Saquon mania vs. Ezekiel facts

[G2]

Elliott has been more consistent, even though Barkley had only one season in the NFL, we know Elliott is great week to week.
Barkley had 7 game under 50 yards. He occasionally hits a home run, but with regard to grinding through all game long the nod goes to Elliott.
It's a common excuse to blame NY's O line, but to be honest Barkley should have shared his offensive rookie of the year award with Will Hernadez because he was a monster run blocking.

 

[aria]

Elliott has been more consistent, even though Barkley had only one season in the NFL, we know Elliott is great week to week.
Barkley had 7 game under 50 yards. He occasionally hits a home run, but with regard to grinding through all game long the nod goes to Elliott.
It's a common excuse to blame NY's O line, but to be honest Barkley should have shared his offensive rookie of the year award with Will Hernadez because he was a monster run blocking.

Hernandez is great, Solder was below average for the first half of the season and that doesn’t account for the rest of the scrubs on the O line that aren’t fit to be back ups on most teams.

That would be like me saying, Zeke had Frederick so he should have been fine even though everyone else on the O line was horrendous. Instead, Zeke still had 4 average to above average linemen and when Fred was out that was an excuse as to why the entire line sucked.

 

[keysersoze]

They can run zeke like hes gonna score 2-3 tds a game but hes still only avg 6-7 tds a year.

Ladainian Tomlinson is the all time leading td scorer with 31 tds in one season.

31 tds versus 6-7 tds by Zeke. Tds are just as important to winning as yards.

Everyone (Especially the Dak Haters) claim that Zeke is the main reason we have had 3 consecutive winning seasons. I have to agree for the most part. So whether he scores 50 tds a season or not. We are winning with him and THATS ALL THAT MATTERS

 

[iceberg]

Listen, I get it, Saquon Barkley is a freak athlete, a really nice guy, and a big-play waiting to happen. I think he proved himself as the best big-play specialist in the NFL last year and I suspect that will continue into 2019. But, as I have been for this very same reason since he was in college, I'm tapping the brakes on crowning him the best running back in the league --as much of the rest of the sports world is already doing.

I did a breakdown after the season, as I had done for their respective college seasons before Barkley went pro, detailing what their stats look like when you subtract their single biggest run or play from each game of a singular season. Just one per contest. The results, factoring in receptions as well, confirmed my observation that Barkley is a back who lives & dies by the big-play --but is not the every-down runner yet (including collegiately) that you expect a "great" to be.

For this missive, I'll focus only on their rushing totals --although it's equally applicable to their receiving stats as well. But I've got a buddy who says, "Zeke is the best guy in the league to just turn around & hand the ball to." I think this breakdown demonstrates that quite clearly.

So, for posterity, Zeke & Saquon's "rushing" totals for 2018 were:


Saquon Barkley -- 261 carries, 1,307 yards, 5.0 yards-per-carry

Ezekiel Elliott -- 304 carries, 1,434 yards, 4.7 yards-per-carry


However, when you subtract their single biggest run from each game (as I've done for the following stats), this comparison turns very different:


Saquon Barkley -- 245 carries, 783 yards, 3.19 yards-per-carry

Ezekiel Elliott -- 289 carries, 1,199 yards, 4.14 yards-per-carry


The disparity is astonishing. Remove just 16 runs from Barkley's season (out of 261) and he drops a *WHOPPING* 524 yards from his total! Conversely, when you take away Zeke's longest run from each game, his total drops only 235 yards.

To put it another way:

Saquon averaged 32.75 yards on only 16 carries of the season.

And he averaged 3.19 yards-per-carry over the remaining 245!

Over the course of the season, without those 16 "long" runs Barkley's average plummets from a robust 5.0 to a paltry 3.19 per-carry (almost 2 full yards less). Zeke, on the other hand, minus his best run from each contest, falls from a 4.7-yard average to a still respectable 4.14 yards-per-carry.

For even greater perspective, if you subtract Elliott's best run from every game he still would have finished 3rd in the league in rushing. When you take away Barkley's longest runs, however, he drops from 2nd in the league in rushing all the way down to 23rd --

That is a precipitous plummet!


But while I believe those stats alone clearly distinguish Zeke as the better runner on a down-to-down basis, by a lot, and likewise demonstrate Barkley as the better big-play back, it's not until it's broken down on a game-by-game basis that the vivid difference in their contributions to their team's offensive success becomes perfectly clear. So we're going to take a more microcosmic look at this parallel to bear out the conclusion that Ezekiel Elliott remains, quite simply, the very best running back in the NFL.


