Taking a look at #2 WR's from 2007

[Stash]

Thats fine...but how many of those other teams had an Owens and Witten combining for almost 180 receptions?

There's only one ball to go around Hos

And I wouldnt say Crayton was better than those guys you listed, but his yds per catch was higher than 3 of those guys. That isnt the be all end all stat, but it means he is doing something positive when he gets the ball in his hands.

David

How many had almost constant single coverage because of having Owens and Witten attracting so much attention?

Crayton is a fine player, but he's essentially a great #3 receiver thrust into the #2 role by necessity.

He started because Glenn was injured and there were no other options. It wasn't by the Cowboys' design.

He had a fine year, but I think any number of players could have done well in the same circumstances.

I'm not cutting Crayton down, he's a fine posession receiver and ideally an outstanding #3 receiver. But he doesn't keep opposing coordinators up at night either.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Thats fine...but how many of those other teams had an Owens and Witten combining for almost 180 receptions?

There's only one ball to go around Hos

And I wouldnt say Crayton was better than those guys you listed, but his yds per catch was higher than 3 of those guys. That isnt the be all end all stat, but it means he is doing something positive when he gets the ball in his hands.

David

All though those guys may not have had the 180 receptions these are number 2 WR. Even though there isn't a TO and Witten opposite those guys the WR opposite of them aren't slouches Driver, Chad Johnson Randy Moss and Larry Fitz. So it's like splitting hairs all though the level of TE"s isn't the same.

 

[Hostile]

Note the absence of any elite receiving TEs on those players teams.

Sure - if we can upgrade on Crayton, that would be hot. There are more pressing concerns.

Thats fine...but how many of those other teams had an Owens and Witten combining for almost 180 receptions?

There's only one ball to go around Hos

And I wouldnt say Crayton was better than those guys you listed, but his yds per catch was higher than 3 of those guys. That isnt the be all end all stat, but it means he is doing something positive when he gets the ball in his hands.

David

Those teams don't die on the vine if their Owens goes down to injury.

 

[dooomsday]

I did this to show how incredibly lame (and in some cases, just plain stupid) some people are. To suggest that Crayton is a waste of a roster spot or an inadequate player is just ludicrous. His numbers are extremely good compared to other teams #2 WR's, and before some dunce spouts off about how much Dallas threw the ball as a reason for Crayton's reception totals, please think again. We ranked 18th in the NFL in pass attempts last yr. Further, most of these teams didnt have anywhere near the 1-2 combination of Witten and Owens, who combined for 177 receptions, 2500 yds and 22 tds...

Compared to the other #2 guys on this list, Crayton ranked 16th in total receptions, 16th in yds, 11th in yds per catch, 6th in tds and only 5 guys on this list had a longest reception that exceeded Crayton's 59 yds...to say he is just a painfully average player or as in some cases, a major weak link is assinine...nobody can honeslty sit there with a straight face and say they'd take a majority of the guys listed below over Crayton.

I dont think Crayton is by any means a "great" player, or even the IDEAL #2 WR, but he compares very favorably with others and in alot of cases, his numbers are as good or better than most. He is better than alot of people here give him credit for and he has improved every yr he has been in the league.

Thanks. 16th in receptions. 16th in yards. 30 teams. That makes Pat an average #2.

 

[AmishCowboy]

Thats fine...but how many of those other teams had an Owens and Witten combining for almost 180 receptions?

There's only one ball to go around Hos

And I wouldnt say Crayton was better than those guys you listed, but his yds per catch was higher than 3 of those guys. That isnt the be all end all stat, but it means he is doing something positive when he gets the ball in his hands.

David

Well said!

 

[dbair1967]

Team A throws the ball 500 times
Team B throws the ball 300 times
WR A has 50 catches
WR B has 50 catches

I don't see where the overall amount of attempts matter. The only thing that matters is how much they produce when they get the ball and people like Greg Jennings Santonio Holmes and Calvin johnson who had the similar amount of catches. Remember you are comparing #2 WR to other #2 WR so the only thing that matters are Catches YPC YAC TD's.

