Theories on Game 1 last year?

[aria]

Yeah people were rightfully being cautiously optimistic that the success wouldn't last, and that was warranted. But that's a convenient way to ignore how the success didn't last. The tweet I quoted above is a clear indicator that we made detrimental schematic changes and reverted to classic Garrett tendencies. I implore you to look at highlights or rewatch the Giants game, then rewatch the Saints game. You cannot tell me there wasn't a difference in the tendencies and motion, shifting, RPO, etc

You do have to change game plans and schemes based on who you’re playing. A 4th grader could have drawn up plays to beat the Giants, they’re defense was one of the worst in the league. As usual, our coveted overpaid RB didn’t show up in another big game, the Saints shut him down and he fumbled at critical point in the game which changed the outcome.

 

[JD_KaPow]

Looking back for a bit before any concrete news emerges about the Boys. What are yalls theories on why the offense looked so different week 1 (you could extend this to weeks 1-3) verses the rest of the season?

I’m not referring to the competition of the teams we played also, because it’s not like we blew them out playing classic JG offensive football. This is strictly about the scheme, we’ve seen JG coached teams have blowouts before (Jaguars 2018), but it still looked schematically like any other game.

We motioned, shifted, and RPO’d the Giants to death week 1. I’d never seen the team do that before, it was almost shocking. I remember the game thread as well, most people were genuinely surprised at what they were seeing schematically.

Where do y’all think that went?

You see the reason but don't believe it. Those defenses were terrible. Things we could do against them and have success with, we couldn't do against better defenses.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Holy crap dude every time I start a thread are you gonna question the need for its existence? It's a FORUM, people post things to discuss about and those interested in the discussion participate. Lol why do you go to threads to complain about the topic of the thread? Just be chill lol, either contribute or press the back button and find another thread.

Why do you start threads that have nothing to do with the Cowboys today? Do you lay in bed at night and think what kind of nonsensical thread can I start tomorrow? What thread can I start that has no relevance to the Cowboys today. When i see the titles of threads I don't look at who starts them because if they're dumb I'm going to express my opinion on them regardless anyways.
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[jazzcat22]

Looking back for a bit before any concrete news emerges about the Boys. What are yalls theories on why the offense looked so different week 1 (you could extend this to weeks 1-3) verses the rest of the season?

I’m not referring to the competition of the teams we played also, because it’s not like we blew them out playing classic JG offensive football. This is strictly about the scheme, we’ve seen JG coached teams have blowouts before (Jaguars 2018), but it still looked schematically like any other game.

We motioned, shifted, and RPO’d the Giants to death week 1. I’d never seen the team do that before, it was almost shocking. I remember the game thread as well, most people were genuinely surprised at what they were seeing schematically.

Where do y’all think that went?

I don't think it was anything in particular, as strange things happen.

In 2010 why did the team go 1-7 and looked worse than the 1989 1-15 team under Wade, who had them at 11-5 in 2009. Then finish at 6-10 under Garrett, and looked productive again.
Why did the team go 3-5 in 2018 and then all of go 7-1, and even won a playoff game. Yes Cooper came in and helped, but it was not all him doing that.

Why did the Giants, not once but twice get on a run, and beat Brady 2 times in the Sb, though some extremely fortunate catches.

Things just happen.

In 1993, after the T-Day Leon Lett gaffe, Jimmy told the team, hey, you know what you have to do, you need to win out to get to where you want to be.
Well, they won out, and Emmitt played with one arm, as the beat the Giants to get HFA. Now that was a great team more so than things just happening. But if they had to play WC game the next week, without Emmitt most likely they would have lost. He needed that extra week to heal somewhat.

 

[817Gill]

Why do you start threads that have nothing to do with the Cowboys today? Do you lay in bed at night and think what kind of nonsensical thread can I start tomorrow? What thread can I start that has no relevance to the Cowboys today. When i see the titles of threads I don't look at who starts them because if they're dumb I'm going to express my opinion on them regardless anyways.
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Lmao what a sad guy

 

[817Gill]

You see the reason but don't believe it. Those defenses were terrible. Things we could do against them and have success with, we couldn't do against better defenses.

So only against bad defenses does shifting, motioning, and RPO’s work? Only against bad defenses is passing the ball on 1st down effective?

The quality of opponent argument is a moot point because of the documented statistical shift back to classic JG tendencies (run on 1st down percentage, tight end heavy personnel groupings, etc). If we did the same things that first game or first three games as we did the rest of the season, then I wouldn’t have even made a thread.

If you honestly believe we didn’t do anything different, or that modern nfl offensive schemes only work against bad teams, then we are gonna have to agree to disagree lol.