So the way I'll do this for greatest visual appeal is to list their rushing totals per-week MINUS both back's single biggest run from each game. The effect is really quite eye-popping:


Week 1 --

Saquon: 17 carries, 38 yards, 2.23 YPC

Ezekiel: 14 carries, 52 yards, 3.71 YPC


Week 2 --

Saquon: 10 carries, 18 yards, 1.80 YPC

Ezekiel: 16 carries, 59 yards, 3.68 YPC


Week 3 --

Saquon: 16 carries, 58 yards, 3.62 YPC

Ezekiel: 15 carries, 101 yards, 6.73 YPC


Week 4 --

Saquon: 9 carries, 16 yards, 1.77 YPC

Ezekiel: 24 carries, 111 yards, 4.62 YPC


Week 5 --

Saquon: 14 carries, 18 yards, 1.28 YPC

Ezekiel: 19 carries, 40 yards, 2.10 YPC


Week 6 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 80 yards, 6.66 YPC

Ezekiel: 23 carries, 85 yards, 3.69 YPC


Week 7 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 28 yards, 2.15 YPC

Ezekiel: 14 carries, 27 yards, 1.92 YPC


Week 8 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 29 yards, 2.41 YPC

Ezekiel: 16 carries, 44 yards, 2.75 YPC


Week 9 --

Saquon: 19 carries, 49 yards, 2.57 YPC

Ezekiel: 18 carries, 116 yards, 6.44 YPC


Week 10 --

Saquon: 26 carries, 119 yards, 4.57 YPC

Ezekiel: 22 carries, 99 yards, 4.50 YPC


Week 11 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 50 yards, 4.16 YPC

Ezekiel: 25 carries, 105 yards, 4.20 YPC


Week 12 --

Saquon: 23 carries, 96 yards, 4.17 YPC

Ezekiel: 22 carries, 54 yards, 2.45 YPC


Week 13 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 92 yards, 7.07 YPC

Ezekiel: 27 carries, 93 yards, 3.44 YPC


Week 14 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 14 yards, 1.07 YPC

Ezekiel: 17 carries, 63 yards, 3.70 YPC


Week 15 --

Saquon: 20 carries, 37 yards, 1.85 YPC

Ezekiel: 17 carries, 68 yards, 4.00 YPC


Week 16 --

Saquon: 16 carries, 41 yards, 2.56 YPC

Ezekiel: Did-Not-Play


So out of 15 games, side-by-side, subtracting their single longest runs from each contest, Zeke had a higher yards-per-carry than Saquon in 10 of those contests, outpacing Barkley by an average of: 1.48, 1.88, 3.11, 2.85, 0.82, 0.34, 3.87, 0.04, 2.63, and 2.16 yards-per-carry.

Accumulatively, those 10 games amount to --


Saquon: 142 carries, 469 yards, 3.30 YPC

Ezekiel: 168 carries, 759 yards, 4.51 YPC


Minus their one longest run from each of those games, it's clear that Zeke was the far more productive, effective, consistent back across 2/3rds of the season and a vaster number of carries. Conversely, in the 5 games Barkley outdid Zeke, the stats are:


Saquon: 87 carries, 415 yards, 4.77 YPC

Ezekiel: 108 carries, 358 yards, 3.61 YPC


So for 5 games out of the season, minus their big runs, Saquon averaged 1.16 yards-per-carry more than Zeke --out-rushing him by 57 yards across those 5 games.

For 10 games out of the season, minus their big runs, Zeke averaged 1.20 yards-per-carry more than Saquon --out-rushing him by 290 yards across those 10 games.

Over the course of the season, minus their big runs, that amounts to 457 more rushing yards for Zeke and nearly 1 full yard-per-carry (0.95) greater.


If we pit their 16th game of the season against one another (Week 16 for Saquon, Week 1 of the Playoffs for Zeke), again, subtracting their single biggest run from each game --


Saquon: 16 carries, 41 yards, 2.56 YPC

Ezekiel: 25 carries, 93 yards, 3.72 YPC


Consistently, Elliott demonstrates that he is the more productive runner, by quite a bit, across the far broader number and circumstances of their respective carries. Barkley may indeed be the better home-run hitter. But there's no question that Zeke is out there getting the dirty yards, the needed yards, Saquon is leaving on the field; and the fortunes of their teams in 2018 each reflect the natural result of that:


RECORDS --

Cowboys: 10-6

Giants: 5-11


This is also assessed in the fact that Zeke picked up 73 first-downs, to Saquon's 50, in one fewer game.

That's 69 more downs of offense that Zeke's legs provided for his team than Barkley did for his.


Saquon had 5 more runs of 20+ yards than Zeke (16-to-11) & 6 more runs of 40+ yards (7-to-1).