I'm done with this...you still dont get it

David

 

[dbair1967]

Thanks. 16th in receptions. 16th in yards. 30 teams. That makes Pat an average #2.

did 30 other teams have two guys combine for nearly 180 receptions?

did 30 other teams throw less passes than us?

Again, some of you are misunderstanding the post apparently...I never suggested he is elite or great, I said he is more than adequate

David

 

[dbair1967]

Those teams don't die on the vine if their Owens goes down to injury.

I dont think we'd die on the vine, but we clearly would be in trouble. As would most teams if they lost one of their top 4 or 5 players, especially at an impact offensive position

You cant have probowlers at every position...at some point with so many stars and so much salary cap space tied up in said stars, young guys who havent proven themselves have to step up and show they can play

David

 

[DaBoys4Life]

did 30 other teams have two guys combine for nearly 180 receptions?

did 30 other teams throw less passes than us?

Again, some of you are misunderstanding the post apparently...I never suggested he is elite or great, I said he is more than adequate

David

That isn't what your doing your looking at the number 2 WR around the league. Not lets look at the #2 WR in the league who's WR and TE have 180 receptions.

I'm done with this...you still dont get it

David

I get your trying to push the agenda of how Crayton doesn't fail as a #2 WR in the NFL because the fact that TO and witten combined for 180 catches and that our total pass attempts where less than the amount of other teams.

So basically what i mean is take as you have a personal agenda and bias and is trying to push Crayton and validate his average stats and you write off anyone with almost the same amount of catches with more yards or TD's because they don't throw as little as we do and don't have TO and witten hogging the spot light.

 

[Rampage]

That isn't what your doing your looking at the number 2 WR around the league. Not lets look at the #2 WR in the league who's WR and TE have 180 receptions.



I get your trying to push the agenda of how Crayton doesn't fail as a #2 WR in the NFL because the fact that TO and witten combined for 180 catches and that our total pass attempts where less than the amount of other teams.

So basically what i mean is take as you have a personal agenda and bias and is trying to push Crayton and validate his average stats and you write off anyone with almost the same amount of catches with more yards or TD's because they don't throw as little as we do and don't have TO and witten hogging the spot light.

you do the same with bambi williams

 

[DaBoys4Life]

you do the same with bambi williams

not even if I just don't expect people going

oh noes RW is so terrible and blah blah blah

w.o. providing any type of anything to back them up.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

Interesting for sure.....

 

[dooomsday]

did 30 other teams have two guys combine for nearly 180 receptions?

did 30 other teams throw less passes than us?

Again, some of you are misunderstanding the post apparently...I never suggested he is elite or great, I said he is more than adequate

David

Well, you said it was "asinine" to say Pats average. 16th looks average to me. In fact I dont think one could be more average. You didnt say average with all these variables ( teammates, throwing passes). Nor am I saying he is bad. Just average.

Now, Pat has good hands. And has a strong underneath game and will make big first downs...usually.

Sorry, dont see how pass attempts come into play. I would have sacrificed some throws to Wit to get a WR the ball. And for all we know, on occasion, Wit was an outlet when Pat couldnt get open, which happens my friend. There was certainly enough attempts to make Glenn a 1,000 receiver the year before. And Crayton and Wit still produced.

Taking a closer look at Pat game in and out and the numbers arent nearly as attractive. He had 1 100 yard game. 184 vs. Stl, and 2 of his 7 TDs. And I am not taking away credit. Good for him.

But for the purpose of taking a look past his final stats, the rest of the year 14 games, he went for 500 yards and 5 TDs. 35 yard average. 2 of those 14 games he put up donuts. Not great at all. Average at best.

And in addition to having a top tandem at WR/TE we had the #3 most passing yards. Plenty of room to support 3 players. And we were the #17 rushing attmpt. team, making us heavily pass oriented.

 

[theogt]

Note the absence of any elite receiving TEs on those players teams.

Sure - if we can upgrade on Crayton, that would be hot. There are more pressing concerns.

I can't think of a single more pressing concern on this team than WR depth.

 

[dbair1967]

I can't think of a single more pressing concern on this team than WR depth.

