CFZ The kind of defensive coordinator we should be looking for

[montgod]

Good post. I have accepted the reality of our situation. I just like to point out (perhaps for my own sanity) that our GM prefers selling his team to his fan base rather than building the best coaching staff and talent base we can find and let the playoff wins do the selling.Thats our reality too.

Despite all our obvious problems, this team can get better. We have a good scouting department and usually draft pretty well. That’s some hope.

This is kinda it really. Only two options are going to be an in-house hire who is promoted to DC (gains experience and resume builder) or an old retread DC with name sizzle (allows them to get back into the coaching circle discussion again and stay relevant) because they all would be tied to McCarthy and the uncertainty of what next year brings. No new up and coming DC would touch this position imo.

 

[DallasEast]

So for about the 7th time and about 53 posts about who's gonna be our coordinator. Look around the NFL. Look around the NFC E. and Try to tell me what's being done in our own division somehow is going outside their comfort zone. Is these very standard GM's hired retransform our team or others if they move the needle for you? I don't understand why this is a Jerry thing all the time 75%. Of all the coaching hires are retread. They're moving from one team to another from either a head coaching position or back to coordinator and then the circle just continues...

I will try replying to this single paragraph and applied punctuation that may or may not be accurate.

• I have no idea. I am awaiting Jerry Jones' decision.
• I hope Jones is looking throughout the NFL.
• I hope Jones is looking at and beyond the NFC East, for instance college-level prospects.
• I have not speculated what is in the comfort zone of other teams' front offices. Doing so does not interest me.
• Other GM head coach/coordinator moves that 'move the needle for me' are usually first-time NFL assistant/coordinators, whose teams have shown 2 - 3 years statistical improvement offensively or defensively, along with college level coaches who have led in similar fashion.
• It is a Jones thing 100% of the time. He appointed himself the general manager of the franchise. A general manager is responsible for proper coaches hiring and firing, along with assessing necessary player acquisitions. It is his complete job. Any manager of any company is accountable for what they do or not do. Jones is not an exception to this common rule of business.
• I agree that retreads are a problem. That is likely one reason why I and others dislike Jones' typical job searches, like this one has shaped up being thus far.
• Any circle of inefficiency can be broken if the individual turning the circle is willing to change how it is handled. This is likely another reason why I and others dislike Jones' method of interviewing and/or hiring candidates whom he singles out.

 

[CTcowboy203]

Good post. I have accepted the reality of our situation. I just like to point out (perhaps for my own sanity) that our GM prefers selling his team to his fan base rather than building the best coaching staff and talent base we can find and let the playoff wins do the selling.Thats our reality too.

Despite all our obvious problems, this team can get better. We have a good scouting department and usually draft pretty well. That’s some hope.

You do a thorough job with all your analysis. Much better than most who just complain, to be honest. I always appreciate the posts even if I don’t always agree. I just get more excited by how we can win in spite of Jerry than harping on how many flaws he has. That’s how I cope.

 

[TwistedL0g1k]

There are some interesting names on this list (along with the usual suspects):

Blogging The Boys Article

 

[blueblood70]

I will try replying to this single paragraph and applied punctuation that may or may not be accurate.

• I have no idea. I am awaiting Jerry Jones' decision.
• I hope Jones is looking throughout the NFL.
• I hope Jones is looking at and beyond the NFC East, for instance college-level prospects.
• I have not speculated what is in the comfort zone of other teams' front offices. Doing so does not interest me.
• Other GM head coach/coordinator moves that 'move the needle for me' are usually first-time NFL assistant/coordinators, whose teams have shown 2 - 3 years statistical improvement offensively or defensively, along with college level coaches who have led in similar fashion.
• It is a Jones thing 100% of the time. He appointed himself the general manager of the franchise. A general manager is responsible for proper coaches hiring and firing, along with assessing necessary player acquisitions. It is his complete job. Any manager of any company is accountable for what they do or not do. Jones is not an exception to this common rule of business.
• I agree that retreads are a problem. That is likely one reason why I and others dislike Jones' typical job searches, like this one has shaped up being thus far.
• Any circle of inefficiency can be broken if the individual turning the circle is willing to change how it is handled. This is likely another reason why I and others dislike Jones' method of interviewing and/or hiring candidates whom he singles out.

