Spygate -- Boston Globe Now Attacking Walsh's Character...

[theogt]

We need an icon for threads about Goodell. Perhaps a paper shredder.

 

[alancdc]

I am praying that he has some solid proof that the PATRIOTS did more than what has been reported. FAct is, they won every SB that they played in by a FG. Please please show some tape of these walk throughs.

 

[superpunk]

We need an icon for threads about Goodell. Perhaps a paper shredder.

Hitler.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I also love the idea that it's somehow wrong for Walsh to tape his conversation with Pioli (which is completely legal), yet Pioli can dig through Walsh's personal property and retrieve the tape without his permission (which is illegal).

If it was at Walsh's desk on the Patriots grounds it's completely legal since the Patriots actually own that desk.

And while taping the conversation is legal, it's legal for the Pats to fire him based upon that.

My thing is that the Patriots have been caught lying on just about everything to this point, so I find it hard for me to believe Pioli at this point. He could be telling the truth, but he's got a bad track record so far.




YAKUZA

 

[theogt]

If it was at Walsh's desk on the Patriots grounds it's completely legal since the Patriots actually own that desk.

And while taping the conversation is legal, it's legal for the Pats to fire him based upon that.

My thing is that the Patriots have been caught lying on just about everything to this point, so I find it hard for me to believe Pioli at this point. He could be telling the truth, but he's got a bad track record so far.




YAKUZA

Taking someone's personal property without their permission is theft. It doesn't matter if it is in his desk, on top of his desk, or laying on the floor. It doesn't matter who owns the desk.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Thats exactly right, I have a TON of friends that are in the PGA Program and I am also about to get in it. There are 3 levels that you have to pass. And in order for them to pass, most people, pretty much all people have to fly to Florida to take the tests. That would get a little expensive for Mr. Walsh to fly back and forth from Hawaii to Florida.

Not only that, but if Walsh just wants to work on a course as an Assistant Pro he doesn't have to be on his way to be accredited by the PGA. And because it's extremely hard to find a head pro position at a golf club, that's why a lot of assistant pros don't even bother with completing the courses. Especially for a guy like Walsh who is probably doing just fine with his wife working as a physical therapist. For the Globe to try and point this out like it goes against Walsh's character is sort of like a newpaper trying to point out that a person quit trying to get their Masters Degree as a sign of the person having a sketchy character.

Sounds like the reporter is a Patriots fanboy.




YAKUZA

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Taking someone's personal property without their permission is theft. It doesn't matter if it is in his desk, on top of his desk, or laying on the floor. It doesn't matter who owns the desk.

The Pats could say that the tape actually belonged to them and it's on their property.

I know it matters in Georgia, I had a friend that I worked with that had a similar situation and he tried to sue the company but the court basically told him that the property was the company's, not his.





YAKUZA

 

[tyke1doe]

It doesn't matter if he's bitter or not, if Walsh has evidence showing the Patriots cheated...particularly with taping walkthroughs...then they cheated.

That's all that really matters.


YAKUZA

B-I-N-G-O (2 more times)

And B-I-N-G-O was his NAME-O.

Let's not get distracted here.

The issue is whether the tapes show that the Pats were filming the Rams before the Super Bowl, despite the Pats protestations to the contrary. It's not whether Walsh was a good employee or not. He might have been a bad employee, but if he has the goods on the Pats, that trumps his reputation among colleagues.

 

[tyke1doe]

I also love the idea that it's somehow wrong for Walsh to tape his conversation with Pioli (which is completely legal), yet Pioli can dig through Walsh's personal property and retrieve the tape without his permission (which is illegal).

So you're saying that searching a person's personal property even though the tape involves league matters is illegal?

Seriously though, does Massachusett have a law that states both parties must have knowledge of a recorded conversation?

I ask because not all states do. Some states only require that one party (the recorder) know.

 

[BotchedLobotomy]

I like how they start out portraying him as this bitter and vindictive ex-employee that set out to destroy the Patriots.....then they go on to say that he was minding his own business in Hawaii without a care in the world and then he was contacted by the media about spygate which in turn started this whole mess. Doesn't jive.

 

[David276]

lol like the globe wasnt paid off by the nfl or kraft. that guy just needs to hurry up and give the tapes to that senator put godell in his place and kraft.

 

[zeromaster]

IMO, the Super Bowl taping goes to the core of the NFL's fear, and could shed some light on the speed with which the commish moved originally. Suppose something as celebrated as the NFL championship gets perceived as tainted, imagine the damage to the league that could result. If the football public starts to get the perception that games might be decided by something other than what happens on the field...

The horror.

