Salary cap problems?

[Hostile]

There's that noise coming from the cellar ....... once again.

Turn on the light. Hurts their eyes.

 

[Cowboys22]

They were talking on sirius NFL today about last years cap or shall we say no cap. It was said, that there was an understanding among the owners that language would be put in the new CBA that would severely punish teams for dumping players with high salaries. It was also mentioned on an episode of talking cowboys.

I'd like to know more about this. I remember Adam always saying that salaries dumped in the non cap years would come back to bite those teams but I don't remember any details. I know the skins used the uncapped years to unload a ton of salary and everyone now says thaey are in great shape with their cap. So what is the deal here?

 

[AdamJT13]

I'd like to know more about this. I remember Adam always saying that salaries dumped in the non cap years would come back to bite those teams but I don't remember any details. I know the skins used the uncapped years to unload a ton of salary and everyone now says thaey are in great shape with their cap. So what is the deal here?

Under the old CBA, bonus prorations did not accelerate when a player was released in an uncapped year. They remained in place against the cap (if there was a cap) in each year of that contract. Many media types thought that teams could just cut players, have all of their bonus prorations accelerate into the uncapped year, then have a nice cap situation if the cap returned. The only way that would be true is if the new CBA wipes out any dead money from cuts made before the new CBA takes effect. That's why some of the teams that supposedly have great cap situations might not be in such great situations after all.

 

[Hostile]

Under the old CBA, bonus prorations did not accelerate when a player was released in an uncapped year. They remained in place against the cap (if there was a cap) in each year of that contract. Many media types thought that teams could just cut players, have all of their bonus prorations accelerate into the uncapped year, then have a nice cap situation if the cap returned. The only way that would be true is if the new CBA wipes out any dead money from cuts made before the new CBA takes effect. That's why some of the teams that supposedly have great cap situations might not be in such great situations after all.

Can you expound on this a little? I think I get it, but there is still a disconnect somewhere.

 

[gimmesix]

Can you expound on this a little? I think I get it, but there is still a disconnect somewhere.

I assume it means that dead money from those previous cuts will be counted against the cap, while right now, it isn't being "counted" because there's no CBA.

The media is assuming the dead money is gone because the players were cut during an uncapped year, but it's not gone, it just hasn't been applied yet since there's no deal in place.

 

[AdamJT13]

I assume it means that dead money from those previous cuts will be counted against the cap, while right now, it isn't being "counted" because there's no CBA.

The media is assuming the dead money is gone because the players were cut during an uncapped year, but it's not gone, it just hasn't been applied yet since there's no deal in place.

That is correct. There's a *chance* that the new CBA will allow that dead money to vanish, but it would be surprising.

 

[gimmesix]

That is correct. There's a *chance* that the new CBA will allow that dead money to vanish, but it would be surprising.

If the dead money does count, then it was probably in Dallas' best interests to wait before making any "cost-cutting" moves. That way the Cowboys can assess where the new cap stands and make whatever moves are necessary. It essentially gives them control of how much dead money hits the cap (which affects how much restructuring they need to do).

The only way that "gamble" doesn't pay off is if the new CBA allows the dead money to vanish.

 

[Cowboys22]

If they allow all that dead money to simply vanish, I would think they would give a week or two for all teams to take advantage of that type of situation before the new rules go into effect. That is just too much of an advantage to let a few teams have. I would think they would want all teams to be able to reset under the new rules and get rid of bad contracts so they are on even footing with all other teams.

 

[Cythim]

We obviously have some "fat" we could trim from our cap by cutting players, but we can save a ton of cap room just by simple restructuring of contracts. Unlike in previous years that had a cap, we haven't done anything yet to minimize the cap charges for 2011, which is why we have a bunch of guys who have huge base salaries. By converting most of their salaries to bonuses and prorating them, we can save millions in cap room and have what we need to sign players.

Do you have any specifics on the restructuring that can be done or is this just a statement based on what has been done in the past? Austin's contract is prime for restructuring (saving at least $5 million in cap space) but I don't see many more that will have a significant impact.

 

[firehawk350]

That is correct. There's a *chance* that the new CBA will allow that dead money to vanish, but it would be surprising.

I think this isn't true if it is a true cash cap. The idea is only money spent in a league year is counted towards the cap, so it eliminates the idea of bonus proration (and therefore, dead cap). I think this is the big concession the owners gave up to get a greater piece of the pie. I could be wrong.

 

[Hostile]

I think this isn't true if it is a true cash cap. The idea is only money spent in a league year is counted towards the cap, so it eliminates the idea of bonus proration (and therefore, dead cap). I think this is the big concession the owners gave up to get a greater piece of the pie. I could be wrong.

