Tired of posters...

[Juke99]

good post and this is a reason the (tuna) haters are running the forum now. mob rules.

They're misplacing their anger of the fact that JJ's poor drafts, trades, cap mismanagement and overall mishandling the franchise led us to 5-11, 5-11, 5-11 and a depleted franchise that Tuna is restoring.

When Campo left, Dallas was one of the worst franchises in the NFL from a "pure football" standpoint. It's sad to all of us Cowboy fans

Ya know, if I really wanted to be a chop buster, I would point out that Parcells finished 10-6 with that depleted team....and has been 15-17 with his own players.

I'd be more inclined to agree with your assessment IF the past three years showed a steady progression. But 10-6...back to 6-10...then 9-7 with a 7-3 record prior to the collapse (2-4)...start, stop, start. Ready, FIRE, Aim.

Now, hanging Parcells in effigy might be overkill...but trumpeting his achievements is as well.

The truth is, it's still "jury out" on whether or not he's going to be able to turn things around. As the coach has said, "No matter what you have done in the past, sooner or later you have to prove you can still get the job done."

Potential is nice. We can see potential in some of the players on the roster. Sooner or later that potential has to turn into results.

25-24. It hasn't happened yet. Zero playoff wins.

And fact of the matter is, other franchises have turned completely around in the same three years that Parcells has been here. That's not to say that every situation is the same but it does suggest that it certainly IS possible to turn a franchise in quick order, especially in today's NFL.

It's "wait and see" and for anyone to suggest differently, either way, is simply not credible.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

Yeah, too bad that's lost on you.

 

[jksmith269]

Ya know, if I really wanted to be a chop buster, I would point out that Parcells finished 10-6 with that depleted team....and has been 15-17 with his own players.

I'd be more inclined to agree with your assessment IF the past three years showed a steady progression. But 10-6...back to 6-10...then 9-7 with a 7-3 record prior to the collapse (2-4)...start, stop, start. Ready, FIRE, Aim.

Now, hanging Parcells in effigy might be overkill...but trumpeting his achievements is as well.

The truth is, it's still "jury out" on whether or not he's going to be able to turn things around. As the coach has said, "No matter what you have done in the past, sooner or later you have to prove you can still get the job done."

Potential is nice. We can see potential in some of the players on the roster. Sooner or later that potential has to turn into results.

25-24. It hasn't happened yet. Zero playoff wins.

And fact of the matter is, other franchises have turned completely around in the same three years that Parcells has been here. That's not to say that every situation is the same but it does suggest that it certainly IS possible to turn a franchise in quick order, especially in today's NFL.

It's "wait and see" and for anyone to suggest differently, either way, is simply not credible.

10-6 with other coachs players and 15-17 with his own you say... Wasn't it reported that BP after 03 wanted to change the D then but because of the D's number 1 ranking decided if it's not broke don't fix it? and after the 04 seaosn last draft when he went strong on D with "his" type of players did everyone say BP was finally bringing in his type of players.

So I say 03-04 where both with what was left here and only this year did we see BP's type of players and team...

I don't agree with all the moves BP has made (VT) but most of the others I like I love our rookies we had this year best group in years but to say it's all be and the other years it was JJ or the coaches I think a lot has to do with the system players are drafted into and it's always a crap shoot and this year BP got Lucky now lets see how this next draft works before we start condeming him or placing him on a pedestal....

 

[Juke99]

10-6 with other coachs players and 15-17 with his own you say... Wasn't it reported that BP after 03 wanted to change the D then but because of the D's number 1 ranking decided if it's not broke don't fix it? and after the 04 seaosn last draft when he went strong on D with "his" type of players did everyone say BP was finally bringing in his type of players.

So I say 03-04 where both with what was left here and only this year did we see BP's type of players and team...

I don't agree with all the moves BP has made (VT) but most of the others I like I love our rookies we had this year best group in years but to say it's all be and the other years it was JJ or the coaches I think a lot has to do with the system players are drafted into and it's always a crap shoot and this year BP got Lucky now lets see how this next draft works before we start condeming him or placing him on a pedestal....

Oh trust me, I KNOW that the 2003 was not a 10-6 team....he did a great job with that team....I was simply trying to show that if I wanted to be a basher, for the sake of bashing, I could use that as a reference point.

I agree whole heartedly with your last paragraph.

It's "jury out".

But at some point, I really don't want to continue to read about 5-11, 5-11, 5-11...Campo... and what great potential our roster have.

