Some quick post-combine thoughts!

[Hawkeye0202]

You trading down and getting one most likely. And the guys you would get like Grant, T. Williams and Green come with alot of questions.

This is interesting coz as mentioned before .......final four playoff teams draft these kinds of players all the time we wonder how/why they fell so far.

 

[beware_d-ware]

If Graham was stonewalling Ohio State's linemen while playing at 295 lbs, then he can keep playing at 295 lbs for me.

One name that hasn't been mentioned... Malaki Starks. I didn't really like him as a prospect, and he didn't do anything to help himself in testing. And after all the missed tackles he had this season, I wouldn't particularly trust him as my deep safety either. I think he's a nickel only, and I'm all the way out on him in the top 20.

 

[darthseinfeld]

This is interesting coz as mentioned before .......final four playoff teams draft these kinds of players all the time we wonder how/why they fell so far.

When I say questions, I mean they arent complete players. So you arent getting as strong a prospect

The only real question mark the top 4 playoff teams took was Carter. And its not like he fell much 9th. You might be able to put Nolan Smith there eventually

 

[cnuball21]

-Matthew Golden is my new #1 WR. 6 feet and 4.3 with SEC production. Cowboys have shown interest as well.
-Pierce is clearly the #2 Edge now in this class, Green's stock has taken a hit with those sexual assault allegations.
-Graham not testing, short arms and 25lbs lighter has him falling, but how far? Nolen's character issues could do the same.
-Harmon to me is the best DT that has emerged post combine. Strong testing and physical attributes.
-Will Johnson's stock took a hit with his lack of length, speed was already an issue.
-Hampton will not get out of the 1st rd, but Judkins might now be the back to target over Johnson from Iowa. Giddens the former KState back also had a good 40 time that makes him a late day 2 target.
-I maybe in the minority but Campbell the linebacker scares me to death with his lack of instincts. Schwesinger is my target.
-Emmamori is going to be a 1st rd pick now after that elite testing

-I really believe those prospects who refused to test with hurt their stock. Teams want competitive players not ones scared to compete under same conditions.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Tet, Burden, Golden or Egbuka turned out as the best WR from this class as they’re all pretty close. Tet not running is a little worrisome but I’d probably still have him and Burden as my top 2.

I’ve read Pearce might have off the field issues as well. Uncoachable popped up so interested to see how that plays out.

Graham, Johnson and Barron were all somewhat combine losers due to the size / length. We traditionally draft CBs with 32+ inch arms so wonder if we’ll be interested in Johnson / Barron?

The RB class is as advertised. Jeanty at 12 would be insanity to me seeing as how loaded this class it. And if we’re running an outside zone scheme Johnson’s 40 doesn’t bother me as he has elite vision and still has great burst.

 

[cnuball21]

Interestingly, Golden's top speed at 23.57 which was 7th best but he had the best 10 yd split at 1.49 seconds. Isaiah Bond ran a 4.39 but had the 2nd best top speed at 24.17. His 10 yd time was 1.51. It seems like bond has a higher top speed but a slower get off, while Golden hits his top speed quicker. If I was looking for a WR to stretch the field, I would choose Bond over Golden. Perhaps Golden would make a better slot guy running intermediate routes.

This definitely shows up on tape…I’d consider Bond more of a speed guy than Golden.

 

[gtb1943]

Something we have to keep in mind as I have heard many times over the years, is that these combine workouts are just are just a piece of the big picture or puzzle. We have players every year who blow up the Combine with certain measurements, speed, or strength but can't translate on the field. Few years ago, Jordan Davis blew it up by running a sub 4.5 over 335lbs. Today he a good run defender but offers little or nothing to pass rush. In fact, there are nuggets suggesting the Eagles may refuse his 5th year option. Carter, his teammate, took a hit coz of character concerns but is now the most dominant DT in the league.