 

[817Gill]

You do have to change game plans and schemes based on who you’re playing. A 4th grader could have drawn up plays to beat the Giants, they’re defense was one of the worst in the league. As usual, our coveted overpaid RB didn’t show up in another big game, the Saints shut him down and he fumbled at critical point in the game which changed the outcome.

But still, how do you explain the change in schematics? How do you explain the 1st down pass percentage going from 69% in the giants game to down to 50% in the Saints game and staying around there all year? How do you explain the decrease in play action percentage? What happened to the shifts and motions we saw those weeks, they were only good ideas when playing bad teams?

The competition argument is all fine and dandy, but what is your theory on why the actual schematics changed. These changes are statistically documented, it’s not some personal take.

 

[CouchCoach]

You have to consider the competition. They were not good teams and they didn't have any film on the OC's game plan or play calling.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Posted it before, but even David Moore said he thought Garrett influenced Moore during the week to be conservative due to the loud dome.

Also, don't underestimate Garrett not liking at all that the young kid was getting so much praise for the offense.

 

[817Gill]

You have to consider the competition. They were not good teams and they didn't have any film on the OC's game plan or play calling.

Got it, any idea why the actual schemes changed for worse though? It’s not like we went from simple stuff that works against bad teams to stuff that works against good teams. We literally went from high play action and passing a lot on first down to low play action and running half the time.

You consider these changes as teams getting film on us or a logical change to prepare for better opponents?

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Posted it before, but even David Moore said he thought Garrett influenced Moore during the week to be conservative due to the loud dome.

Also, don't underestimate Garrett not liking at all that the young kid was getting so much praise for the offense.

That Moore kid’s getting all the praise, I know what I’ll do, let’s mess with things and get ME fired! Meanwhile he will still be here. Wait, what was I trying to accomplish here?

 

[CouchCoach]

Got it, any idea why the actual schemes changed for worse though? It’s not like we went from simple stuff that works against bad teams to stuff that works against good teams. We literally went from high play action and passing a lot on first down to low play action and running half the time.

You consider these changes as teams getting film on us or a logical change to prepare for better opponents?

Could be or it could be that thing that some coaches get stuck in their head like Parcells did, change before they make me change. Used to make me nuts.

I do not think Garrett intervened because more in the media would have caught on to that after Booger's comments that Moore should come to him.

Moore is a smart football guy but he's still not a wile vet when it comes to watching film and developing strategy and I don't think Garratt was much help to him in that department. I think the coaches they faced began taking the film and throwing some things at him that he hadn't seen or anticipated.

The one thing we don't know, the relationship between Garrett and Moore. I can assume it was strained after the Linehan incident with the media and Booger following that up with that "anyone gets in your way, come see me" stupid comment. They start out hot, rumor is Prescott's agent jacks his price and it pisses Booger & son off and he's admitted this.

So, who's to say it isn't the Joneses that get involved to save face for their chosen one Garrett and slow down Prescott. Some would say that's crazy but is it really? Is winning the real thing to the Joneses or is it something else? So they tell Garrett what they want him to do, back off on the gas with Prescott because it's gone to his head. So, they lose the next 3 in a row to bring Prescott and his agent back to earth only it doesn't work.

You've got to wonder how the Joneses have reacted to this meteoric rise in QB salaries and these are not the studs, they're Cousins, Garoppolo, Ryan guys and that means they're going to have to pay Tier 1 money to a Tier 2 QB. That's why they've tried to hometown discount him because they know his deal is going to cut down on the wiggle room with other contracts and talent and I'll bet they're already regretting those Lawrence and Elliott deals.

Posters who always looked at Garrett as the cause or culprit were looking too low. On the field during games? Yep, that was him but other than that, there were other forces at work.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

That Moore kid’s getting all the praise, I know what I’ll do, let’s mess with things and get ME fired! Meanwhile he will still be here. Wait, what was I trying to accomplish here?

Nobody said he was sabotaging himself or trying to get himself fired. He was trying to give the rookie OC good advice and doing what he thought was best.

I don't know why this would be so hard to believe.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Nobody said he was sabotaging himself or trying to get himself fired. He was trying to give the rookie OC good advice and doing what he thought was best.

I don't know why this would be so hard to believe.

You literally said, “Also, don't underestimate Garrett not liking at all that the young kid was getting so much praise for the offense.” How else are you expecting people to interpret that?

 

[HungryLion]

Truth is. “Sabotaging himself” is the wrong choice of words. Jason Garrett just isn’t that good of a coach he is mediocre. Mediocre coaches get beat by other coaches.

I’m sure Garrett wanted to win every game. He just was incapable of doing so.

 

[CouchCoach]

Truth is. “Sabotaging himself” is the wrong choice of words. Jason Garrett just isn’t that good of a coach he is mediocre. Mediocre coaches get beat by other coaches.