Which do you think a coach who wants to win would prefer, 11 more "explosive" plays on the season, or 69 more offensive snaps? And this whole query instantly makes me think of Emmitt Smith vs. Barry Sanders, because like I predicted before the season, the Zeke/Saquon rivalry is shaping up very much like the old debate between those greats!

Saquon, like Sanders (his idol), is the best big-play threat in the league.

Ezekiel, like Emmitt, is the best running back in the league.


Of course, this contest isn't remotely over. But in all the metrics we can currently assess, college & the pros, this is who these backs have proven themselves to be, consistently. It's extraordinary how much their college production mirrors their NFL performances. I strongly suspect this will continue, and I don't think we've seen either of their bests.

Athletically, this season should display the very best Ezekiel Elliott the world has ever seen. He is now a young 23 years old and is likely fully grown. Word is he's in the best shape of his life, has gone from 225lbs. in his rookie year (when he was the youngest player in the league) to a manly 230lbs. this offseason.

I believe we're about to see the biggest, strongest, and fastest Ezekiel Elliott there has ever been.

And it might just be a perfect storm regarding the physical maturation of his ability being paired with all the talent surrounding him. There's no question in my mind that Zeke is coming into the best situation for a running back in the NFL to produce at a big-time level. Barkley is certain to have more than 15-minutes of fame. But when, not if, Elliott leads the NFL in rushing again, maybe to unprecedented degrees, people are going to have to start acknowledging that #21 is the #1 runner in the league.


--yeah, even if Barkley has more "big-plays" on the season.

Take those away, and Barkley is over 40% less of a running back.

Kid's got to show me some things before he's in the same breath with Zeke...

that's an awful lot of work to go out of your way to remove what makes 1 player great so you can still call the one you like "great".

both have a lot of talent. period. different styles for different results. any team would love to have either player on their roster. sitting there saying "take away their best plays they're not that great" is just stupid.

 

[aria]

Everyone (Especially the Dak Haters) claim that Zeke is the main reason we have had 3 consecutive winning seasons. I have to agree for the most part. So whether he scores 50 tds a season or not. We are winning with him and THATS ALL THAT MATTERS

Good afternoon keyser! This goes back to my original point, which I’m sick of talking about and not trying to go there, but if I were to nominate one group of players on any teams offense that make the most difference it’s the O line. It all starts there.

It doesn’t matter how good your receivers are, how good your QB is, how good your TE or RB is...without an O line all of those great players become average at best.

 

[Jinxx13x]

Listen, I get it, Saquon Barkley is a freak athlete, a really nice guy, and a big-play waiting to happen. I think he proved himself as the best big-play specialist in the NFL last year and I suspect that will continue into 2019. But, as I have been for this very same reason since he was in college, I'm tapping the brakes on crowning him the best running back in the league --as much of the rest of the sports world is already doing.

I did a breakdown after the season, as I had done for their respective college seasons before Barkley went pro, detailing what their stats look like when you subtract their single biggest run or play from each game of a singular season. Just one per contest. The results, factoring in receptions as well, confirmed my observation that Barkley is a back who lives & dies by the big-play --but is not the every-down runner yet (including collegiately) that you expect a "great" to be.

For this missive, I'll focus only on their rushing totals --although it's equally applicable to their receiving stats as well. But I've got a buddy who says, "Zeke is the best guy in the league to just turn around & hand the ball to." I think this breakdown demonstrates that quite clearly.

So, for posterity, Zeke & Saquon's "rushing" totals for 2018 were:


Saquon Barkley -- 261 carries, 1,307 yards, 5.0 yards-per-carry

Ezekiel Elliott -- 304 carries, 1,434 yards, 4.7 yards-per-carry


However, when you subtract their single biggest run from each game (as I've done for the following stats), this comparison turns very different:


Saquon Barkley -- 245 carries, 783 yards, 3.19 yards-per-carry

Ezekiel Elliott -- 289 carries, 1,199 yards, 4.14 yards-per-carry


The disparity is astonishing. Remove just 16 runs from Barkley's season (out of 261) and he drops a *WHOPPING* 524 yards from his total! Conversely, when you take away Zeke's longest run from each game, his total drops only 235 yards.

To put it another way:

Saquon averaged 32.75 yards on only 16 carries of the season.

And he averaged 3.19 yards-per-carry over the remaining 245!

Over the course of the season, without those 16 "long" runs Barkley's average plummets from a robust 5.0 to a paltry 3.19 per-carry (almost 2 full yards less). Zeke, on the other hand, minus his best run from each contest, falls from a 4.7-yard average to a still respectable 4.14 yards-per-carry.