And I'm telling you there must be a lot of old dying owners and traditional GM's around the NFL who love marketing and making money and having a splash that moves the needle as a name because they're all hiring the same people... Show me the list and I'll show you all the new hires this year 75% are actually retreads and most of them are older... The ones that are not I mean did you want to replace Mike McCarthy with Kellen Moore OC like bring him back or Cliff Kingsbury literally I bet you say yes but he's a retread he's a guy who's been fired he was out of the NFL....

I'm trying to point out that Jerry Jones doesn't do a whole lot that's different from most other GM's and owners literally it's kind of how it works yes that 25% some of them do strange stuff like hey the giants wait got Joe judge and I remember when Mike McCarthy was hired or when we got Kellen Moore that was a big problem right here cause we should do something crazy like get a special teams guide hire them for head coach or one of the coordinator positions just do something wild yes the NFL does promote from within some younger guys do get promoted but it's very rare that any of them make a big impact.. Not never but rare and sometimes you just hire guys with experience especially in our case this year like Bob said in his first line that that would work best for us right now... But let's remind folks that Jason Garrett and Kellen Moore were once those young guys have we seen how that turned out I mean maybe tell him more one day we'll finally be the guy just like Eric the enemy is a name he's actually kind of older but really he was overrated watching the thought they were getting this big name that all that stuff done in Kansas City was actually Andy Reed.. So hiring assistance from like good stock you know from winning programs doesn't always work either because a lot of the big names that did these things were actually the head coach you also were the play callers or the designer of the defense or the offense...

I'm not against our next coaching hire you know head coach and whatever staff he brings in being some young high risk let's try this and go a different route type deal but right now for where we sit with a lot of these hires might not be for more than one season then the veteran coach would be the best route...

And I'm saying that the NFL does the same thing though it's not like everybody had a big problem they were clamoring to try to get Peyton back Sean Peyton is a retread bill Parcells nobody had a big problem with him he was a retreat people were hoping that Vrabel/ Belichick comes in here they're both older retreads... I mean even switzer came from the college ranks to take over for Jimmy and yes he did it with his guys but he still won a Super Bowl and I bet if he just stayed around a little longer didn't get into that weird gun thing at the airport maybe he would have been even more successful here but it's not like Jerry only hires 80 year old husbands that have nothing left it's pretty much the same pool that 75% of the owners hire out of same guys just playing the merry go round or the carousel whatever you wanna call it...

To make it short and closing most of you are just questing this because you like to complain about anything that Jerry does even if it's a lot like the rest of the NFL.... Like I said the NFC East just did the same thing.

 

[DallasEast]

And I'm telling you there must be a lot of old dying owners and traditional GM's around the NFL who love marketing and making money and having a splash that moves the needle as a name because they're all hiring the same people... Show me the list and I'll show you all the new hires this year 75% are actually retreads and most of them are older... The ones that are not I mean did you want to replace Mike McCarthy with Kellen Moore OC like bring him back or Cliff Kingsbury literally I bet you say yes but he's a retread he's a guy who's been fired he was out of the NFL....

I'm trying to point out that Jerry Jones doesn't do a whole lot that's different from most other GM's and owners literally it's kind of how it works yes that 25% some of them do strange stuff like hey the giants wait got Joe judge and I remember when Mike McCarthy was hired or when we got Kellen Moore that was a big problem right here cause we should do something crazy like get a special teams guide hire them for head coach or one of the coordinator positions just do something wild yes the NFL does promote from within some younger guys do get promoted but it's very rare that any of them make a big impact.. Not never but rare and sometimes you just hire guys with experience especially in our case this year like Bob said in his first line that that would work best for us right now... But let's remind folks that Jason Garrett and Kellen Moore were once those young guys have we seen how that turned out I mean maybe tell him more one day we'll finally be the guy just like Eric the enemy is a name he's actually kind of older but really he was overrated watching the thought they were getting this big name that all that stuff done in Kansas City was actually Andy Reed.. So hiring assistance from like good stock you know from winning programs doesn't always work either because a lot of the big names that did these things were actually the head coach you also were the play callers or the designer of the defense or the offense...

I'm not against our next coaching hire you know head coach and whatever staff he brings in being some young high risk let's try this and go a different route type deal but right now for where we sit with a lot of these hires might not be for more than one season then the veteran coach would be the best route...

