracts work in the real world. Guaranteed contracts would also simplify the salary cap immensely.

You're sure about that ? Becareful what you wish for because guranteed contracts are not the only answer.

How would you like to see Darren Hambrick with a guranteed contract ? How about Quincy Carter ? Heck, how about Jacques Reeves ?

Personally, I think the NFL has it right, especially when you compare it to baseball and basketball. Could it be improved ? Sure. There should be a bit more security for players, but I'd prefer that it would come in the form of benefits, like a better retiring package and so forth. Otherwise, keep it the way it is. The players, at least the great ones, are still getting paid, while the marginal ones get the salaries they deserve, and that's the key right there.

The difference between the NFL and the rest ( NBA and MLB ) is that in the NBA and MLB, the marginal player it's overpaid, which then forces the salaries of the upper echelon players to go up. When your average/below average guy in the NBA ( Luke Walton, for example, since I'm a Lakers fan ) gets 5 million dollars a year, there's a problem.

 

[kevwun]

Yep, I'm positive. I don't like the idea of contracts that aren't actually contracts.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

That would be the single worst idea in the history of the NFL to guaruntee contracts.

You'd REALLY like to see teams sign a guy, after he has a good year or two, and then he gets a big deal and for the next 5 years does nothing and the team has to keep him cause he's assured that deal?

I wish you were the owner of the Eagles. God how wonderful it would be watching you and them go 1-15 practically every year.

 

[kevwun]

It's amazing that guys in the NBA and MLB still perform with guaranteed contracts. Teams should be punished for giving big contracts to crappy players. I don't have a problem with that.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Standardize incentives yet make them excluded from the cap. That way no one owner can promise a player more incentives for playing for him than another team could.

For example, say a WR free agent is looking to sign somewhere. With hard caps on base guaranteed contracts in place, all he can find is Oakland for 1.5 million or the Cowboys for 1 million base. The two teams could only offer the same incentives for the WR as bonus ( League mandated incentives of +$1,000 per catch, + $25,000 per TD, +$250,000 for a Probowl birth, etc ).

The free agent would then have to determine if the extra $500,000 base with the Raiders would trump the likelihood of better self production and incentives playing with Romo and the Boys.

It would basically make the really big money a player could earn all be based off performance while guaranteeing them a decent base contract amount.

I could see a lot of problems with this method but it is an idea that has some fairness to it.

The problem is that in order for something like this to work, the players would have to accept reductions in Base Contracts. If the owners adopted this, it's very unlikely that they would do so without the stipulation that players would not be making less on the base contract in order to get guaranted money. I doubt the owners would provide guaranted contracts at the same salary levels that exist today. I don't see the players accepting less money, even if it's guaranted. JMO.

 

[Verdict]

Frankly, I can't believe the NFL Owners have had it this good for this long. The only major professional sport with a hard cap AND they gave the owner's franchise tags on top of that. Free agency in the NFL is basically a joke. The NFL players are 15 years behind basketball and 30 years behind baseball. The players association has to get rid of the franchise tags. It gives the owners all the bargaining leverage for contracts.

On the other hand, there are far less games played in football due to the physical demands of the sport. I am quite sure that if there were 162 football games per year played that player salaries would escalate. LOL. The problem is that will never happen because of the demands of the sport.

You can't compare salaries between sports for that very reason.

 

[Randy White]

It's amazing that guys in the NBA and MLB still perform with guaranteed contracts. Teams should be punished for giving big contracts to crappy players. I don't have a problem with that.

How do you suggest they get punished ? And then, how do you suggest the punishment should be enforced ?


Dallas Cowboys signed Marcellus Wiley as a free agent, if I remember correctly, paid him a 5 million dollars signing bonus. For all intended purposes, Wiley was a complete bust, a " crappy player ".

So exactly how would you punish the Cowboys for giving a crappy player such a big contract ?

 

[kevwun]

They get punished by paying alot of money to someone who isn't good. They learn from their mistake. Dallas hasn been pretty smart with their free agent signings since Wiley and Riveira, don't you think?

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Frankly, I can't believe the NFL Owners have had it this good for this long. The only major professional sport with a hard cap AND they gave the owner's franchise tags on top of that. Free agency in the NFL is basically a joke. The NFL players are 15 years behind basketball and 30 years behind baseball. The players association has to get rid of the franchise tags. It gives the owners all the bargaining leverage for contracts.

Doesn't it make you wonder that one sport is prospering while the other two are fading fast?


I'd hate to see a stronger NFLPA because it would lead to the eventual decline in what's by far America's most popular sport.

 

[kevwun]

I don't think the strength of a sport's players union has any effect on it's popularity or prosperity.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

I don't think the strength of a sport's players union has any effect on it's popularity or prosperity.

Then you're sadly mistaken.

Competitive balance cannot be achieved without a salary cap of some kind (see MLB).

 

[kevwun]

Who said anything about getting rid of the salary cap?

 

[Randy White]

They get punished by paying alot of money to someone who isn't good. They learn from their mistake.

Obviously.

Now, if those contracts were guaranteed, the punishment would be longer and more punitive due to the fact that the guaranteed contracts would still be counting against the cap even though the player is no longer of any use to the team.

With this system, teams are able to correct their mistakes within two years, in most cases. With your idea, teams would have to carry the burden ( and probably the player as well ) for the length of the contract. See Pacman Jones' contract.

Once again, it's a fair system for all parties involved. The top players are going to get paid. The fringe players get the salaries they deserved, and there is guaranteed money that comes in the form of bonuses and/or even guaranteed base salaries.

The difference ? Unlike baseball and basketball, NFL players must keep proving their worth for most of their careers.

Now there's a new concept
:sarcasm:

I do agree that there's improvements that need to be made, but, as I stated before, it should be in the form of benefits, particularly retirement and health care benefits. If I were the union prez, that's the direction that I would be trying to steer the negotiations to.

Dallas hasn been pretty smart with their free agent signings since Wiley and Riveira, don't you think?

That's because they've taken less chances as they've become more talented.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Who said anything about getting rid of the salary cap?

What the heck do you think that the first thing a strong union would do?

 

[Rack]

Shockingly, no one has mentioned Roy Willy's name yet.

Roy has been to the last 5 probowls. Despite what some ignorant fans might think, he's one of the best safeties in the game today.

It's amazing that guys in the NBA and MLB still perform with guaranteed contracts. Teams should be punished for giving big contracts to crappy players. I don't have a problem with that.

Basketball and baseball are more "individualistic" sports. A good basketball or baseball player will be good regardless. In football, success is more dependant on system and other teammates. Some players put up big numbers cuz they had other great players taking attention away from them. Just take Greg Ellis for example. You really think he'd get 12 sacks in a season w/o a DeMarcus Ware type player taking diverting attention away from him?


How did Steve Young do in Tampa Bay? How'd he do in San Fran?


I could literally go on all day with these types of examples. And you talk about how great the NBA and MLB are doing, yet the strongest league in ALL of sports is the NFL. When was the last time there was a strike? When was the last time there was a lockout?

What about in the NBA or MLB?


I believe I've made my point.