Then again, maybe they're only the quality of the Zapruder film. But I love seeing the Pats squirm.

 

[peplaw06]

So you're saying that searching a person's personal property even though the tape involves league matters is illegal?

Nice try...

If Walsh created the tape, then it's his personal property... i.e. if he recorded a conversation with Pioli.

But if it was one of the Pats tapes, and Walsh took it, then the Pats took it back, even if it was in with his personal property, that's not illegal.

Tyke, if you're so adamant that it's illegal for an employer to search through an employee's personal property, name the crime.

 

[Redball Express]

This rebuttale about not having any power to have used the setup cameras is a complete idiocy defense.

I am a professional videographer and photographer for over 20 years.

You have backups for backup for backups.

There is no such thing in the professional ranks as having all your cameras and all your battery packs disabled.

Never.

You'd be fired.

You can't afford it.

Suppose somebody in the organization wanted you to quickly tape an inpromptu interview for the owner..if you said, sorry, we don't have anything available right now.

..you'd be history.

And even if the main cameras are setup on tripods and power was not connected, I guarrantee there are several cases close by that have portable power that can be subbed until the main cameras could be re-fired.

That's your job.Be ready.

Redundance built on redundancy.

This defense is factcious.

And that the Patriots investigated themselves and that the Globe conducted their own investigation..? And the NFL investigated it themselves, too..?

That's like asking the Senate to investigate themselves. Or Enron to investigate themselves.

Or Dick Nixon to investigate the Watergate breakin and advise us what turns up.

Ludicrous.

There is smoke and there is fire here.

If this were a dance musical..Robert Preston would jump out from behind the corner store on Main Street and declare..ala The Music Man..

"Trouble..oh friends we've got Trouble, with a capital "T" and that rhythms with "P" and that stand for "Pool"..err.."Patroits"..

yes let me tell you my friends..

why the time I spent as lad with a video camera in my hands was Golden..developed a keen eye, a sense of composition and a flair for the papparazzia..yes sir..we've got trouble."

Da Da da da Da da Da..76 video cameras lead SB Media Day, while a 110 microphones came right behind..etc"

:starspinReDBaLL ExPreSS:starspin

 

[CaptainAmerica]

This rebuttale about not having any power to have used the setup cameras is a complete idiocy defense.

I am a professional videographer and photographer for over 20 years.

You have backups for backup for backups.

There is no such thing in the professional ranks as having all your cameras and all your battery packs disabled.

Never.

You'd be fired.

You can't afford it.

Suppose somebody in the organization wanted you to quickly tape an inpromptu interview for the owner..if you said, sorry, we don't have anything available right now.

..you'd be history.

And even if the main cameras are setup on tripods and power was not connected, I guarrantee there are several cases close by that have portable power that can be subbed until the main cameras could be re-fired.

That's your job.

Redundance built on redundancy.

This defense is factcious.

And that the Patriots investigated themselves and that the Globe conducted their own investigation..? And the NFL investigated it themselves, too..?

That's like asking the Senate to investigate themselves. Or Enron to investigate themselves.

Or Dick Nixon to investigate the Watergate breakin and advise us what turns up.

Ludicrous.

There is smoke and there is fire here.

If this were a dance musical..Robert Preston would jump out from behind a the corner store on Main Street and declare..

"Trouble..oh friends we've got Trouble, with a capital "T" and that rhythms with "P" and that stand for "Pool"..err.."Patroits"..yes let me tell you my friends..why the time I spent as lad with a video camera in my hands was Golden..developed a keen eye, a sense of composition and a flair for the the papparazzia..yes sure.."

Da Da da da Da da Da..76 video cameras lead the Interview Tuesday of SB Week, etc"


:starspinReDBaLL ExPreSS:starspin

Interesting take from someone in the business.

Your comments reminded me of the guy who wrote Peter King and wanted to remain anonymous. He is in the business working for a team and he said, if it was taped, there is no way it was done without instructions from the top. He said the job requires way too much work and you have so much to do that no one decides on their own to tape something they aren't asked to tape. He said they just have to much work to do to waste time doing something they aren't ordered to do. It was a very interesting read and even made Peter King admit it gave him a completely different perspective about the job.

 

[Redball Express]

Interesting take from someone in the business.

Your comments reminded me of the guy who wrote Peter King and wanted to remain anonymous. He is in the business working for a team and he said, if it was taped, there is no way it was done without instructions from the top. He said the job requires way too much work and you have so much to do that no one decides on their own to tape something they aren't asked to tape. He said they just have to much work to do to waste time doing something they aren't ordered to do. It was a very interesting read and even made Peter King admit it gave him a completely different perspective about the job.