I’m sure Garrett wanted to win every game. He just was incapable of doing so.

Yep, some assume he was playing it when he was only doing his best. He's a smart guy but not really a smart football guy. There are geniuses that can't coach a Pop Warner team in a one team league.

 

[817Gill]

Could be or it could be that thing that some coaches get stuck in their head like Parcells did, change before they make me change. Used to make me nuts.

I do not think Garrett intervened because more in the media would have caught on to that after Booger's comments that Moore should come to him.

Moore is a smart football guy but he's still not a wile vet when it comes to watching film and developing strategy and I don't think Garratt was much help to him in that department. I think the coaches they faced began taking the film and throwing some things at him that he hadn't seen or anticipated.

The one thing we don't know, the relationship between Garrett and Moore. I can assume it was strained after the Linehan incident with the media and Booger following that up with that "anyone gets in your way, come see me" stupid comment. They start out hot, rumor is Prescott's agent jacks his price and it pisses Booger & son off and he's admitted this.

So, who's to say it isn't the Joneses that get involved to save face for their chosen one Garrett and slow down Prescott. Some would say that's crazy but is it really? Is winning the real thing to the Joneses or is it something else? So they tell Garrett what they want him to do, back off on the gas with Prescott because it's gone to his head. So, they lose the next 3 in a row to bring Prescott and his agent back to earth only it doesn't work.

You've got to wonder how the Joneses have reacted to this meteoric rise in QB salaries and these are not the studs, they're Cousins, Garoppolo, Ryan guys and that means they're going to have to pay Tier 1 money to a Tier 2 QB. That's why they've tried to hometown discount him because they know his deal is going to cut down on the wiggle room with other contracts and talent and I'll bet they're already regretting those Lawrence and Elliott deals.

Posters who always looked at Garrett as the cause or culprit were looking too low. On the field during games? Yep, that was him but other than that, there were other forces at work.

There we go lol, that’s a real theory or opinion on what happened. The competition argument is so lazy because of how documented the actual football schematic changes were. But I appreciate your input!

 

[Jake]

You do have to change game plans and schemes based on who you’re playing. A 4th grader could have drawn up plays to beat the Giants, they’re defense was one of the worst in the league. As usual, our coveted overpaid RB didn’t show up in another big game, the Saints shut him down and he fumbled at critical point in the game which changed the outcome.

It always comes back to the agenda: Zeke's fault! Just make that your signature and skip the lead in.

I'll make the same suggestion to those whose every post comes back to Dak's fault!


"The fallacy of the single cause, also known as causal oversimplification, is a fallacy that occurs when it is assumed that there is a single, simple cause of an outcome when in reality it may have been caused by a number of only jointly sufficient causes."

 

[ondaedg]

And ask why was Devin Smith suddenly MIA after showing he could be a tremendous asset for us. Take a guy like Smith out and replace him with a TE and you've got Garrett football.

 

[blueblood70]

the conspiracy theorist have some mental issues, JG didnt lose on purpose he didnt purposely interfere to lose games im sure he had some input but this was discussed to death in 2019, hes gone time to move on..

I watched a lot of games like the saints and MANY teams struggled to run and also got pressured in passing, typically gave up low yard and point output for many teams they played..

newsflash, not many games will look the same, you try to line up and use the same game plan like they used the first 3 games against weak scrubs as we used as Guinea pigs to practice our passing game, you will be easy to beat because they have seen it already.. you play a plan against the team you have next on your schedule and can vary..no one griped to much when we ran roughshod over the rams and dolphins using the run game and not a lot of passing to speak of...

I mean the pass game was working in MN and few other games but stalled eventually, that to me was on dak, the lay calls could have worked if Dak chose another target or chose to run himself or pass to someone other then zeke o the short side of the field..
here were many reason on game to game basis that the pans falied, not being vanilla or JG had plotted to make the team fail or simply tried to be obvious..KM has some to blame as well as I saw a great run game many games where zeke led the league in first half runs and YPC and all of sudden we throw 7 out of the next 10 plays to start the half 2 punts a nd atP later we are down.. this is on the OC these are IN GAME call issues.. he was green and made mistakes..

hopefully KM has learned from watching that film over and over and MM can further teach the kid about balance, about staying with the hot hand as well, its not just about shifts and movement, its about balance and having the right play call that throws the defense off balance.. its not always game to game , its play tp play..

so it was team effort in bad and most are gone and or will be gone, the new staff has chance to help correct some of this but the list is way too big to just say oh it was garett,.. game 16 week 17 against none other then Washington we somehow lit up the skies again and that inured shoulder sure got right from the horrible second half quickly, why is that? it WAS WASHINGTON.. LMAO..

bad defense, st, coaching. player execution and sprinkle in some bad luck and bad calls =8-8....