Steelers/Vikings D vs Cowboys Defense - Whats the difference?

[Hostile]

I wasn't talking about the pace and tempo of the team, I was specifically talking about our defense. Why does the offense get to dictate the pace/tempo of the defense?

I think they should work in concert with one another.

They try to, but that doesn't mean it will work every game. Nothing is foolproof. You cannot design an Offensive or Defensive scheme that cannot be successfully stopped and conversely you cannot design an unstoppable Offense or Defense.

Why is the 46 Defense no longer in vogue? Because teams figured out that by using multiple WR sets it took away the advantage that the 46 gave the Defense. Buddy Ryan was so married to his scheme that he took it to Arizona, got some of his best players from the Eagles and had a horrible Defense.

They had incredible pace and tempo but they couldn't accomplish anything.

We do not have the same personnel as the Vikings or Steelers. We don't have a the luxury of a Jared Allen lined up on the same side as Kevin Williams. Instead we have a DeMarcus Ware opposite a Greg Ellis.

 

[juck]

Its pretty simple.Lebeau is the MAN!!!His blitzes are so unique sometimes every single guy is standing up at the line and the Oline doesnt know who is coming at all.Lebeau knows how to pick and get the most out of LBs.Lets think about this Pittsburgh always has great LBs until they leave.Kirkland,Greg lloyd,Kevin greene,Chad brown,Joey Porter,etc...they are unheard of after leaving Lebeau.Wades father may have invented it but wade isnt a better Defensive coach than Lebaeu no way even close.The Steelers weakness which will be their downfall is their Oline,it sucks ,they lost a lot, and Ben has no time.

 

[Hostile]

Its pretty simple.Lebeau is the MAN!!!His blitzes are so unique sometimes every single guy is standing up at the line and the Oline doesnt know who is coming at all.Lebeau knows how to pick and get the most out of LBs.Lets think about this Pittsburgh always has great LBs until they leave.Kirkland,Greg lloyd,Kevin greene,Chad brown,Joey Porter,etc...they are unheard of after leaving Lebeau.Wades father may have invented it but wade isnt a better Defensive coach than Lebaeu no way even close.The Steelers weakness which will be their downfall is their Oline,it sucks ,they lost a lot, and Ben has no time.

He's the man?

Correct me if I am wrong but the Steelers lost 4 of their last 5 games including the playoff loss to Jacksonville and the fewest points they gave up in those 5 games was 24, in the only game they won of the 5.

Way to man up Dick Lebeau. You rock buddy.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Polamalu is one of the best safeties in the NFL, I don't see how that is so funny. You just have to look at his stats when he is healthy, there isn't many safeties that are better.

your right him and Bob Sanders IDK who's better.....

 

[juck]

He's the man?

Correct me if I am wrong but the Steelers lost 4 of their last 5 games including the playoff loss to Jacksonville and the fewest points they gave up in those 5 games was 24, in the only game they won of the 5.

Way to man up Dick Lebeau. You rock buddy.

The Steelers have also made the playoffs almost every year for the last 15 years and a huge part was his defense.O and a SB win.He is the man ,yes.
Pittsburgh Steelers (1992-1996), (2004-present) - Won 4 AFC Central Division Championships (1992 and 1994-96), 2 AFC North Division Championships (2004 and 2007), 2 AFC Championships (1995 and 2005) and Super Bowl XL
They won all these games mostly with defense,Mr.Lebaeu's defense.Remember the Steelers had a QB carousel until Ben.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

The Steelers have also made the playoffs almost every year for the last 15 years and a huge part was his defense.O and a SB win.He is the man ,yes.

yea not the PI in the end zone on the TD or the holding call on steve huchinson..... go route for the steelers if you like this guy so much.

 

[juck]

yea not the PI in the end zone on the TD or the holding call on steve huchinson..... go route for the steelers if you like this guy so much.

Just because I respect a coach
doesnt mean i should or want to root for them.chill out.

 

[LucaBrasi]

The Steelers have also made the playoffs almost every year for the last 15 years and a huge part was his defense.O and a SB win.He is the man ,yes.
Pittsburgh Steelers (1992-1996), (2004-present) - Won 4 AFC Central Division Championships (1992 and 1994-96), 2 AFC North Division Championships (2004 and 2007), 2 AFC Championships (1995 and 2005) and Super Bowl XL
They won all these games mostly with defense,Mr.Lebaeu's defense.Remember the Steelers had a QB carousel until Ben.

Right. He's one of the best d-coordinators in the league. Has been for a long while.

They gave up 16.6 points per game last year, #1 in the league. They struggled the last month of the season for a variety of reasons, mainly injuries to 3 starters : Ryan Clark at FS, Polamalu (he didn't miss games but his knee wasn't right), and Aaron Smith's torn bicep. Smith is one of, if not the best 3-4 DE in the league.

I'd let Lebeau run my defense, he's the absolute best. I hate the Steelers, but I guess since we live in Pittsburgh we realize how good he is.

 

[BAT]

Lebeau is the godfather of the 34? Wrong. Wade's dad was the first to ever run it in the NFL.

Our 34 is actually a lot like Pittsburgh's. Parcells' was different... It was a stack two-gap 34 where you stonewall the man in front of you with little stunting. Wade's is a one-gap with plenty of stunts and a lot more variety.

Pitt and Minny are two good defenses. But for such a non-aggressive and non-attacking defense, we managed far more sacks than either of them.

It's true that Lebeau may not be the father, or the originators of the 3-4, he is certainly one of the godfather's of the zone blitz 3-4.


