The Cowboys Would Have Drafted Shazier over Martin

[Manwiththeplan]

Fwiw, all 4 players Dallas wanted would have been productive here. Martin was an all-pro and Donald was pretty damn good himself. Shazier would have started here and likely would have made the defense better and Barr would have been 2nd on the team in sacks (possibly first) through the 12 games he played.

 

[xwalker]

Correct. Jimmy tried to trade up and get OLB/DE James Francis from Baylor and he was unable to pull it off.

Then, he attempted to move up for DT Ray Agnew from NC State and was unsuccessful again.

Finally, when Emmitt continued to slide, Jimmy traded up to the 17th pick with Pittsburgh to nab E Smith. Johnson knew that he had to get in front of Atlanta who everyone knew was going to take a RB, which is why he traded with the Steelers.

The rest is history. Dallas got the NFL's alltime leading rusher and 3 time super bowl champ and Atlanta got RB Steve Broussard, lol.

Dallas had Emmitt ranked in the top 5 of the draft (4th overall if I remember correctly) but had signed RB Terrence Flagler away from San Francisco in Plan B free agency and felt that they had bigger needs than RB. Once he was unable to get the players he had targeted, Jimmy went back to his board and drafted for good value.

It is just another bit of proof that drafting for need instead of BAP will get you a less talented roster than if you just stick to your board (within reason). Had Dallas ended up with Ray Agnew instead of Emmitt Smith, who knows how different things would have been.

Yes, people over focus on need in the draft. Anytime you look back at past drafts, even recent ones, it's much easier to see that getting talent overrides need as the best approach.

The Cowboys could have traded down instead of drafting Martin, but they went BPA and it paid off.

In 2009 they could have drafted LeSean McCoy in the 2nd, but they didn't despite having him rated as a 1st rounder because they already had Felix and Barber.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Yesterday, Bryan Broaddus of dallascowboys.com dropped a little nugget of information on his podcast that I thought was very interesting. Broaddus said that “Shazier was in the (Cowboys) top five plays in the draft” and he mentioned that Shazier graded about “10 spots higher than Martin.”

http://all22breakdown.com/cowboys-would-have-taken-ryan-shazier-over-zack-martin/

sometimes that's how it works out. what I do like is that they had a plan, and the players were ranked and you go according to your ranking. we know how it worked out, but you make your board and you stick to it. hoping that jerry doesn't try to get cute

 

[Sasquatch]

This is old news as many have point out. What is interesting to me is whether or not there are any LBs this year that are comparable to Shazier in terms of athleticism and skills.

 

[tyke1doe]

Sometimes you just get lucky. As it looks so far, Zack Martin is a top 5 guard. Shazier isn't anywhere near a top 5 LB as of right now. In fact, I think Zack Martin is the best player of the 2014 draft so far.

The player I really wanted the Cowboys to take was Beckham Jr. The Cowboys draft war room was pretty upset when he went off the board.

And the Lions could have had Beckham Jr, Donald, or Zack Martin and instead, took TE Ebron. Major failure on their part. Three of their DL are FAs this year and may walk. WR Calvin Johnson is nearing the end and may be a cap casualty. And their OL could have really used Martin this year. If the Lions draft either Beckham, Martin or Donald, I think they walk into the super bowl this year.

A lot of the draft is just plain luck. If the Cowboys would have lost the coin toss with the Ravens, Martin would be a Raven today.

Good post.

I think the Lions are still smarting from the WR debacles under Matt Millen (three receivers in three consecutive years, IIRC.

But this the first time I've heard the Cowboys wanted Beckham. That sounds like an embarrassment of riches, but a Beckham-Bryant combo would have been unstoppable.

 

[tyke1doe]

Correct. Jimmy tried to trade up and get OLB/DE James Francis from Baylor and he was unable to pull it off.

Then, he attempted to move up for DT Ray Agnew from NC State and was unsuccessful again.

Finally, when Emmitt continued to slide, Jimmy traded up to the 17th pick with Pittsburgh to nab E Smith. Johnson knew that he had to get in front of Atlanta who everyone knew was going to take a RB, which is why he traded with the Steelers.

The rest is history. Dallas got the NFL's alltime leading rusher and 3 time super bowl champ and Atlanta got RB Steve Broussard, lol.

Dallas had Emmitt ranked in the top 5 of the draft (4th overall if I remember correctly) but had signed RB Terrence Flagler away from San Francisco in Plan B free agency and felt that they had bigger needs than RB. Once he was unable to get the players he had targeted, Jimmy went back to his board and drafted for good value.

It is just another bit of proof that drafting for need instead of BAP will get you a less talented roster than if you just stick to your board (within reason). Had Dallas ended up with Ray Agnew instead of Emmitt Smith, who knows how different things would have been.

Good memory.