Fact is, it's a results driven business.

 

[AbeBeta]

It is impossible to hit on 100% of all moves....

Most if not all of BP's bad moves have been injury related.

Rogers, Peterman, Rivera come to mind.

What? Since I get 100% of my information from this board, I have come to believe that any bad decision by a coach means that he should be fired.

You miss on a 2rd or 3rd rounder? Fired. You sign someone and they get injured? Fired. Bring on Jimmy already.

 

[CoCo]

Really. If you don't like people giving their opinion (and sometimes bit%$^#) then this isn't the place for you.

In fact, that is the purpose of the board to begin with.

I don't think that people get tired of others voicing a contrary opinion. Rather I think they (I) often tire of posters who get on a topic/opinion and beat it over and over and over as if posting whoever posts their opinion most makes it fact.

I don't think people get tired of a contrary opinion as much as how its delivered. When its overly definitive, as if its fact, and they display no openness to having their opinion modified by other valid and thoughtful posters, I think people get tired of that.

I think people get tired too of posters who present their opinions in a manner that shows no room or respect for a contrary viewpoint.

Just because this is a site for posting thought & opinion doesn't mean anything goes within those bounds. That's why the owner and moderators have rules. And just because someone's behavior is within the bounds of the rules doesn't mean it makes the board a better place.

I for one like to hear folks periodic opinions on what would make this a better board. I'm not sure why some interpret that as being contrary to the foundational purposes of a message board. Its not.

imo...

 

[chinch]

Ya know, if I really wanted to be a chop buster, I would point out that Parcells finished 10-6 with that depleted team....and has been 15-17 with his own players.

Please don't pretend they were anything but depleted & lacking in talent.

Before Tuna came the "pundits" said JJ could never get a "REAL COACH" cause he's a meddling owner and the franchise is dead. Tuna changed almost a decade of decay instantly.

He coached up QUINCY CARTER to 10 wins. Jerruh's golden arm, scrambling reach.

10-6 with overpaid old players (ie galloway, out of shape LA types) and an easy 5-11 schedule. WOODSON was perhaps our only exceptional player and regretfully he got hurt and retured (under Tuna). Get a perspective.

You think a healty #28 would get us a few wins last year and this? You should rethink your cherry-picking ANTI-TUNA stats and perhaps stop pretend ing like our talent level is not MUCH, MUCH, MUCH improved.

25-24 vs 15-33

You want harry houdini and to magically erase what lead us to 5-11, 5-11, 5-11

 

[kartr]

Ya know, if I really wanted to be a chop buster, I would point out that Parcells finished 10-6 with that depleted team....and has been 15-17 with his own players.

I'd be more inclined to agree with your assessment IF the past three years showed a steady progression. But 10-6...back to 6-10...then 9-7 with a 7-3 record prior to the collapse (2-4)...start, stop, start. Ready, FIRE, Aim.

Now, hanging Parcells in effigy might be overkill...but trumpeting his achievements is as well.

The truth is, it's still "jury out" on whether or not he's going to be able to turn things around. As the coach has said, "No matter what you have done in the past, sooner or later you have to prove you can still get the job done."

Potential is nice. We can see potential in some of the players on the roster. Sooner or later that potential has to turn into results.

25-24. It hasn't happened yet. Zero playoff wins.

And fact of the matter is, other franchises have turned completely around in the same three years that Parcells has been here. That's not to say that every situation is the same but it does suggest that it certainly IS possible to turn a franchise in quick order, especially in today's NFL.

It's "wait and see" and for anyone to suggest differently, either way, is simply not credible.

Good points all. Apparently logic is not a strong point of posters who think winning more with the players who were already here rather than the ones he brought in is not progress. Let's make it easy for them. Parcells is god and we posters know nothing at all about football and all the coaches who get fired every year while the GM's who hired them don't must understand something that we don't cause we're not professional football men.

 

[kartr]

******* and whining about talent brought in by Parcells.

I feel like I am surrounded by experts, and that some of you should work in the NFL. How else could you be so sure that Rivera wouldn't work out? How he was too old and injury prone. Or how the Tuna completly blew it when he drafted Rodgers, Johnson and Peterman.

Please ppl Parcells and his scouts have seen tons more footage on players he drafts and brings in as free agents than most anyone here.

Give this man some credit. He DOES have an eye for talent. How else do you explain him bringing in Henry when all the so called experts said he was below other db's, like Smoot, Rolle, Lucas ect. this offseason? Even people here were calling for us to sign Rolle or Lucas, Henry but an after thought.