Not all 3-4's zone blitz, LeBeau is one of the best at doing so. Capers is another. And while Jim Johnson employs a 4-3 scheme, he is still one of the best zone blitzing coaches in the biz as well.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Did any of you guys see that game? Didn't the pace and tempo seem much more intense than our D?

Or was that just a function of two bad offenses?

or am I seeing things?

I think it's more a product of the fact that the Vikings are an extremely vanilla offense because they don't really scare anyone with their passing game.

I don't know I just don't have the same issues with our defense that others seem to have.

 

[BAT]

I think it's more a product of the fact that the Vikings are an extremely vanilla offense because they don't really scare anyone with their passing game.

I don't know I just don't have the same issues with our defense that others seem to have.

Or perhaps the Vikes DO have a very good D, against both the run (best in the league last season) and the pass (now that they have Jared Allen).


The Vikes front 4 are so good that they are able to put a lot of pressure on the BOTH the running game and the passing game even with lesser talent in the secondary and at LB than the Cowboys.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

The Steelers are uber aggressive. Wade is actually very aggressive if you watch the defense in the regular season.

Difference between the Steelers is that they are usually going to send more, like 6 or 7 rushers whereas Wade usually sends 5 rushers. I believe Wade actually blitzes more, but he almost never sends 6 or 7. So in a sense Wade is more aggressive because he blitzes more often, but he doesn't send the house nearly as often as Dick Lebeau does. Lebeau isn't the godfather of the 3-4, he's the godfather of the zone blitz. Wade likes to zone blitz as well, but I don't think he's as comfortable doing it with this personnel quite yet.

The Vikings aren't very aggressive. They run a 4-3 Tampa 2. Most of their pressure comes from the D-Line. They'll stunt quite often, but so does Wade.

The big problem is that you're watching preseason. Wade has a far better record at getting his defenses to sack the QB than either Lebeau or Leslie Frazier. But in preseason you've got a variety of factors as to why the defense doesn't look as aggressive as other defenses.






YAKUZA

 

[RealCowboyfan]

Can all you x & o guys explain the difference between Dallas's defense vs Pittsburgh's and Minnesotas?

I was watching the Minnesota v Pittsburgh game and it just seemed like these defenses were so much more aggressive than Dallas's. They both seem to be attacking the offenses and putting constant pressure whereas, in my naive eyes, it seems like Dallas is reacting to the offense and I don't get the same sense of aggression/pressure from our guys.

Did anyone see the Steelers v Vikings game? If so, am I crazy, can anyone see a difference in our defense versus Minn/Pitts?

I'm not criticising our D, I'm merely trying to understand if my eyes are decieving me and if the type of defense/philosophy might be the explanation for why the defenses seem different to me.

Or maybe I'm just seeing things and there is really no difference?

thoughts?

I believe you are right but answer these two questions for me::

How many sacks did the Cowboys produce this preseason?

My Guess :: 2, Maybe more

How many interceptions do the Cowboys have this preseason?

My Guess :: 0, no doubt.

 

[Hostile]

The Steelers have also made the playoffs almost every year for the last 15 years and a huge part was his defense.O and a SB win.He is the man ,yes.
Pittsburgh Steelers (1992-1996), (2004-present) - Won 4 AFC Central Division Championships (1992 and 1994-96), 2 AFC North Division Championships (2004 and 2007), 2 AFC Championships (1995 and 2005) and Super Bowl XL
They won all these games mostly with defense,Mr.Lebaeu's defense.Remember the Steelers had a QB carousel until Ben.

Don't get me wrong, I am a Dick Lebeau fan. I believe if you go back and look you'll find he is one of the people I said we should bring in to teach the 3-4.

Even the man takes his lumps.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

seems the difference is pressure on a qb......seems the steelers hit them more then our team does.

 

[Everson24]

I watched that game too. I really wish we ran the Steelers version of the 3-4. Their OLB's were in constant mismatches with either a TE or RB.

The Steelers also play tight man to man with their corners but they dont have to cover long because the rush gets there in about 2 seconds. They protect their corners by keeping a safety deep.

I hate the Steelers but I must admit I was envious of their aggressive defense friday night.

 

[TNCowboy]

If the Dallas D isn't one of the best in the league this year, something has to give. Whether it's Stewart or Phillips or some of the players.

There's no excuse. There's just too much talent to be just a pretty good defense. I'm not encouraged by the number of times in preseason we lined the CBs up 10+ yards off the LOS. Getting good press coverage guys like Jenkins and Jones makes little sense if you're going to do that to them.

 

[juck]

seems the difference is pressure on a qb......seems the steelers hit them more then our team does.

That pretty much sums it up.No excuses for our D we have a highly talented roster although I am suspect of Mr. James still.Unleash the horses with creativity Wade.

 

[rtrn2zn]

I would think the primary difference between the Steelers 3-4 and ours is that their secondary schemes are more incorporated more into the 'front end' of their defenses, while Dallas's secondary schemes seem to be almost detached from what the front 7 are doing. Pittsburgh runs a lot more zone blitzes and stunts and brings secondary players on blitzes more often. Sometimes watching our defense, it just feels like the corners and safeties are still playing a 4-3 cover 2 variation while the front seven are playing an aggressive 3-4.

Parcell/Bellicheck's '34' is a lot different because it is more of a 5-2 (like a lot of high schools run) with the OLB's as stand up ends. The ends penetrate and react while the ILB's read and react the gap, or pick up coverages. It is a defense designed more to limit big plays and force the offense to execute over a long series of plays.

 

[AmishCowboy]

I thought that Wade was Aggressive last year, but it got to the point with Reeves and Jones that he pulled back a little.