For even greater perspective, if you subtract Elliott's best run from every game he still would have finished 3rd in the league in rushing. When you take away Barkley's longest runs, however, he drops from 2nd in the league in rushing all the way down to 23rd --

That is a precipitous plummet!


But while I believe those stats alone clearly distinguish Zeke as the better runner on a down-to-down basis, by a lot, and likewise demonstrate Barkley as the better big-play back, it's not until it's broken down on a game-by-game basis that the vivid difference in their contributions to their team's offensive success becomes perfectly clear. So we're going to take a more microcosmic look at this parallel to bear out the conclusion that Ezekiel Elliott remains, quite simply, the very best running back in the NFL.


So the way I'll do this for greatest visual appeal is to list their rushing totals per-week MINUS both back's single biggest run from each game. The effect is really quite eye-popping:


Week 1 --

Saquon: 17 carries, 38 yards, 2.23 YPC

Ezekiel: 14 carries, 52 yards, 3.71 YPC


Week 2 --

Saquon: 10 carries, 18 yards, 1.80 YPC

Ezekiel: 16 carries, 59 yards, 3.68 YPC


Week 3 --

Saquon: 16 carries, 58 yards, 3.62 YPC

Ezekiel: 15 carries, 101 yards, 6.73 YPC


Week 4 --

Saquon: 9 carries, 16 yards, 1.77 YPC

Ezekiel: 24 carries, 111 yards, 4.62 YPC


Week 5 --

Saquon: 14 carries, 18 yards, 1.28 YPC

Ezekiel: 19 carries, 40 yards, 2.10 YPC


Week 6 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 80 yards, 6.66 YPC

Ezekiel: 23 carries, 85 yards, 3.69 YPC


Week 7 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 28 yards, 2.15 YPC

Ezekiel: 14 carries, 27 yards, 1.92 YPC


Week 8 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 29 yards, 2.41 YPC

Ezekiel: 16 carries, 44 yards, 2.75 YPC


Week 9 --

Saquon: 19 carries, 49 yards, 2.57 YPC

Ezekiel: 18 carries, 116 yards, 6.44 YPC


Week 10 --

Saquon: 26 carries, 119 yards, 4.57 YPC

Ezekiel: 22 carries, 99 yards, 4.50 YPC


Week 11 --

Saquon: 12 carries, 50 yards, 4.16 YPC

Ezekiel: 25 carries, 105 yards, 4.20 YPC


Week 12 --

Saquon: 23 carries, 96 yards, 4.17 YPC

Ezekiel: 22 carries, 54 yards, 2.45 YPC


Week 13 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 92 yards, 7.07 YPC

Ezekiel: 27 carries, 93 yards, 3.44 YPC


Week 14 --

Saquon: 13 carries, 14 yards, 1.07 YPC

Ezekiel: 17 carries, 63 yards, 3.70 YPC


Week 15 --

Saquon: 20 carries, 37 yards, 1.85 YPC

Ezekiel: 17 carries, 68 yards, 4.00 YPC


Week 16 --

Saquon: 16 carries, 41 yards, 2.56 YPC

Ezekiel: Did-Not-Play


So out of 15 games, side-by-side, subtracting their single longest runs from each contest, Zeke had a higher yards-per-carry than Saquon in 10 of those contests, outpacing Barkley by an average of: 1.48, 1.88, 3.11, 2.85, 0.82, 0.34, 3.87, 0.04, 2.63, and 2.16 yards-per-carry.

Accumulatively, those 10 games amount to --


Saquon: 142 carries, 469 yards, 3.30 YPC

Ezekiel: 168 carries, 759 yards, 4.51 YPC


Minus their one longest run from each of those games, it's clear that Zeke was the far more productive, effective, consistent back across 2/3rds of the season and a vaster number of carries. Conversely, in the 5 games Barkley outdid Zeke, the stats are:


Saquon: 87 carries, 415 yards, 4.77 YPC

Ezekiel: 108 carries, 358 yards, 3.61 YPC


So for 5 games out of the season, minus their big runs, Saquon averaged 1.16 yards-per-carry more than Zeke --out-rushing him by 57 yards across those 5 games.

For 10 games out of the season, minus their big runs, Zeke averaged 1.20 yards-per-carry more than Saquon --out-rushing him by 290 yards across those 10 games.

Over the course of the season, minus their big runs, that amounts to 457 more rushing yards for Zeke and nearly 1 full yard-per-carry (0.95) greater.