My point is there are there still a lot of evaluation pieces to consider besides the combines.

anyone that moves a player significantly up or down due to the underwear olympics measurements is a fool

 

[Hawkeye0202]

When I say questions, I mean they arent complete players. So you arent getting as strong a prospect

The only real question mark the top 4 playoff teams took was Carter. And its not like he fell much 9th. You might be able to put Nolan Smith there eventually

Noticed I said final four ( not top four ) mean teams drafting at the bottom of the last 4-5 picks. These team get good players all the time.....sure the players fall out or are not graded as top 20-25 players but they are still solid picks, otherwise they wouldn't be 1st rounders. Here's an example of what I'm saying.......... we have soo many holes. So, unless a true blue chipper falls to us at 12, we aren't getting much more a talented player from 12-13 to 20-25 coz we have many positional needs. ( RB, RG, LBer, WR, CB, DT, ). Pretty sure we can find a day-one starter at one of these positions at 25 just as we can at 12. The difference is at 25, we picked up extra 2nd and 3rd-round picks.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Noticed I said final four ( not top four ) mean teams drafting at the bottom of the last 4-5 picks. These team get good players all the time.....sure the players fall out or are not graded as top 20-25 players but they are still solid picks, otherwise they wouldn't be 1st rounders. Here's an example of what I'm saying.......... we have soo many holes. So, unless a true blue chipper falls to us at 12, we aren't getting much more a talented player from 12-13 to 20-25 coz we have many positional needs. ( RB, RG, LBer, WR, CB, DT, ). Pretty sure we can find a day-one starter at one of these positions at 25 just as we can at 12. The difference is at 25, we picked up extra 2nd and 3rd-round picks.

All Im saying is if you want a difference maker on the front 4, your best option is to just take one at 12 and not get cute. If you want to focus on skill players, your best bet is probably to trade down.

People get to wrapped up in trading down. Its not that it's a bad idea, but fans dont recognize that it's comes at a a cost as well. You are taking a lesser prospect with your top pick. Last year's trade down is actually a great example of both the benefit and risk of trading down. The benefit is Beebe. The risk is that taking Guyton at 28 will burn us if he doesnt pan out. We lost out in Xavier Worthy moving down. Its more of a risk/reward proposition than fans acknowledge.

Personally, Im not trading down in this draft. I want premium front 4 talent, and I getting cute hoping a Tyleik Williams is able to become a 3 down player. But thats just me

 

[Hawkeye0202]

. The benefit is Beebe. The risk is that taking Guyton at 28 will burn us if he doesnt pan out. We lost out in Xavier Worthy moving down. Its more of a risk/reward proposition than fans acknowledge.

This is true but the talent OTHER positions was there. That's my point ...take the BPA at positional need. But I get what you are saying, the higher you draft the better chance of getting a better player. I guess it depends on particular team needs and draft position.

 

[Cowboyny]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Tet, Burden, Golden or Egbuka turned out as the best WR from this class as they’re all pretty close. Tet not running is a little worrisome but I’d probably still have him and Burden as my top 2.

I’ve read Pearce might have off the field issues as well. Uncoachable popped up so interested to see how that plays out.

Graham, Johnson and Barron were all somewhat combine losers due to the size / length. We traditionally draft CBs with 32+ inch arms so wonder if we’ll be interested in Johnson / Barron?

The RB class is as advertised. Jeanty at 12 would be insanity to me seeing as how loaded this class it. And if we’re running an outside zone scheme Johnson’s 40 doesn’t bother me as he has elite vision and still has great burst.

-I'm ok with all the top 4 receivers. T-Mac isn't expected to run fast, but still would of liked him to test.
-Yes, heard that about Pierce, but Green has legitimate off the field stuff that gets you suspended.
-Believe Barron for us would be nickel only, think Johnson will not be considered due to lack of length.
-I still am very high on Johnson, but believe Judkins belongs in that 2nd tier after Jeanty.

 

[Creeper]

Here's the type of strategy speaking about earlier........not sure these would be my selections but having extra 2nd and 3rd rounders and still getting a good player at 25.

Something like that , yes, but I don't think some of those players will drop as low as this draft has them.

 

[darthseinfeld]

This is true but the talent OTHER positions was there. That's my point ...take the BPA at positional need. But I get what you are saying, the higher you draft the better chance of getting a better player. I guess it depends on particular team needs and draft position.

I agree, thats where Im getting the position of "depends on what they are attempting to upgrade " from

If they want to beef up the skill positions (and they need to) I think trading down is their best course of action. 12 is a bit rich to take a #2 WR. Moving down into the early 20's still lands you a guy that can come in and perform

Front 4? Not so much. You are looking at guys like Grant, Tyleik Williams or Mike Green. All of whom I like as players but come with at least initial limitations. Williams and Grant need alot of work before they are 3 down players and Green you have to figure out if he can play the run.