Smoot signed a 6 year 34 million dollar contract Rolle 6yr for 30 million , Lucas 6yr for 36 million. Henry 5 for 25. It would be easy to argue when healthy, he outplayed them all.

How about hitting on JJ in the draft and picking up an extra 1st in the process? Drafting Witten, Crayton, Newman, Ware, Spears, Canty, Barber, James, Burnett, Polite, Peppers, Tyson, Ratliff, the list goes on. (14 players there)

Picking up free agents like, Henry, Glenn, Campbell, Bledsoe. (4)

Trading for Fujita and Keyshawn. (2)

A few players have yet to pan out and may never. Ferguson, Peterman, Rodgers, Henson, and Al Johnson. Maybe a couple will.

Bottom line he hits on players more than he misses. As much as we'd like him to be he isn't God. Realize that not every fa or draft pick will turn out to be a star, or good player for the matter. Doesn't matter how much we pay them or how high they were drafted. I wish ppl would be a little more positive around here. Bill has injected this team with alot of talent, young and old and this team will compete next year and for years to come.

Come free agency and draft time, I think you'll agree

I don't claim to be an expert, but I can read a scouting report as well as the next guy. When a scouting report gives the injury concern, I take it for granted that the scouts didn't just make it up. When the report says 'underachiever', I take it to heart to mean that the guy has potential, but hasn't lived up to it yet. When the coach brings in a qb who has been let go from his last two teams in favor of less experienced guys, it says to me he has lost objectivity in favor of his 'guys'. Bledsoe has had four or more bad games in the second half of the season for the last 4 years and will be 34 when the 2006 season starts and our quarterbacks of the future were drafted on day 2 or not at all.
The thinking that if Bledsoe doesn't work out and the backups too, then let's just go and get Brady Quinn next year as if he'll be readily available to us and on us is moronic, First off, he's only had one good season. Second of all, the 2006 draft will be better for qb's than 2007 and people want to wait next year to find a qb. It's just moronic to put all of your eggs in one basket and it doesn't matter who does it. If we don't get a qb this year for the future, it may be years before we get a good one.
This board is for an exchange of ideas, not the official rooting board for Cowboy homers. If you can't stand the heat.............

 

[Clove]

It's a sports board???? Multiple personalities with a passion for football, if you do not like different opinions you are on the wrong board.

You said it best. BP is paid to be better than average and that's what he's been.

1.To play a guard (Tucker) at tackle, and columbo's on the bench.
2.To play conservative, when you had Flozell, and barely win games.
3.To go thru the off season knowing that kicker was one of your needs.
4.To play injured players making their injuries worse.
5.To not even try to go for a score before half time when you have a minute left.
6.To not go for it on 4th and 1 in the deadskins game, yet throw the ball when the game is over.
7.To run a 4-3 in your 1st 2 years here when you know that's not your style of defense.
8.To play Vinny Testaverde when the season was over, yet your future (supposedly) was on the bench learning nothing.
9.To consistantly try to run the ball into a wall of nothing, when it's obvious you can't run, and they aren't letting you run.
10.To play the organization and the fans on thinking you may not come back.

Those are 10 reasons why I have issues with BP. And if you give me time, I could come up with 50 more. Other than that, I'm glad he's back for 1 more year.

 

[JonCJG]

I appreciate all opinions on the board and I wrote this post out of annoyance not anger. Just some of my own opinions.

I find it annoying every time Rivera is mentioned, someone knew he sucked, was a bad signing and that Parcells made a poor decision. I wish those same people would say the same thing every time they speak of Parcells better picks in fa and the draft.

Oh well. My main point was that Parcells has brought in alot of talent, not nessacerly super stars everytime, but good young talent. He gets the most out of most all his players. I am convinced that is why a player like Flozell Adams made his one and only Pro Bowl team under him. Why Bledsoe had a good year under him when most everyone thought he was done. BTW I don't know how Ron Mexico made the Pro Bowl over Drew.

I wish people would stop bashing Tuna and give him the benefit of the doubt. I believe this team is headed in the right direction and just need a few more pieces.

I said it before and will say it again, if we had a good kicker this year, (good not great) we'd had made it into the playoffs this year. Who know how far we could have gone.

 

[scottsp]

Oh trust me, I KNOW that the 2003 was not a 10-6 team....he did a great job with that team....I was simply trying to show that if I wanted to be a basher, for the sake of bashing, I could use that as a reference point.