If we pit their 16th game of the season against one another (Week 16 for Saquon, Week 1 of the Playoffs for Zeke), again, subtracting their single biggest run from each game --


Saquon: 16 carries, 41 yards, 2.56 YPC

Ezekiel: 25 carries, 93 yards, 3.72 YPC


Consistently, Elliott demonstrates that he is the more productive runner, by quite a bit, across the far broader number and circumstances of their respective carries. Barkley may indeed be the better home-run hitter. But there's no question that Zeke is out there getting the dirty yards, the needed yards, Saquon is leaving on the field; and the fortunes of their teams in 2018 each reflect the natural result of that:


RECORDS --

Cowboys: 10-6

Giants: 5-11


This is also assessed in the fact that Zeke picked up 73 first-downs, to Saquon's 50, in one fewer game.

That's 69 more downs of offense that Zeke's legs provided for his team than Barkley did for his.


Saquon had 5 more runs of 20+ yards than Zeke (16-to-11) & 6 more runs of 40+ yards (7-to-1).

Which do you think a coach who wants to win would prefer, 11 more "explosive" plays on the season, or 69 more offensive snaps? And this whole query instantly makes me think of Emmitt Smith vs. Barry Sanders, because like I predicted before the season, the Zeke/Saquon rivalry is shaping up very much like the old debate between those greats!

Saquon, like Sanders (his idol), is the best big-play threat in the league.

Ezekiel, like Emmitt, is the best running back in the league.


Of course, this contest isn't remotely over. But in all the metrics we can currently assess, college & the pros, this is who these backs have proven themselves to be, consistently. It's extraordinary how much their college production mirrors their NFL performances. I strongly suspect this will continue, and I don't think we've seen either of their bests.

Athletically, this season should display the very best Ezekiel Elliott the world has ever seen. He is now a young 23 years old and is likely fully grown. Word is he's in the best shape of his life, has gone from 225lbs. in his rookie year (when he was the youngest player in the league) to a manly 230lbs. this offseason.

I believe we're about to see the biggest, strongest, and fastest Ezekiel Elliott there has ever been.

And it might just be a perfect storm regarding the physical maturation of his ability being paired with all the talent surrounding him. There's no question in my mind that Zeke is coming into the best situation for a running back in the NFL to produce at a big-time level. Barkley is certain to have more than 15-minutes of fame. But when, not if, Elliott leads the NFL in rushing again, maybe to unprecedented degrees, people are going to have to start acknowledging that #21 is the #1 runner in the league.


--yeah, even if Barkley has more "big-plays" on the season.

Take those away, and Barkley is over 40% less of a running back.

Kid's got to show me some things before he's in the same breath with Zeke...

Fantastic write up enjoyed the read ----- If Barkley ever gets hurt it could really hamper his game even more if he is unable to make those big plays ! Just stating the obvious i guess

 

[G2]

Everyone (Especially the Dak Haters) claim that Zeke is the main reason we have had 3 consecutive winning seasons. I have to agree for the most part. So whether he scores 50 tds a season or not. We are winning with him and THATS ALL THAT MATTERS

It also doesn't give credit to Elliott when he runs all the way down and we score a TD from a pass or a FG.

 

[G2]

Good afternoon keyser! This goes back to my original point, which I’m sick of talking about and not trying to go there, but if I were to nominate one group of players on any teams offense that make the most difference it’s the O line. It all starts there.

It doesn’t matter how good your receivers are, how good your QB is, how good your TE or RB is...without an O line all of those great players become average at best.

Actually, all of those positions matter.

 

[G2]

that's an awful lot of work to go out of your way to remove what makes 1 player great so you can still call the one you like "great".

both have a lot of talent. period. different styles for different results. any team would love to have either player on their roster. sitting there saying "take away their best plays they're not that great" is just stupid.

Not when you take both players biggest plays to illustrate the Elliott is a workhorse and grinds. It's nothing against Barkley really. To not understand that is stupid.

 

[iceberg]

Not when you take both players biggest plays to illustrate the Elliott is a workhorse and grinds. It's nothing against Barkley really. To not understand that is stupid.

No I understand.

Take away their best talent a player ain't crap.

they are different players with different talents. if barkely is the home run hitter and you're taking that away, then the fair comparison would be to take zeks strength and remove it. you're basically handicapping one and not the other and i just don't see the point.

take away zeke's grinding plays and he ain't nuthin. that's what a giants fan is saying, or you would likely be saying if we had barkley over elliott.

 

[aria]

Actually, all of those positions matter.

They all matter but I think O line is the most important overall.

 

[PoetTree]

No I understand.

Take away their best talent a player ain't crap.

they are different players with different talents. if barkely is the home run hitter and you're taking that away, then the fair comparison would be to take zeks strength and remove it. you're basically handicapping one and not the other and i just don't see the point.

take away zeke's grinding plays and he ain't nuthin. that's what a giants fan is saying, or you would likely be saying if we had barkley over elliott.

I'm not sure why people struggle with this concept; it's not hard.

