Throwing this out there... addition by subtraction.

[Jimz31]

I've already said that I want Wade & Company back next year, but I got to thinking about how this year we had a situation where everybody said that we made an addition through subtraction in getting rid of a play-maker in T.O....

So, could it be an addition by subtraction in making changes in the coaching dept? Do not players take on the identity of their coaches? And let's admit it.....Wade doesn't necessarily pump anybody up. And this isn't just about Wade, it could be about JG as well.

Again, I'm against doing it as I think that Wade really did a good job with this defense and I think that if we lose him we take a HUGE step backwards with our defense.....

Just throwing it out there.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Replacing a coach?

Novel concept. I don't think anyone has brought this up before.

Guys... lets discuss this!

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Replacing a coach?

Novel concept. I don't think anyone has brought this up before.

Guys... lets discuss this!

:laugh2: :laugh2:

 

[Jimz31]

Replacing a coach?

Novel concept. I don't think anyone has brought this up before.

Guys... lets discuss this!

It's a DIFFERENT WAY to look at it....instead of all of these blowhards that are just saying to fire one of them because they are upset still.

Think about the concept if you have that ability.

 

[Gadfly22]

Wade wasn't hired to be a cheerleader. Whether he can or will "pump anybody up" is a matter of his leadership style. It isn't a prerequisite for an NFL coach. (Think Tom Landry -- I think you've heard of him -- or Bud Grant.)

In any event, if you saw the Brooking "pump up" events, this team didn't need any more pumping. They needed more blocking, running, catching, tackling and covering.

 

[Jimz31]

Wade wasn't hired to be a cheerleader. Whether he can or will "pump anybody up" is a matter of his leadership style. It isn't a prerequisite for an NFL coach. (Think Tom Landry -- I think you've heard of him -- or Bud Grant.)

In any event, if you saw the Brooking "pump up" events, this team didn't need any more pumping. They needed more blocking, running, catching, tackling and covering.

And T.O. wasn't "hired" to play nice with the media....he was put here to PRODUCE which he did, yet we had addition by subtraction by getting rid of him. See what I am saying? Perhaps the new coach whether HC, DC, or OC implements those things and these guys take on his identity like the Jets have with Rex Ryan.

There IS something to be said about Rex's guys following their coach....

Also, about Landry....this is a different time with different players that don't have the same amount of respect of coaches like it was back then....it's gotten ridiculous with players attitudes nowadays and what they can get awy with....

 

[tomson75]

I don't think this team took on Wade's personality at all.

This team showed more fire and emotion than any I can remember in some time....this year seemed to be more about.....wait for it.........."football".

We have problems, for sure....but just because our coach is a little fatty with a Santa Claus personality that the players like and want to fight for....doesn't mean our players are going to mold themselves in his likeness.

I'm not a huge Wade fan, especially as head coach....but I think it would be a terrible mistake to let him go at this point. This season, while disappointing, was a successful one. We have things that we need to work on, things we need to change, but our head coach isn't one of them....for now.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I don't think this team took on Wade's personality at all.

That saying in general is one of the worst, most inaccurate cliches in all of sports.

 

[zrinkill]

And T.O. wasn't "hired" to play nice with the media...

And his teammates apparently.

If you cannot see the difference in someone who is not a rah rah guy and someone who divides locker rooms ..... then this discussion is pointless.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

And T.O. wasn't "hired" to play nice with the media....he was put here to PRODUCE which he did,

Not really. If you look at his last year here, he was a non-factor (on the field) in 14 out of 16 games.

yet we had addition by subtraction by getting rid of him.

Because we cleaned the locker room of the cancers and the team actually healed as a team.

What coach is a cancer?

There IS something to be said about Rex's guys following their coach....

And our guys were following Wade.

I know everyone is hott for Rex, and I think he's a good coach, but lets not forget his team is in this position because his final two opponents laid down for him.

Furthermore, he won both his playoff when both the Bengals and Chargers kickers missed very makeable kicks that would have easily changed the outcome of either game.



-----

With Wade we have won two division championships in three years. We won a playoff game for the first time in over a decade. And we have a relatively young team (oline notwithstanding).

Just because we went and played the #2 seed at their house, in a game we were underdogs, and at a stadium they were previously undefeated in, and lost does not seem like a sensible reason to start replacing coaches and breaking up what the team has accomplished this year.

 

[Gadfly22]

And T.O. wasn't "hired" to play nice with the media....he was put here to PRODUCE which he did, yet we had addition by subtraction by getting rid of him. See what I am saying? Perhaps the new coach whether HC, DC, or OC implements those things and these guys take on his identity like the Jets have with Rex Ryan.

