CFZ There is Some Hope For Cowboys (Most Super Bowl Ingredients in Place)

[CowboysFaninHouston]

The resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.
Friedrich Nietzsche

patience grasshopper. patience.

 

[CCBoy]

Sadly his toil is being ruined by giving Garrett a pass as a championship caliber HC. LOL

Might be the biggest joke I have EVER heard. EVERY HC on that list is better than Garrett from Gailey to Wade.

The Garrett era failed for a number of reason...the biggest was probably that as a former Offensive Coordinator, he was unsuccessful in the playoffs with a very good group of offensive linemen.

But he lost to Green Bay, first, with a last second field goal. Second by what should have been a winning touchdown pass incorrectly called an incompletion.

He did keep a recent development on the Cowboy progress in the franchise to today's team. Some good was involved. I'm not going to a name calling. He had a hurdle he just couldn't overcome and his time ran out.

 

[CCBoy]

The resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.
Friedrich Nietzsche

Me, I fully believe in St. Thomas Hospital, and will to my grave...

 

[CCBoy]

I believe you need to add one more requirement. If you want to continue your work, check on Oline rating. I bet that they are top 5 rated for most SB winners. Not sure how far that rating goes back.

Level of rated offenses would include that element pretty effectively...both passing and running highlighted.

 

[blueblood70]

lets get to how many of these you are trickling out.,.just be down with it..listr them all .

 

[CCBoy]

Was Williams, the first QB drafted from Grambling, a valid quarterback. I remember Karl Douglas, A&I, when both Morrell and Unitas were both released.

Certainly Dak Prescott qualifies now!

 

[CowboyRoy]

Points allowed...ranked against their 31 opponents in their respective year.

IF using one, thats the best.

 

[CowboyRoy]

The Garrett era failed for a number of reason...the biggest was probably that as a former Offensive Coordinator, he was unsuccessful in the playoffs with a very good group of offensive linemen.

But he lost to Green Bay, first, with a last second field goal. Second by what should have been a winning touchdown pass incorrectly called an incompletion.

He did keep a recent development on the Cowboy progress in the franchise to today's team. Some good was involved. I'm not going to a name calling. He had a hurdle he just couldn't overcome and his time ran out.

Hes not a championship caliber coach. That is ridiculous. He needs to be a FAIL, not a PASS on the list.

 

[T-RO]

#3 Super Bowl Criteria: A top ten QB that has a year under his belt, has balls-in-sack and skins-on-wall...and isn't physically broken

First year-starter QB's don't win Super Bowls, except for a few odd cases like Kurt Warner with his divine assistance.

Let's keep it objective: The filter says you need a year of seasoning. To pass to the next level a Super Bowl team wannabe needs a QB with a top-ten QBR within the previous 18 months. QB should be respected by teammates. Guys who are broken physically only pass via DOJ intervention or sponsor exemption (i.e. Big money conveyed through properly shrouded channels).

 

[CWR]

If a top eight defense is a virtual requirement to win a Super Bowl...how many Cowboys teams since our last Super Bowl even meet criteria #1?

Cowboys Teams that Met Rule #1 of Champions - top 8 defensive ranking
1996, 3rd
1998, 3rd
1999, 5th
2003, 2nd
2009, 2nd
2016, 5th
2018, 6th
2021, 7th
2022, 6th

9 of 26 Cowboys team since our last Super Bowl passed Requirement #1

Crazy looking at those numbers, because the 2016 defense was not good. I'm pretty sure we were coming off a historically bad defense that season. They made it work though, mainly by having a ridiculously good run game and playing keep away.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Level of rated offenses would include that element pretty effectively...both passing and running highlighted.

I looked at all the SB winners since the 70's steelers and its like 90% all had great Olines. Only ones I couldnt remember whether they were great was some of those Giant teams that won, the Eagles team with Foles, maybe the indy team with Manning?

To me a top 5 Oline is another key ingredient.

 

[CowboyRoy]

#3 Super Bowl Criteria: A top ten QB that has a year under his belt, and isn't physically broken

First year-start QB's don't win Super Bowls, except for a few odd cases like Kurt Warner and his divine assistance.