I agree whole heartedly with your last paragraph.

It's "jury out".

But at some point, I really don't want to continue to read about 5-11, 5-11, 5-11...Campo... and what great potential our roster have.

Fact is, it's a results driven business.

Absolutely. It is "jury out." This doesn't come across as bashing at all. I think this is a fair and even keeled perspective.

There has been a definite upgrade in talent and that makes for exciting possibilities. At some point, those need to be realized. And there is no five-year plan in the NFL anymore.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I would give Bill a B+ for the talent he's brought in. I know he's not the "official" general manager but we all know he is.

And I would give him a B- for his coaching.

 

[silver]

I appreciate all opinions on the board and I wrote this post out of annoyance not anger. Just some of my own opinions.

I find it annoying every time Rivera is mentioned, someone knew he sucked, was a bad signing and that Parcells made a poor decision. I wish those same people would say the same thing every time they speak of Parcells better picks in fa and the draft.

Oh well. My main point was that Parcells has brought in alot of talent, not nessacerly super stars everytime, but good young talent. He gets the most out of most all his players. I am convinced that is why a player like Flozell Adams made his one and only Pro Bowl team under him. Why Bledsoe had a good year under him when most everyone thought he was done. BTW I don't know how Ron Mexico made the Pro Bowl over Drew.

I wish people would stop bashing Tuna and give him the benefit of the doubt. I believe this team is headed in the right direction and just need a few more pieces.

I said it before and will say it again, if we had a good kicker this year, (good not great) we'd had made it into the playoffs this year. Who know how far we could have gone.

i couldn't agree more

 

[Waffle]

I would give Bill a B+ for the talent he's brought in. I know he's not the "official" general manager but we all know he is.

And I would give him a B- for his coaching.

I think you've graded pretty fair, Michael.

(I'm sure your grades won't please all the extremists, but oh well. )

 

[GoCowboysGo]

Grading Parcells.

C+, for player personnel and for coaching. Being under .500 with your players gets you just that, a little under average.

My two cents.

 

[chinch]

I would give Bill a B+ for the talent he's brought in. I know he's not the "official" general manager but we all know he is.

And I would give him a B- for his coaching.

this is pretty fair.

 

[Mike 1967]

Is someone holding a gun to your head and making you read these other posters content ?

I could understand if you were complaining about bad language or pics.....but I have not sympathy for those who whine about the opinions of others.

And...having said that.....I'm not compaining about your whining. Have at it

 

[neosapien23]

******* and whining about talent brought in by Parcells.

I feel like I am surrounded by experts, and that some of you should work in the NFL. How else could you be so sure that Rivera wouldn't work out? How he was too old and injury prone. Or how the Tuna completly blew it when he drafted Rodgers, Johnson and Peterman.

Please ppl Parcells and his scouts have seen tons more footage on players he drafts and brings in as free agents than most anyone here.

Give this man some credit. He DOES have an eye for talent. How else do you explain him bringing in Henry when all the so called experts said he was below other db's, like Smoot, Rolle, Lucas ect. this offseason? Even people here were calling for us to sign Rolle or Lucas, Henry but an after thought.

Smoot signed a 6 year 34 million dollar contract Rolle 6yr for 30 million , Lucas 6yr for 36 million. Henry 5 for 25. It would be easy to argue when healthy, he outplayed them all.

How about hitting on JJ in the draft and picking up an extra 1st in the process? Drafting Witten, Crayton, Newman, Ware, Spears, Canty, Barber, James, Burnett, Polite, Peppers, Tyson, Ratliff, the list goes on. (14 players there)

Picking up free agents like, Henry, Glenn, Campbell, Bledsoe. (4)

Trading for Fujita and Keyshawn. (2)

A few players have yet to pan out and may never. Ferguson, Peterman, Rodgers, Henson, and Al Johnson. Maybe a couple will.

Bottom line he hits on players more than he misses. As much as we'd like him to be he isn't God. Realize that not every fa or draft pick will turn out to be a star, or good player for the matter. Doesn't matter how much we pay them or how high they were drafted. I wish ppl would be a little more positive around here. Bill has injected this team with alot of talent, young and old and this team will compete next year and for years to come.

Come free agency and draft time, I think you'll agree

Parcells has made some good choices, he's made some bad one's too. I'm tired of people saying Pracells is flawless. He is 50/50 which is hardly genius status, but he is no dummy either.