My premise was specifically to illustrate, empirically, that Barkley is a back who lives or dies off the big-play, but is not nearly as productive or consistent or effective on the far broader number of his carries. My analysis does exactly that; and there's nothing unfair about it.

I fully admit, several times, that Barkley is the "more explosive" player, but also conclude that he is behind Elliott when it comes to down-by-down dominance. Across the MUCH larger percentage of their carries, Zeke is the more dominant force --even as Saquon is the more dominant force at producing "explosive" plays.

I also offer the analysis that Ezekiel's style is, historically, more conducive to winning; and I believe that's absolutely true. That doesn't mean I'm insulting Saquon Barkley, but rather just taking an honest, in-depth look at who each of them are as players.

Because of those explosive plays, which fans love and are very exciting to watch, there are a lot of people naming Saquon Barkley as the best runner in the NFL. However, I don't believe that's true based on my analysis of their respective games. Presently, the vast majority of the time, there is no rushing force in the league that is the equal to Ezekiel Elliott. He's in a class of his own when it comes to 4-quarters of dominance.

Could that change in the future?

Sure.
But dating all the way back through their college years, it hasn't ever been the case thus far.


Subtracting the rare explosive plays from each back (people still act like I only took Saquon's away) was merely a method of isolating their average plays more clearly, statistically, so that we could hone in on the broader result of their performances.

This just shouldn't be an offensive or controversial thing.

 

[aria]

I'm not sure why people struggle with this concept; it's not hard.

My premise was specifically to illustrate, empirically, that Barkley is a back who lives or dies off the big-play, but is not nearly as productive or consistent or effective on the far broader number of his carries. My analysis does exactly that; and there's nothing unfair about it.

I fully admit, several times, that Barkley is the "more explosive" player, but also conclude that he is behind Elliott when it comes to down-by-down dominance. Across the MUCH larger percentage of their carries, Zeke is the more dominant force --even as Saquon is the more dominant force at producing "explosive" plays.

I also offer the analysis that Ezekiel's style is, historically, more conducive to winning; and I believe that's absolutely true. That doesn't mean I'm insulting Saquon Barkley, but rather just taking an honest, in-depth look at who each of them are as players.

Because of those explosive plays, which fans love and are very exciting to watch, there are a lot of people naming Saquon Barkley as the best runner in the NFL. However, I don't believe that's true based on my analysis of their respective games. Presently, the vast majority of the time, there is no rushing force in the league that is the equal to Ezekiel Elliott. He's in a class of his own when it comes to 4-quarters of dominance.

Could that change in the future?

Sure.
But dating all the way back through their college years, it hasn't ever been the case thus far.


Subtracting the rare explosive plays from each back (people still act like I only took Saquon's away) was merely a method of isolating their average plays more clearly, statistically, so that we could hone in on the broader result of their performances.

This just shouldn't be an offensive or controversial thing.

Let me ask you this again.

Do you honestly believe Zeke would have the same “grinding” and overall success he had last year if he played behind the Giants O line and do you think Barkley would have had a less misleading ypc average (ie more yards per carry) if he played behind our O line last year?

Third question, same question using the same reversed roles but Barkley behind the 2016 Cowboys O line and Zeke behind the 2018 Giants O line (both their rookie O lines).

 

[iceberg]

I'm not sure why people struggle with this concept; it's not hard.

My premise was specifically to illustrate, empirically, that Barkley is a back who lives or dies off the big-play, but is not nearly as productive or consistent or effective on the far broader number of his carries. My analysis does exactly that; and there's nothing unfair about it.

I fully admit, several times, that Barkley is the "more explosive" player, but also conclude that he is behind Elliott when it comes to down-by-down dominance. Across the MUCH larger percentage of their carries, Zeke is the more dominant force --even as Saquon is the more dominant force at producing "explosive" plays.

I also offer the analysis that Ezekiel's style is, historically, more conducive to winning; and I believe that's absolutely true. That doesn't mean I'm insulting Saquon Barkley, but rather just taking an honest, in-depth look at who each of them are as players.

Because of those explosive plays, which fans love and are very exciting to watch, there are a lot of people naming Saquon Barkley as the best runner in the NFL. However, I don't believe that's true based on my analysis of their respective games. Presently, the vast majority of the time, there is no rushing force in the league that is the equal to Ezekiel Elliott. He's in a class of his own when it comes to 4-quarters of dominance.

Could that change in the future?

Sure.
But dating all the way back through their college years, it hasn't ever been the case thus far.


Subtracting the rare explosive plays from each back (people still act like I only took Saquon's away) was merely a method of isolating their average plays more clearly, statistically, so that we could hone in on the broader result of their performances.