There IS something to be said about Rex's guys following their coach....

Also, about Landry....this is a different time with different players that don't have the same amount of respect of coaches like it was back then....it's gotten ridiculous with players attitudes nowadays and what they can get awy with....

Yes, I see what you're saying, and what you're saying is silly. TO caused problems off the field that offset his production on the field. Wade is solving problems (i.e., improving the defense) and not causing any disruption. In fact, based on player comments, they like and support Wade and are glad he's coming back.

And yes, Landry was coach in a different time. No way someone calm and reserved, like a Tony Dungy or Bill Belichick, could win championshi.... Oh wait.

 

[Jimz31]

I don't think this team took on Wade's personality at all.

This team showed more fire and emotion than any I can remember in some time....this year seemed to be more about.....wait for it.........."football".

We have problems, for sure....but just because our coach is a little fatty with a Santa Claus personality that the players like and want to fight for....doesn't mean our players are going to mold themselves in his likeness.

I'm not a huge Wade fan, especially as head coach....but I think it would be a terrible mistake to let him go at this point. This season, while disappointing, was a successful one. We have things that we need to work on, things we need to change, but our head coach isn't one of them....for now.

When I say that about the "Personality" think about it....why do alot of people hate the Patriots? They can't stand the coach and they say the players are just like him.

Why are the Jets successful this year? Listen to the players talk and they are just like him.

What kind of inspiration does Wade give off like Rex Ryan? Anything? A fist pump after a FG?

Now, again, don't think that I am "down" on Wade overall...I love what he did with the defense and do believe that we would take a step back if he were gone....

Just threw out that scenario as a concept that everybody agreed upon with T.O. being gone...think about THAT logic and carry it over.

 

[Jimz31]

And his teammates apparently.

If you cannot see the difference in someone who is not a rah rah guy and someone who divides locker rooms ..... then this discussion is pointless.

Again....missed the concept...

Not saying that at all....think about the concept....

 

[Gadfly22]

Again....missed the concept...

Not saying that at all....think about the concept....

Nope, I think we've all got the "concept" real clear. It's just that it's a very bad and illogical "concept" that no one should take seriously.

Because it's bad.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Seems like your concept has failed no matter how you word it. Personally I think it is yet another bash on Wade post even if you want to break it down to a minute detail instead of just another general thing.

However to stick with the concept...

The team has seemed to take on more of the Brooking attitude than the wade attitude and since Brooking has played with wade before in atlanta and now with the cowboys it would be hard to say that the team has taken on wade's personality.

I agree with others and think that the whole the team takes on the coaches personality is mostly bunk. There are cases of it sure but I think is not the norm for the most part.

Some members of this team have been here with Tuna before wade and they still made plenty of penalties and have had difficulty in areas of finishing games or seasons well.

So I think your theory or idea falls flat and again I think it is just another attempt of another thread that boils down to wade and should we get rid of him no matter how it is worded.

But hey, that is just one man's opinion.

 

[tomson75]

When I say that about the "Personality" think about it....why do alot of people hate the Patriots? They can't stand the coach and they say the players are just like him.

Why are the Jets successful this year? Listen to the players talk and they are just like him.

What kind of inspiration does Wade give off like Rex Ryan? Anything? A fist pump after a FG?

Now, again, don't think that I am "down" on Wade overall...I love what he did with the defense and do believe that we would take a step back if he were gone....

Just threw out that scenario as a concept that everybody agreed upon with T.O. being gone...think about THAT logic and carry it over.

I hear you...but I just don't think that this is the case. I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that a team will adopt the personality of its coach. I don't think it's necessary to do so either....there have been far too many successful coaches with varying personalities to suggest that successful teams need to hire coaches with a pissed off attitude. If that were the case, Cowher and Gruden would have been locked up to 15 year 2 billion dollar contracts.

It's just not the case.

I don't like Wade's personality on the sidelines whatsoever. I think he's a great person, but I can't count the number of times I yelled at the TV for Wade to get pissed at a call or lay into a ref.....then to get even more pissed when he'd jump around after the opponent missed a field goal. It used to anger me to no end.

....but this team, and its players didnt display that personality at all. More often than not, they looked like they were mad. Madder than hell. Brooking had a lot to do with it. This team didn't adopt Wade's personality. It's not even close.

 

[Jimz31]

Not really. If you look at his last year here, he was a non-factor (on the field) in 14 out of 16 games.