Let's keep it objective: The filter says you need a year of seasoning. To pass to the next level a Super Bowl team wannabe needs a QB with a top-ten QBR within the previous 18 months. QB should be respected by teammates. Guys who are broken physically only pass through DOJ intervention or sponsor exemption (i.e. Big money).

QBR within the previous 18 months? You can have a bus driver doing very little with a great Oline that has a good QBR.

 

[blueblood70]

By the way it doesn't matter what our rankings were overall as a team during the regular season the problem here is you have to start looking at situational football and the fact is we've been limping into the playoffs with some of the most important parts of these ingredients.


I mean you could have the best restaurant in town and you could be serving the best food but on that one day that the critic shows up you have an off day your chef was sick say your sous chef had to be the main guy or whatever it was down the line your best server Hostess was out sick and you didn't put up your best food and the critic gave you a bad review and it hurt your business.

think about this the Cowboys in the middle of the season let's just use last year was playing out of their mind one of the best defensive special teams the offense was rolling we're putting up points for winning games but here's the issue steele goes down Ezekiel Elliott gets hurt, the offensive line starts getting banged up, did we forget to Biadisz , Mcgovern, and other started going in and out of the line up?

We also have to remember how many injuries it seemed like Micah Parsons was fighting and then we lost brown then we lost Louis and we started shuffling the back end of our defense and the middle of our defense started paying for it and we're giving up yards and points So what happened now going into the playoffs we did not have that same team that may or may not have been ranked 7th overall on defense offense whatever you're trying to prove with the ingredients.

This playoffs and Super Bowl game ie the dinner that needs the ingredients is on a whole other level if you can't bring that same team with the same effort of play and the same chef et cetera etcetera.
you're going to lose a game against the better team that has more of its components or ingredients, whatever you're wanting to call it let's stay on your storyline.

You watched us have to play the 49ers almost at full strength on A roll and we struggled because we did not have the same offensive line, run game, or skill players that we had in the middle of the season that got our rankings.

that was just on offense

I mean Tony Pollard gets hurt in that game but he had also got hurt right before the end of the season and he was not playing well the last five games of the season. So if offense is what lost us the game there are many reasons why the rankings can't hold up because you have to give us the rankings in the playoffs.

I know they separate the regular season and the playoffs, so how are our teams in the playoffs who was missing, who was injured but playing ,who wasn't on their game, who might have been sick who didn't have the best game plan, you know like who didn't choose the best recipe who went off track and tried something they shouldn't have, that they've never created that dish before, IE Kellen Moore.

So let's remember this is not about the regular season rankings the overall rankings, we have to remember circumstances, context ,and situations when we got to play that team who was on equal or the better team on the field that you literally almost needed to play a perfect game to win and you did not have all those ingredients at that time and they did case in point the Philadelphia Eagles got lucky because they got to see a banged up and might I say a little worn out and not on their game because they played us the week before?? I mean when they get to play a a third or fourth string quarterback when we had to play the quarterback that got them into the second round. hmm rankings are thrown out over circumstances.

This goes all the way back to all those other ones we literally had the referees make bad calls, we had some strange things going on, so these rankings to me are pretty hollow,

I mean it's interesting, I'm not saying you shouldn't post this because it's better than a lot of things that are posted on here...

however if you just separate the regular season and then look at what we had going into that game without our best staff or ingredients to play our best game that day. I mean I can't can't say it enough there's a big difference between the playoffs and the regular season because it's a long season especially now at 17 games and even before when our old Super Bowl teams only had to play 14 games that that it's it's about attrition it's about how the team at that moment in the playoffs is assembled and are they full of the ingredients that got them there and got that ranking and I gotta tell you last year we did not...

it sounds like an excuse but it's an actual reason we didn't have Terrence steele and we had a offensive line that was very banged up we were rotating left guard and RT a lot, we only had CD lamb who was producing anything as a threat on offense, Tony Pollard goes down, you only call 16 run plays,

I mean they basically try to cook a meal missing the key ingredients.

 

[T-RO]

Based on Rule #3, the Quarterback filter...
Some teams are forced to exit to the right, some to the left. And then there is that damned trap door.