This just shouldn't be an offensive or controversial thing.

it's not controversial at all.

you take away a players strength, they're not as good as they were with it.

very simple.

 

[PoetTree]

Let me ask you this again.

Do you honestly believe Zeke would have the same “grinding” and overall success he had last year if he played behind the Giants O line and do you think Barkley would have had a less misleading ypc average (ie more yards per carry) if he played behind our O line last year?

Honest answer:

I think the fortunes of our respective teams would have been completely different, as Zeke's style of running is MUCH more conducive to winning football games than Saquon's freelancing style. Ask the Detroit Lions how that works. I've posted quotes from both Barry Sanders & Saquon's coaches explaining it.

I believe the Giants would have been a better team with Ezekiel Elliott.

He's a better NFL running back, at least at this point, than Saquon Barkley; in fact, I think he's the very best in the league. Just as Emmitt played a far bigger role in the Cowboys' success than Barry ever did for the Lions, which I do think came down largely to style, Zeke's style contributes to winning more than Barkley's does at this time.

I think the Dallas Cowboys would have been a worse team in 2018 with Saquon Barkley, and I think his & Zeke's stats wouldn't have been dynamically different than they were. Elliott's may have been even better, given the way teams play Eli with a lot more respect than they do Dak at this point. Couple that with the fact that New York had Odell Beckham from day-1 & I think Zeke would have been in a superior position to succeed.

I don't think you fully understand how badly the deck was stacked against him in Dallas last year, and as such, you don't fully appreciate the dominant performance he put in.

Third question, same question using the same reversed roles but Barkley behind the 2016 Cowboys O line and Zeke behind the 2018 Giants O line (both their rookie O lines).

I think Barkley would have been more productive than he was this year, but his problems sticking his head into the hole and plowing for yards would not magically disappear because his blocking was better. This has been a trend of his throughout his adult football life.

As you fail to do for last season, I think you underestimate the impressive feats Elliott achieved in his rookie season. The dude put up 1,631 yards in only 14-and-a-half games, being sat down at halftime of the next-to-last game of the season (after reeling off a 55-yard TD), and then benched for the finale against the Eagles to protect his health for the playoffs.

Zeke was averaging 108.7 yards-per-game, which is second in pace to only Eric Dickerson's record-setting rookie campaign. If he had been in a position for him to play that last 1.5 games, he was on pace to finish with 1,794-yards --which would have put him closely in position to break Dickerson's rookie rushing record of 1,808-yards.

Saquon averaged barely over 81.7 yards-per-game in 2018, a difference of 27 yards-per-game. That is an ASTONISHING disparity, mon ami, that is attributable to far more than the o-line. What Zeke did in 2016 was nothing less than historic. It's a shame Jason Garrett robbed him of the possibility of cementing it as the greatest rushing season by a rookie in history, not to mention robbed the team of all its momentum going into the playoffs. But I digress...

I agree that Saquon would have put up 'better' rushing numbers behind Dallas' 2016 o-line, but nothing in his past or present suggests he would have produced to such historic degrees on the ground. He has some vision and style issues to correct before he's on the same level as Zeke as a pure runner.


You wanted it. You got it.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

it's not controversial at all.

you take away a players strength, they're not as good as they were with it.

very simple.

Not only does the Poetree Troll’s method remove all of a runner’s good runs, they don’t even get credit for the good run in the first place. Under his brain dead methods, they would have been better falling down after 20 yards. Then it would have “counted”. This is what happens when high schools cut the math budget.

 

[iceberg]

Honest answer:

I think the fortunes of our respective teams would have been completely different, as Zeke's style of running is MUCH more conducive to winning football games than Saquon's freelancing style. Ask the Detroit Lions how that works. I've posted quotes from both Barry Sanders & Saquon's coaches explaining it.

I believe the Giants would have been a better team with Ezekiel Elliott.

He's a better NFL running back, at least at this point, than Saquon Barkley; in fact, I think he's the very best in the league. Just as Emmitt played a far bigger role in the Cowboys' success than Barry ever did for the Lions, which I do think came down largely to style, Zeke's style contributes to winning more than Barkley's does at this time.

I think the Dallas Cowboys would have been a worse team in 2018 with Saquon Barkley, and I think his & Zeke's stats wouldn't have been dynamically different than they were. Elliott's may have been even better, given the way teams play Eli with a lot more respect than they do Dak at this point. Couple that with the fact that New York had Odell Beckham from day-1 & I think Zeke would have been in a superior position to succeed.

I don't think you fully understand how badly the deck was stacked against him in Dallas last year, and as such, you don't fully appreciate the dominant performance he put in.