Because we cleaned the locker room of the cancers and the team actually healed as a team.

What coach is a cancer?




And our guys were following Wade.

I know everyone is hott for Rex, and I think he's a good coach, but lets not forget his team is in this position because his final two opponents laid down for him.

Furthermore, he won both his playoff when both the Bengals and Chargers kickers missed very makeable kicks that would have easily changed the outcome of either game.



-----

With Wade we have won two division championships in three years. We won a playoff game for the first time in over a decade. And we have a relatively young team (oline notwithstanding).

Just because we went and played the #2 seed at their house, in a game we were underdogs, and at a stadium they were previously undefeated in, and lost does not seem like a sensible reason to start replacing coaches and breaking up what the team has accomplished this year.

Agreed about T.O., but look at his stats while he was here....he DID produce.
Enough about him as he was just the logic that people need to use for THIS scenario.

Coaches can have an impact on the players and they don't have to be a "cancer"...if that one text was right a while back about a player upset with his comments after a loss, it was obvious that that player didn't, at that point, have alot of respect for him.

Rex Ryan and his players see this opportunity and are running with it better than any team this post-season....they are doing more with less. Forget HOW they got there, they DESERVE to be there....ask the teams they've already beaten...forget the missed FG's....that's part of the game. This is the reason why I could care less HOW we get into the playoffs....everything is even once you are there. Back in? Fine with me. Go in with fire? Fine there as well. Both work and there is NO ASSURANCE that if we go into the playoffs on fire that it means anything...look at this year. Backing in is fine as well becuase you can look at last years Cardinals who lost ALL of their december games and ALMOST won the SB. Jet's REALLY backed in and are in the AFC Championship game.....I don't know if ANY team has ever backed in more....but it doesn't matter.

Their coach is cocky and confident and their players are loving it. Wade & company defend players too much sometimes saying things that are completely out there. Don't defend, hold them accountable.

I WANT a cocky team because it will make them play harder, IMO. And that is also what Deion Sanders said about trash talking...you gotta back it up and it makes you play more concentrated...ie. better.

 

[Jimz31]

Seems like your concept has failed no matter how you word it. Personally I think it is yet another bash on Wade post even if you want to break it down to a minute detail instead of just another general thing.

However to stick with the concept...

The team has seemed to take on more of the Brooking attitude than the wade attitude and since Brooking has played with wade before in atlanta and now with the cowboys it would be hard to say that the team has taken on wade's personality.

I agree with others and think that the whole the team takes on the coaches personality is mostly bunk. There are cases of it sure but I think is not the norm for the most part.

Some members of this team have been here with Tuna before wade and they still made plenty of penalties and have had difficulty in areas of finishing games or seasons well.

So I think your theory or idea falls flat and again I think it is just another attempt of another thread that boils down to wade and should we get rid of him no matter how it is worded.

But hey, that is just one man's opinion.

No, it's NOT a bash Wade post....believe me. Look at my post history and search on my Coaches thread. I made it clear there AND here that I want them back, otherwise we take a step back...didn't I even state that in my leading post here?

I'll say it again and again that we need to KEEP Wade & Company here for at least another year, but if we get the same results, it may indeed come down next year to addition by subtraction.....sometimes a change is needed to take that step forward.....which is what we did with the T.O. situation.

 

[Jimz31]

I hear you...but I just don't think that this is the case. I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that a team will adopt the personality of its coach. I don't think it's necessary to do so either....there have been far too many successful coaches with varying personalities to suggest that successful teams need to hire coaches with a pissed off attitude. If that were the case, Cowher and Gruden would have been locked up to 15 year 2 billion dollar contracts.

It's just not the case.

I don't like Wade's personality on the sidelines whatsoever. I think he's a great person, but I can't count the number of times I yelled at the TV for Wade to get pissed at a call or lay into a ref.....then to get even more pissed when he'd jump around after the opponent missed a field goal. It used to anger me to no end.

....but this team, and its players didnt display that personality at all. More often than not, they looked like they were mad. Madder than hell. Brooking had a lot to do with it. This team didn't adopt Wade's personality. It's not even close.

I agree that they didn't take on WP's personality. But you have the Brooking personality and the WP personality clashing and kinda canceling each other out, IMO.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Some members of this team have been here with Tuna before wade and they still made plenty of penalties and have had difficulty in areas of finishing games or seasons well.

That's not saying much though.

If you look at Tuna's record without Belichick on his staff, he's barely a .500 coach himself.



Regarding the concept, I agree with the masses that it is foolish. The mods have my permission to merge this thread now.