..you are generally working from a shotlist or script of what is to be shot and there usually isn't any deviating from that or freelancing unless it's ordered.

If you are working inhouse like these guys would have been doing, you are going to carry out your assignments and review that and immediately start editing for usage if the coaches want it or the front office will call for it.

You will not have a bunch of open time and you are under a lot of pressure to get it all done. So really, if it got shot, the chances are highly likely, it was ordered to be shot by somebody with authority to commit a person or crew to the task.

Is it possible also to have shot a backup with a small camera of high quality..? Sure. 2002 had Mini-DVD by that time and football teams would have had it. So you could have shot this with a camera hidden in your hand and nobody would have even noticed what you were doing.

It wouldn't require a big ENG studio unit on tripod or even something portable like NFL Films uses on the field.

This sort of naivity by the NFL and the Patriots in trying to explain the subposed circumstances about why it couldn't possibly happen is insulting to ones common sense.

I'm just thinking this whole thing is going to mushroom.

And I think it definitely had it's affect on how the Patriots played in that SB.

They were distracted and not their focused selves against the Jints. I think something surfaced about all this during Super Bowl Week and the players may have gotten wind of it and it was a problem.

We'll see.

:starspinReDBaLL ExPreSS:starspin

 

[Boysboy]

..you are generally working from a shotlist or script of what is to be shot and there usually isn't any deviating from that or freelancing unless it's ordered.

If you are working inhouse like these guys would have been doing, you are going to carry out your assignments and review that and immediately start editing for usage if the coaches want it or the front office will call for it.

You will not have a bunch of open time and you are under a lot of pressure to get it all done. So really, if it got shot, the chances are highly likely, it was ordered to be shot by somebody with authority to commit a person or crew to the task.

Is it possible also to have shot a backup with a small camera of high quality..? Sure. 2002 had Mini-DVD by that time and football teams would have had it. So you could have shot this with a camera hidden in your hand and nobody would have even noticed what you were doing.

It wouldn't require a big ENG studio unit on tripod or even something portable like NFL Films uses on the field.

This sort of naivity by the NFL and the Patriots in trying to explain the subposed circumstances about why it couldn't possibly happen is insulting to ones common sense.

I'm just thinking this whole thing is going to mushroom.

And I think it definitely had it's affect on how the Patriots played in that SB.

They were distracted and not their focused selves against the Jints. I think something surfaced about all this during Super Bowl Week and the players may have gotten wind of it and it was a problem.

We'll see.

:starspinReDBaLL ExPreSS:starspin

I got that impression too-there were reports that the Pats' practices were aweful the week before. And the players not only looked tight before/during the game, but they just didn't have any kind of fire or emotion(Rodney Harrison, in particular, looked like he had red eye).

Oh-cheating or no, this Pats team nonetheless had alot of glaring weaknesses(to be fair to those other Pats' teams, they had far fewer)...

1. Ellis Hobbs is WORSE than Jacques Reeves.

2. Their LBs are old and almost washed up.

3. Rodney Harrison is way past his prime.

4. Asante Samuels finally got exposed for what he is-now I can't wait to see how well TO(and for that matter, even Plax and Santana Moss) match up against him.

5. The Pats' OL is only mediocre, at best.

6. Laurence Malroney ain't no Corey Dillon-he looked more like Julius Jones, at best.

7. Josh McDaniels is a HORRIBLE playcaller(Charlie Weis would have called screens to death against those non-stop Giant blitzes).

8. Dean Pees(their DC) is nothing more than a gopher boy.

As you can see-even if they STILL can cheat, this squad is too mediocre even with this help.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

It doesn't matter if he's bitter or not, if Walsh has evidence showing the Patriots cheated...particularly with taping walkthroughs...then they cheated.

That's all that really matters.
YAKUZA

I am a little torn. I dont know if I should be happy that the Pats probably cheated the Eagles out of a their 1st SB win?

 

[Boysboy]

I am a little torn. I dont know if I should be happy that the Pats probably cheated the Eagles out of a their 1st SB win?

Bah-IF the Pats hadn't cheated, either of these things would have happened...

1. The Steelers would have TWO for the other thumb.(They were like 15-1 in those 2 seasons they lost to the Pats in the AFCCG)

2. Peyton would have as many THREE rings by now(they would have whipped Carolina in '03 if they had made it. And for that matter, Philly in '04).

IOW-no way the Rams and Eagles win in '01 and '04, respectively.

 

[burmafrd]

Actually the rams probably would have won otherwise in 2001. BUT the eagles would have gone down for sure. McFlabb would have still puked.