1996...Troy rocked top-drawer play
1999...Troy still top 10
2003...Quincy had skins and balls flipped...along with a lot of things. This team is out.
2016*...Superior pro-bowl play from Romo
2018*...Dak in first year is not quite ready (or perhaps just the Zebras) This team is out.
2021...Dak, Cowboys can't get over the hump
2022...Way, way closer to the Super Bowl than people frame it. (But losing air?)

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

this is going to devolve into another Dak thread. guaranteed..................................

I find it odd that the people that most vehemently fight Dak arguments...are the first ones to start them.

 

[T-RO]

The five most legitimate Cowboys teams since Super Bowl City?

***these teams all had legitimate defenses***

1996, Switzer and Troy?
1999, Gailey and Troy?
2016, Garrett and Romo?
2021, Dak and McCarthy?
2022, Dak and McCarthy II?

Don't think it's quite so simple. We are only THREE filters deep here, folks!

 

[T-RO]

Crazy looking at those numbers, because the 2016 defense was not good. I'm pretty sure we were coming off a historically bad defense that season. They made it work though, mainly by having a ridiculously good run game and playing keep away.

The 2016 teams was good at keeping opposing points off the board, but you are right...it wasn't really a great defensive team.

The team allowed the 14th most yards. Red zone success for sure helped a ton, and some luck suppressed points. That, and the Cowboys offensive ball control with elite rushing also helped.

 

[blueblood70]

Super Bowl winning teams must meet minimum requirements, right?

In this thread I invite you to join me in discussing what those requirements are, and how the Cowboys '23 team might stack up in meeting this criteria.

#1 Super Bowl Criteria: A top defense.
I ran some numbers on Super Bowl winning teams from 1970 to present, and discovered the following:

-49 of 53 (92%) of Super Bowl champs featured above average defenses (points allowed)​

and​

-42 of 53 (79%) of Super Bowl champs featured defenses that ranked in the top eight​

​

​

Want to bring it closer to home? All (5 of 5) Cowboys Super Bowl winning teams possessed top-8 defenses! And for a bit of a shock? Consider that Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Terry Bradshaw and John Elway never won a Super Bowl without a top 8 defense!

To refine the numbers: 30 of 53 (57%) of Super Bowl champs rocked top five defenses. 14 Super Bowl Champs were #1 in defense.

So though there are occasional exceptions... let's wrap this up as Rule #1: A Super Bowl team needs a top eight defense, and top five is where it's at.

While this is a very interesting topic,

it changes a lot the ingredients from the regular season are not always the ingredients you're bringing into the playoffs.

Especially by the time you get to the second round, you have to look at what the peak what's in the regular season you know little roll teams get on and then what they were by the time they got to the playoffs and how the team they were playing what ingredients they had.. Lot of those rankings and stats are bloated from those runs that teams had in the regular season and it's not the way they ended the season or entered the playoffs.

I believe you'll find it's very different using these criteria for ingredients on what the rankings were in the regular season versus those teams were a shell of themselves some key pieces missing or banged up or injured changes the whole entire picture.

that is why they keep separate stats for the postseason as they do the regular season. So those rankings would obviously be very different.

 

[T-RO]

While this is a very interesting topic,

it changes a lot the ingredients from the regular season are not always the ingredients you're bringing into the playoffs.

Especially by the time you get to the second round, you have to look at what the peak what's in the regular season you know little roll teams get on and then what they were by the time they got to the playoffs and how the team they were playing what ingredients they had.. Lot of those rankings and stats are bloated from those runs that teams had in the regular season and it's not the way they ended the season or entered the playoffs.

I believe you'll find it's very different using these criteria for ingredients on what the rankings were in the regular season versus those teams were a shell of themselves some key pieces missing or banged up or injured changes the whole entire picture.

that is why they keep separate stats for the postseason as they do the regular season. So those rankings would obviously be very different.

blue, I want to promise to read your two posts more thoughtfully when I resume with the thread tomorrow (my time-zone-schedule is opposite most...headed to bed now). Cheers.

 

[blueblood70]

blue, I want to promise to read your two posts more thoughtfully when I resume with the thread tomorrow (my time-zone-schedule is opposite most...headed to bed now). Cheers.

Dang really where are you from? You're going to bed and we're up getting around here in Texas.