And I'm saying that the NFL does the same thing though it's not like everybody had a big problem they were clamoring to try to get Peyton back Sean Peyton is a retread bill Parcells nobody had a big problem with him he was a retreat people were hoping that Vrabel/ Belichick comes in here they're both older retreads... I mean even switzer came from the college ranks to take over for Jimmy and yes he did it with his guys but he still won a Super Bowl and I bet if he just stayed around a little longer didn't get into that weird gun thing at the airport maybe he would have been even more successful here but it's not like Jerry only hires 80 year old husbands that have nothing left it's pretty much the same pool that 75% of the owners hire out of same guys just playing the merry go round or the carousel whatever you wanna call it...

To make it short and closing most of you are just questing this because you like to complain about anything that Jerry does even if it's a lot like the rest of the NFL.... Like I said the NFC East just did the same thing.

There is one thing the vast number of NFL teams (not all but most) have done differently than Dallas concerning their general manager. That difference has been usually hiring and firing multiple general managers over the course of a decade. The practice is a revolving repetitive one that seeks different qualified perspectives, who can assemble the 'right' combination of coaches and players. Accomplishing that goal only works for a select few but it also only begins with finding the right general manager to get the job done.

Jones has rejected this common practice for three decades and counting. It is why he has not gotten the job done.

We do not agree on Jones. Be assured. I will continue venting my personal disagreement of Jones on this forum for as long as I am able.

 

[Bobhaze]

There is one thing the vast number of NFL teams (not all but most) have done differently than Dallas concerning their general manager. That difference has been usually hiring and firing multiple general managers over the course of a decade. The practice is a revolving repetitive one that seeks different qualified perspectives, who can assemble the 'right' combination of coaches and players. Accomplishing that goal only works for a select few but it also only begins with finding the right general manager to get the job done.

Jones has rejected this common practice for three decades and counting. It is why he has not gotten the job done.

We do not agree on Jones. Be assured. I will continue venting my personal disagreement of Jones on this forum for as long as I am able.

Well said. It’s simple - The winning owners of the last 28 consecutive Super Bowls all share on common practice: They hire someone else to serve as their GM. It’s not difficult to see for anyone not named Jones.

 

[Diehardblues]

For the same reasons we liked Quinn we should like Vrabel or Rivera. Maybe even Zimmer. Rex we have already fired so wouldn’t go there. All been HC with strong defensive skills.

And they have the experience to step in if we need a HC in the event there’s a collapse with McCarthy or a potential HC if another disappointing ending.

I can’t imagine anything but retreads coming in. There are no more up and coming HC coming to work here. The only exception would be someone of our own making like with Garrett and Moore.

 

[plymkr]

49ers DB Coach Daniel Bullocks

I really like this idea. He’s good and it would make us stronger and them weaker

 

[loublue22]

Before that was The Clapper.

Both internal guys he could take credit for developing. If you hire an outsider (Vrabel) and he fixes your mess you get no credit.

 

[LysleE]

I like your choices, but the harsh reality is that Jerry will not hire anybody who will have the potential to overshadow him…he is content to hire a run-of-the-mill coordinator, with whom he feels comfortable around and more importantly, allows him to meddle in coaching matters and undermining the DC’s authority.
No respectable coach, other than those who have been passed over for a DC or have been out of the game for a time, would be willing to work under those conditions.

 

[CyberB0b]

What's interesting is that the most recent time Jerry went with a young and "presumably" up and coming coach was Kellen Moore as our OC.

Yeah. The last two were Garrett and Moore. Jerry outsmarted himself on those. Turns out, people actually need a resume before getting a job. Something neither one of them had.

 

[75boyz]

In my opinion, none of the names for our next DC I’ve seen floating around the last few days are what we need. There’s a reason “names” like Mike Zimmer, Rex Ryan, Ron Rivera and possibly Wink Martindale are guys whose careers are mostly in the rear view mirror. There’s a reason most of these guys are readily available. No one else is rushing to hire them.

So why are we? Because our GM likes “a name”. He thinks like a fan. “Who are the big names out there we could hire?” That’s how fans think. Nothing wrong with that if you’re a fan. It’s a disaster if you’re the general manager. When your GM is also your primary marketing salesman, you get this kind of thinking. Instead of finding a great young defensive mind, you are instead looking for someone to sell to the fan base.

So what kind of DC should we be looking for? Here are the characteristics and talents I believe we should be hunting:

• A talented coach who understands modern offenses and the fundamentals in how to stop them.
• A defensive mind who understands “complimentary football”. If our offense is struggling or your team finds itself two scores behind, your defense better be able to stop the run and get off the field.
• A coach who is flexible and not completely married to one style or approach to defense. The modern game requires being able to be flexible in approach. If you are glued to one philosophy or style (like having safeties as LBs, lol) you may be in trouble if that isn’t working.