I think Barkley would have been more productive than he was this year, but his problems sticking his head into the hole and plowing for yards would not magically disappear because his blocking was better. This has been a trend of his throughout his adult football life.

As you fail to do for last season, I think you underestimate the impressive feats Elliott achieved in his rookie season. The dude put up 1,631 yards in only 14-and-a-half games, being sat down at halftime of the next-to-last game of the season (after reeling off a 55-yard TD), and then benched for the finale against the Eagles to protect his health for the playoffs.

Zeke was averaging 108.7 yards-per-game, which is second in pace to only Eric Dickerson's record-setting rookie campaign. If he had been in a position for him to play that last 1.5 games, he was on pace to finish with 1,794-yards --which would have put him closely in position to break Dickerson's rookie rushing record of 1,808-yards.

Saquon averaged barely over 81.7 yards-per-game in 2018, a difference of 27 yards-per-game. That is an ASTONISHING disparity, mon ami, that is attributable to far more than the o-line. What Zeke did in 2016 was nothing less than historic. It's a shame Jason Garrett robbed him of the possibility of cementing it as the greatest rushing season by a rookie in history, not to mention robbed the team of all its momentum going into the playoffs. But I digress...

I agree that Saquon would have put up 'better' rushing numbers behind Dallas' 2016 o-line, but nothing in his past or present suggests he would have produced to such historic degrees on the ground. He has some vision and style issues to correct before he's on the same level as Zeke as a pure runner.


You wanted it. You got it.

K

 

[aria]

Honest answer:

I think the fortunes of our respective teams would have been completely different, as Zeke's style of running is MUCH more conducive to winning football games than Saquon's freelancing style. Ask the Detroit Lions how that works. I've posted quotes from both Barry Sanders & Saquon's coaches explaining it.

I believe the Giants would have been a better team with Ezekiel Elliott.

He's a better NFL running back, at least at this point, than Saquon Barkley; in fact, I think he's the very best in the league. Just as Emmitt played a far bigger role in the Cowboys' success than Barry ever did for the Lions, which I do think came down largely to style, Zeke's style contributes to winning more than Barkley's does at this time.

I think the Dallas Cowboys would have been a worse team in 2018 with Saquon Barkley, and I think his & Zeke's stats wouldn't have been dynamically different than they were. Elliott's may have been even better, given the way teams play Eli with a lot more respect than they do Dak at this point. Couple that with the fact that New York had Odell Beckham from day-1 & I think Zeke would have been in a superior position to succeed.

I don't think you fully understand how badly the deck was stacked against him in Dallas last year, and as such, you don't fully appreciate the dominant performance he put in.




I think Barkley would have been more productive than he was this year, but his problems sticking his head into the hole and plowing for yards would not magically disappear because his blocking was better. This has been a trend of his throughout his adult football life.

As you fail to do for last season, I think you underestimate the impressive feats Elliott achieved in his rookie season. The dude put up 1,631 yards in only 14-and-a-half games, being sat down at halftime of the next-to-last game of the season (after reeling off a 55-yard TD), and then benched for the finale against the Eagles to protect his health for the playoffs.

Zeke was averaging 108.7 yards-per-game, which is second in pace to only Eric Dickerson's record-setting rookie campaign. If he had been in a position for him to play that last 1.5 games, he was on pace to finish with 1,794-yards --which would have put him closely in position to break Dickerson's rookie rushing record of 1,808-yards.

Saquon averaged barely over 81.7 yards-per-game in 2018, a difference of 27 yards-per-game. That is an ASTONISHING disparity, mon ami, that is attributable to far more than the o-line. What Zeke did in 2016 was nothing less than historic. It's a shame Jason Garrett robbed him of the possibility of cementing it as the greatest rushing season by a rookie in history, not to mention robbed the team of all its momentum going into the playoffs. But I digress...

I agree that Saquon would have put up 'better' rushing numbers behind Dallas' 2016 o-line, but nothing in his past or present suggests he would have produced to such historic degrees on the ground. He has some vision and style issues to correct before he's on the same level as Zeke as a pure runner.


You wanted it. You got it.

Blown away by your response, mind boggling, and as much I think you’re way off I appreciate the answer.

 

[Cowboysheelsreds053]

If you cant understand the importance of how good Zeke is at grinding yards, there isn't much we can do to help you..nobody in the league gets dirty yards like Zeke

Bingo, but people love the junks moves better for some reasons. I just want a back to keep moving the chains all the way into the end zone. Don't care how many Fred Aistair moves he makes.

 

[kskboys]

Not when you take both players biggest plays to illustrate the Elliott is a workhorse and grinds. It's nothing against Barkley really. To not understand that is stupid.

I was thinking more like deliberately obtuse. This is not that difficult of a concept.