Its just comes down to what want them to prioritize. My position is investing in the front 4 is the best long term option if you want to build an actual contender and not a McCarthy level paper tiger

 

[Cowboyny]

Nolan not testing is interesting. After a very strong Senior Bowl week he had the chance to move into the top 10 of this draft with a strong combine. Im not really out on him, but I like Harmon more now. Harmon has the tape and production to back up his measurables

Grahams length more than his weight give me some pause, but he is a player. I don't think it hurts him much. Didnt hurt Kancy in 2023 when his arms measured 30"

-I can understand Graham not wanting to hurt his stock, but there is no reason why Nolen shouldn't of tested. Unless he was injured, it's a red flag for me as he was worried it would hurt his stock.

-I don't think Graham is a slam dunk top 10 pick as I did prior to the combine. His tape is terrific, but his physical traits are average, which is going to hurt his stock.

-Harmon wasn't afraid to test and tested well with strong production. He has the least amount of warts at the position, in my opinion.

 

[darthseinfeld]

-I'm ok with all the top 4 receivers. T-Mac isn't expected to run fast, but still would of liked him to test.
-Yes, heard that about Pierce, but Green has legitimate off the field stuff that gets you suspended.
-Believe Barron for us would be nickel only, think Johnson will not be considered due to lack of length.
-I still am very high on Johnson, but believe Judkins belongs in that 2nd tier after Jeanty.

I think Judkins is a very strong possibility at 44

 

[Cowboyny]

Golden haa separated himself from Tet McMillan I think. He's 1A then Tet is 1B.

Dak has always worked better with strong route runners and did have his struggles with an older Dez at the position. You would think T-Mac will struggle in getting separation, which may make him a bad fit with our QB. I also would like to see what Ebuk runs at his pro day.

 

[darthseinfeld]

-I can understand Graham not wanting to hurt his stock, but there is no reason why Nolen shouldn't of tested. Unless he was injured, it's a red flag for me as he was worried it would hurt his stock.

-I don't think Graham is a slam dunk top 10 pick as I did prior to the combine. His tape is terrific, but his physical traits are average, which is going to hurt his stock.

-Harmon wasn't afraid to test and tested well with strong production. He has the least amount of warts at the position, in my opinion.

Its not uncommon anymore for agents to tell prospects to wait for the Pro Days to workout. I personally dont like it, because he we get juiced info. However in the age of GPS tracking, I dont know how relevant the combine drills are to teams anymore. I dont think not participating is going to hurt either that much

 

[beware_d-ware]

I think Judkins might be a top 3 back now, even in this loaded class. We all knew that he was big and powerful, then he showed us that he has low 4.4 breakaway speed and elite burst.

I had compared Judkins to David Montgomery, but Judkins has 4.43 speed vs Montgomery's 4.63, so he ran himself straight out of that prospect comp. I'd re-adjust his comp now to DeMarco Murray. Murray had tight hips, but he played with such a great size/speed/power combo that it didn't really matter.

 

[Cowboyny]

If Graham was stonewalling Ohio State's linemen while playing at 295 lbs, then he can keep playing at 295 lbs for me.

One name that hasn't been mentioned... Malaki Starks. I didn't really like him as a prospect, and he didn't do anything to help himself in testing. And after all the missed tackles he had this season, I wouldn't particularly trust him as my deep safety either. I think he's a nickel only, and I'm all the way out on him in the top 20.

I think the South Carolina Safety might go ahead of him.

 

[Cowboyny]

I think Judkins might be a top 3 back now, even in this loaded class. We all knew that he was big and powerful, then he showed us that he has low 4.4 breakaway speed and elite burst.

I had compared Judkins to David Montgomery, but Judkins has 4.43 speed vs Montgomery's 4.63, so he ran himself straight out of that prospect comp. I'd re-adjust his comp now to DeMarco Murray. Murray had tight hips, but he played with such a great size/speed/power combo that it didn't really matter.

Always have felt Hampton reminded me of Murray, but I see your point.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Dak has always worked better with strong route runners and did have his struggles with an older Dez at the position. You would think T-Mac will struggle in getting separation, which may make him a bad fit with our QB. I also would like to see what Ebuk runs at his pro day.

This kid has a huge catch radius ......remember Dak likes throwing to a spot and expecting his receivers to be there. This kid reminds me of Lamb a bit.....