I remember hearing Jimmy say somewhere that he had Blair Thomas rated higher than Emmitt Smith. We would have had the No. 1 pick that year if we hadn't taken Steve Walsh in the supplemental draft. If we had kept the No. 1 pick we may have moved down and nabbed either Cortez Kennedy or Junior Seau because Jimmy liked them both. If we got one of them, I suspect the Cowboys would have moved down with the Minnesota pick instead of up, or would have been bundled more picks to move up to get Agnew or Francis. Then we wouldn't have had Emmitt, who justifies not having a No. 1 pick. Kennedy and Seau were great players, but Emmitt had more of an impact for the Cowboys and the Cowboys dynasty than those players would have, IMO.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Good post.

I think the Lions are still smarting from the WR debacles under Matt Millen (three receivers in three consecutive years, IIRC.

Well that's because 2 of them sucked

 

[big dog cowboy]

This info is so 2014....

I'm surprised to find out everyone didn't know about this. Goes to prove you miss a day in the CZ, you miss a lot.

 

[DFWJC]

Sometimes you just get lucky. As it looks so far, Zack Martin is a top 5 guard. Shazier isn't anywhere near a top 5 LB as of right now. In fact, I think Zack Martin is the best player of the 2014 draft so far.

The player I really wanted the Cowboys to take was Beckham Jr. The Cowboys draft war room was pretty upset when he went off the board.

And the Lions could have had Beckham Jr, Donald, or Zack Martin and instead, took TE Ebron. Major failure on their part. Three of their DL are FAs this year and may walk. WR Calvin Johnson is nearing the end and may be a cap casualty. And their OL could have really used Martin this year. If the Lions draft either Beckham, Martin or Donald, I think they walk into the super bowl this year.

A lot of the draft is just plain luck. If the Cowboys would have lost the coin toss with the Ravens, Martin would be a Raven today.

You think the Cowboys wanted Beckham more than Donald, Martin, or Shazier? I don't...not at all.

 

[JBS]

It seems like this dominant offensive line was built partly due to chance.

Fortunately.

Absolutely

 

[TwoCentPlain]

You think the Cowboys wanted Beckham more than Donald, Martin, or Shazier? I don't...not at all.

Well, you have to admit Beckham is a future star and would have been a fantastic addition to the Cowboys. I personally think the Cowboys had some interest in Beckham but more likely had a trade worked out with another team. The trade was probably contingent on Beckham being available with the Cowboys' pick.

 

[DFWJC]

Well, you have to admit Beckham is a future star and would have been a fantastic addition to the Cowboys. I personally think the Cowboys had some interest in Beckham but more likely had a trade worked out with another team. The trade was probably contingent on Beckham being available with the Cowboys' pick.

Beckham is awesome. true

 

[Wood]

That info was out after last years draft, so Broaddus still think it is new news....

Broddius has brought it up atleast half dozen times. The OP is just hearing about it now.

 

[unionjack8]

sorry but 4-3 lbers just dont hold much value with me, hitchens was better than shazier this year. so glad squeelers took him

 

[dogberry]

If we take any of the defensive players or Beckham in the first, would we have been forced to take a guard in the second?

 

[xwalker]

I agree with most all of this. I don't care too much about weight at LB anymore. But maybe that's just me. I was a fan of Telvin Smith last year and he played around 229 pounds. I think Shaq's a better player than Telvin.

Yes, he played well for a 5th round pick.

9 Starts
104 tackles
1 int
2 sacks
1 forced fumble

AFC Defensive Player of Week

 

[NeonDeion21]

Broddius has brought it up atleast half dozen times. The OP is just hearing about it now.

I knew about Shazier over Martin. Did Broddaus say that Shazier was in the team's top 5 players? I'm sincerely asking. Did he say he was 10 spots ahead of Martin?

 

[AsthmaField]

Good memory.

I remember hearing Jimmy say somewhere that he had Blair Thomas rated higher than Emmitt Smith. We would have had the No. 1 pick that year if we hadn't taken Steve Walsh in the supplemental draft. If we had kept the No. 1 pick we may have moved down and nabbed either Cortez Kennedy or Junior Seau because Jimmy liked them both. If we got one of them, I suspect the Cowboys would have moved down with the Minnesota pick instead of up, or would have been bundled more picks to move up to get Agnew or Francis. Then we wouldn't have had Emmitt, who justifies not having a No. 1 pick. Kennedy and Seau were great players, but Emmitt had more of an impact for the Cowboys and the Cowboys dynasty than those players would have, IMO.

Yep, I remember it all the same way you do. Kennedy was a damn good player.

 

[Longboysfan]

This info is so 2014....

And every team has a few players slotted in their draft order.
And every team has players they have slotted picked before their chance to choose.
Non-Story......

 

[xwalker]

Broddius has brought it up atleast half dozen times. The OP is just hearing about it now.

I knew about Shazier over Martin. Did Broddaus say that Shazier was in the team's top 5 players? I'm sincerely asking. Did he say he was 10 spots ahead of Martin?

I don't think they have discussed top Shazier having a top 5 ranking.

I've only heard that they thought Shazier would fall to their pick, but I have not heard where he ranked specifically, until now. I know they had Donald and Barr ranked ahead of Martin also, but I don't know where they ranked relative to Shazier.