Ok, so who are some examples of young coaches who could fit this bill?

• One guy I really like (sadly he’s not available) is lions DC Aaron Glenn. He’s done wonders in Detroit with a very under-manned defensive talent base. He was aggressive, creative and flexible. The lions ran some of the most creative schemes I saw all year. They held the niners to 7 points in the first half until turnovers did them in. Glenn is a very talented up and comer.
• Titan DC Shane Bowen- was just hired by the giants unfortunately as their DC. He worked under Mike Vrabel the last six years and he’s only 37. Former LB in college, he’s very aggressive and creative. We should have been more aggressive to interview him.
• 49ers DB Coach Daniel Bullocks- he’s worked under niners DC Steve Wilks for years and would bring a physical style similar to what Wilks and the niners use which is very LB centric which could be useful in how to deploy Micah Parsons in multiple ways.
• Packers LB coach Kirk Olivadotti- an excellent developer of talent, especially at LB where the Cowboys need some major help. Has coached with several NFL teams and has a good set of skills for the modern game. I would at least kick the tires.

There are plenty of other names but the guys above are the kind of coaches I would be looking for. It won’t happen because Jerry thinks like a fan and a marketing guru who prefers “names” he can sell.

Another great post Bob. Appreciate these names as I was unfamiliar with a few.

 

[75boyz]

it’s not an option because those guys won’t take the interview or if they do it’s a sham interview. They aren’t going to take what may be there one shot at a coordinator gig and tie it to McCarthy and a championship game or bust mandate and then get fired and lose their chance again for years or ever.

I’m not telling anyone how to fan at all and I agree with you a lot about Jerry but it’s going to be a long offseason if instead of focusing how the team can turn things around based on how things are run in actuality or what roster moves should /could be made or scheme changes a new coordinator should implement the focus is on how we wish Jerry was vs how he actually does things.

This is how things will be run for our team. It’s sucks but it’s reality. 3 months ago you were hopeful that the team had a chance, while they certainly were not as close as you or me or many thought - I’m not sure their as far now as sometimes we make them seem to be. The truth is probably in the middle somewhere.

Regardless, I tend to focus on how the team can improve given the handicap and struggles ownership provides instead of thinking about scenarios that just aren’t gonna happen. Doesn’t make me a better fan or smarter or anything but these names are all pipe dreams. You should be questioning why McCarthy is here still rather than why aren’t these guys being interviewed

Excellent post.

 

[oldcorvetteguy]

In my opinion, none of the names for our next DC I’ve seen floating around the last few days are what we need. There’s a reason “names” like Mike Zimmer, Rex Ryan, Ron Rivera and possibly Wink Martindale are guys whose careers are mostly in the rear view mirror. There’s a reason most of these guys are readily available. No one else is rushing to hire them.

So why are we? Because our GM likes “a name”. He thinks like a fan. “Who are the big names out there we could hire?” That’s how fans think. Nothing wrong with that if you’re a fan. It’s a disaster if you’re the general manager. When your GM is also your primary marketing salesman, you get this kind of thinking. Instead of finding a great young defensive mind, you are instead looking for someone to sell to the fan base.

So what kind of DC should we be looking for? Here are the characteristics and talents I believe we should be hunting:

• A talented coach who understands modern offenses and the fundamentals in how to stop them.
• A defensive mind who understands “complimentary football”. If our offense is struggling or your team finds itself two scores behind, your defense better be able to stop the run and get off the field.
• A coach who is flexible and not completely married to one style or approach to defense. The modern game requires being able to be flexible in approach. If you are glued to one philosophy or style (like having safeties as LBs, lol) you may be in trouble if that isn’t working.

Ok, so who are some examples of young coaches who could fit this bill?

• One guy I really like (sadly he’s not available) is lions DC Aaron Glenn. He’s done wonders in Detroit with a very under-manned defensive talent base. He was aggressive, creative and flexible. The lions ran some of the most creative schemes I saw all year. They held the niners to 7 points in the first half until turnovers did them in. Glenn is a very talented up and comer.
• Titan DC Shane Bowen- was just hired by the giants unfortunately as their DC. He worked under Mike Vrabel the last six years and he’s only 37. Former LB in college, he’s very aggressive and creative. We should have been more aggressive to interview him.
• 49ers DB Coach Daniel Bullocks- he’s worked under niners DC Steve Wilks for years and would bring a physical style similar to what Wilks and the niners use which is very LB centric which could be useful in how to deploy Micah Parsons in multiple ways.
• Packers LB coach Kirk Olivadotti- an excellent developer of talent, especially at LB where the Cowboys need some major help. Has coached with several NFL teams and has a good set of skills for the modern game. I would at least kick the tires.