I wouldnt say we have no depth, its just unproven depth...unproven doesnt mean "unable"

Like I mentioned in another post...you cant have probowlers backing up everybody...at some point young guys have to get their chance and step up...maybe somebody like Stanback, Austin or Hurd does that this yr...maybe Crayton continues to improve as well

David

 

[dbair1967]

That isn't what your doing your looking at the number 2 WR around the league. Not lets look at the #2 WR in the league who's WR and TE have 180 receptions.



I get your trying to push the agenda of how Crayton doesn't fail as a #2 WR in the NFL because the fact that TO and witten combined for 180 catches and that our total pass attempts where less than the amount of other teams.

So basically what i mean is take as you have a personal agenda and bias and is trying to push Crayton and validate his average stats and you write off anyone with almost the same amount of catches with more yards or TD's because they don't throw as little as we do and don't have TO and witten hogging the spot light.

Like I've said a couple times now...pretty basic concepts that you just either dont get, or dont want to get

And stop with this "agenda" b/s...I dont have any agenda other than proving to some really dimwitted people that Crayton actually compares well to other teams #2 WR's league wide...and it was obvious that was the case looking at the numbers

David

 

[dbair1967]

Well, you said it was "asinine" to say Pats average. 16th looks average to me. In fact I dont think one could be more average. You didnt say average with all these variables ( teammates, throwing passes). Nor am I saying he is bad. Just average.

I'd say the numbers show he was above avg with all things considered

Sorry, dont see how pass attempts come into play.

Another one that cant get this seemingly easy concept...I just cant understand this at all

And for all we know, on occasion, Wit was an outlet when Pat couldnt get open, which happens my friend. There was certainly enough attempts to make Glenn a 1,000 receiver the year before. And Crayton and Wit still produced.

Well Witten caught 30+ less passes in 2006 and only 1 TD...Jason Garrett comes in, and like his mentor Norv Turner the TE became a focal point of the offense, thus a huge jump in TE production. Now is Terry Glenn a better player than Patrick Crayton, absolutely. But the passing system also changed. Our TE's in 2006 COMBINED for 78 catches, 880 yds and 1 TD...last yr the numbers were 113, 1306 and 11 tds...also as FYI, Glenn caught 20 more passes in 2006 than Crayton caught last yr, caught 1 fewer TD and averaged a little over 1.0yds per catch more.

Taking a closer look at Pat game in and out and the numbers arent nearly as attractive. He had 1 100 yard game. 184 vs. Stl, and 2 of his 7 TDs. And I am not taking away credit. Good for him.

It was good for him...it was good for our team too

But for the purpose of taking a look past his final stats, the rest of the year 14 games, he went for 500 yards and 5 TDs. 35 yard average. 2 of those 14 games he put up donuts. Not great at all. Average at best.

OK

And in addition to having a top tandem at WR/TE we had the #3 most passing yards. Plenty of room to support 3 players. And we were the #17 rushing attmpt. team, making us heavily pass oriented.

total yds has nothing to do with opportunities for WR's, pass attempts and completions do. We actually ranked 21st in rush attempts, but thats only slightly lower than we ranked in passing attempts, where we ranked 18th.

David

 

[starfrombirth]

I am curious why Reggie Wayne isn't on the list is it because Harrison was injured because he is their number 2 WR.

Majority would mean 17 players. All your saying is that he is average compared to other #2 WR at his position.

I was thinking the same thing. His numbers put him in the middle of the pack of number two and sometime number 3 receivers. I'm not knocking his production personally (though I'm not a fan of mouth running and quitting on routes) but these are not the numbers I would have used to "prove" that he is a good receiver.

 

[Stash]

I can't think of a single more pressing concern on this team than WR depth.

I see Owens, Crayton, and a bunch of these ???????????????????

 

[starfrombirth]

actually dbair, in the world of statistics, if your comparing number 2's then you have to stick with the ONLY the number 2's numbers. You can't factor in team total production unless your going to compare how many of the teams total receptions went to this particular receiver. In the receivers you mentioned, all of these receivers have similar number of receptions BUT with the exception of longest catch, he is average. He is not bad but he isn't good either. Take it for what it's worth.