This was my "disconnect" I was talking about earlier. I was trying to figure out how the difference in calculation would factor.

 

[CCBoy]

Congrats on your 6-10 season

Or, using the Commander logic, let's look at the last three years and add up the score...never mind, the salary isn't going to choke anything around Jerry and Stephen Jones. Too bad you can't say the same concerning Washington. Just where are a high priced quarterback and defensive lineman going to play now?

 

[AdamJT13]

I think this isn't true if it is a true cash cap. The idea is only money spent in a league year is counted towards the cap, so it eliminates the idea of bonus proration (and therefore, dead cap). I think this is the big concession the owners gave up to get a greater piece of the pie. I could be wrong.

Everything I've read says that there will be a salary cap just like before. In addition, there will be a rolling three-year cash minimum.

If the cap was going to simply disappear and be replaced by an annual cash accounting, we wouldn't be having a thread about our cap situation.

 

[Ren]

Dump the likes of Barber, Newman, Davis and Roy and all our cap problems are solved for the next 3-4 years

 

[firehawk350]

Everything I've read says that there will be a salary cap just like before. In addition, there will be a rolling three-year cash minimum.

If the cap was going to simply disappear and be replaced by an annual cash accounting, we wouldn't be having a thread about our cap situation.

I haven't read anything like that. I'm curious where you got it from...

Sure you would. If you are $16M over the projected cap, regardless of the accounting that it took to get there, with neither of your starting OTs signed, that's a pretty big issue. If you are $16M over on the old CBA cap model, then the players you do cut will save you less (dead money). If you are $16M over on a strict cash cap, then you'll have a hard time handing out large enough signing bonuses to retain Free while signing Smith.

Using a 3 year rolling cap minimum seems like there could be some kind of disconnect where a team can't meet the minimum because it would put them over the cap... It would seem that to have a cash min, you would have to have a cash max.

 

[AdamJT13]

I haven't read anything like that. I'm curious where you got it from.

Basically every report that has been written has mentioned both cap and cash accounting. Here's Jeff Pash's comments on it --

http://nfllabor.com/2011/03/18/pash...precedented-90-percent-of-salary-cap-in-cash/

Sure you would. If you are $16M over the projected cap, regardless of the accounting that it took to get there, with neither of your starting OTs signed, that's a pretty big issue.

We wouldn't be $16 million over if the only thing that counted was the cash we spend this year.

 

[Cowboys22]

Basically every report that has been written has mentioned both cap and cash accounting. Here's Jeff Pash's comments on it --

http://nfllabor.com/2011/03/18/pash...precedented-90-percent-of-salary-cap-in-cash/




We wouldn't be $16 million over if the only thing that counted was the cash we spend this year.

I don't see how the system mentioned in that article can work unless a team is allowed to go over the cap in a given year. If a team were to carry quite a bit of dead money for several years in a row, there's no way could also pay 90% in cash and still be under the cap. This is all getting very confusing. I can't wait until its all anounced and we can begin talking about actual facts and what they mean to the Cowboys.

 

[CoCo]

Based on the info Adam has shared in this thread, I'm going from "nervous about our cap" to "trusting it'll all work", until I hear factual information that warrants otherwise.

Thanks Adam.

 

[firehawk350]

Basically every report that has been written has mentioned both cap and cash accounting. Here's Jeff Pash's comments on it --

http://nfllabor.com/2011/03/18/pash...precedented-90-percent-of-salary-cap-in-cash/


We wouldn't be $16 million over if the only thing that counted was the cash we spend this year.

Thanks for the link. A mix between a cash floor and a 2006-esque salary cap would require management to be relatively smart and favor continuity even more.

Okay... Still, that's pretty far over. I could look at the bonus structures of "obvious" cuts like Leonard Davis, MBIII and Roy Williams but it would seem to me that those cuts will, at best, get you back under the cap. Even with bonus proration, you will still struggle to get the major moves you need to make. Those obvious cuts all have 3-4 years of time left on their contracts so there will be a large amount of dead money that will mitigate (to varying degrees) the cap effects of cutting them.

So I'm curious, how would you get back under the cap if you were Jerry? How much under would that put you?

 

[Cowboys22]

Based on the info Adam has shared in this thread, I'm going from "nervous about our cap" to "trusting it'll all work", until I hear factual information that warrants otherwise.

Thanks Adam.

There's no doubt things will work out but all these free agent threads seem a bit silly because there's just no way the deal is going to present a situation where Dallas is free to spend tons of cash on free agents. They will be able to manuver, probably get Free signed, and then pick over the 2nd tier leftovers. If the team is going to improve, it will have to be from having Garrett as head coach the entire year, having Ryan as DC, and having some of the young guys rebound or breakout. Most likely, improvement is not coming via expensive free agents.