There are plenty of other names but the guys above are the kind of coaches I would be looking for. It won’t happen because Jerry thinks like a fan and a marketing guru who prefers “names” he can sell.

Jerry wants people to do what he says. That team is shafted. And just think Jerry fired Landry. Wish Jerry could be fired.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

In my opinion, none of the names for our next DC I’ve seen floating around the last few days are what we need. There’s a reason “names” like Mike Zimmer, Rex Ryan, Ron Rivera and possibly Wink Martindale are guys whose careers are mostly in the rear view mirror. There’s a reason most of these guys are readily available. No one else is rushing to hire them.

So why are we? Because our GM likes “a name”. He thinks like a fan. “Who are the big names out there we could hire?” That’s how fans think. Nothing wrong with that if you’re a fan. It’s a disaster if you’re the general manager. When your GM is also your primary marketing salesman, you get this kind of thinking. Instead of finding a great young defensive mind, you are instead looking for someone to sell to the fan base.

So what kind of DC should we be looking for? Here are the characteristics and talents I believe we should be hunting:

• A talented coach who understands modern offenses and the fundamentals in how to stop them.
• A defensive mind who understands “complimentary football”. If our offense is struggling or your team finds itself two scores behind, your defense better be able to stop the run and get off the field.
• A coach who is flexible and not completely married to one style or approach to defense. The modern game requires being able to be flexible in approach. If you are glued to one philosophy or style (like having safeties as LBs, lol) you may be in trouble if that isn’t working.

Ok, so who are some examples of young coaches who could fit this bill?

• One guy I really like (sadly he’s not available) is lions DC Aaron Glenn. He’s done wonders in Detroit with a very under-manned defensive talent base. He was aggressive, creative and flexible. The lions ran some of the most creative schemes I saw all year. They held the niners to 7 points in the first half until turnovers did them in. Glenn is a very talented up and comer.
• Titan DC Shane Bowen- was just hired by the giants unfortunately as their DC. He worked under Mike Vrabel the last six years and he’s only 37. Former LB in college, he’s very aggressive and creative. We should have been more aggressive to interview him.
• 49ers DB Coach Daniel Bullocks- he’s worked under niners DC Steve Wilks for years and would bring a physical style similar to what Wilks and the niners use which is very LB centric which could be useful in how to deploy Micah Parsons in multiple ways.
• Packers LB coach Kirk Olivadotti- an excellent developer of talent, especially at LB where the Cowboys need some major help. Has coached with several NFL teams and has a good set of skills for the modern game. I would at least kick the tires.

There are plenty of other names but the guys above are the kind of coaches I would be looking for. It won’t happen because Jerry thinks like a fan and a marketing guru who prefers “names” he can sell.

Old guys are comfortable with other old guys. Like the old saying goes about birds of a feather, you know.

And Jerry was "shown up" by Jimmy, the last thing he wants is to have some young guy talking in meetings and Jerry is like "What? I don't understand"

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Yeah. The last two were Garrett and Moore. Jerry outsmarted himself on those. Turns out, people actually need a resume before getting a job. Something neither one of them had.

Big difference between young and green. Garrett and Moore were green....

 

[Chocolate Lab]

If Jerry hired a young guy and he stunk people would complain that he didn't require the guy be a success first.

Being young doesn't mean you're any better. I doubt the success rate is any higher for inexperienced guys. In fact, it's probably lower.

As said above, Garrett was the ultimate "young, fresh, bright" candidate and he had no freaking idea what he was doing. Kellen Moore was young and related to the players and all that, and was very average.

 

[charron]

The problem with young 1st time DC's is Mike can't afford to let them learn on the job and Mike isn't the guy to help them much if they struggle. Joe whit might have been ok but since he's gone like really needs an experienced coach to take control. Remember it took mine untill year 3 to start getting involved with the offense and that was his forte.

 

[DandyDon52]

I would also interview Al Harris and Adam Durode on our current staff. They both are respected by the players and have a fresh approach. Neither will be the next DC here of course because they don’t have that “name sizzle” our GM is looking for. Bu IMO they should at least be considered.

Jerry wants to sell the team to fans more than he wants to be a winner.
plagiarizing me bob?