Tolbert = Cobb/Beasley

[TheMarathonContinues]

Mingo ? Show me how he replaces Tolbert or anyone else ??

He doesn’t. But they traded for him because they wanted to improve what’s behind Lamb.

 

[RonWashington]

He doesn’t. But they traded for him because they wanted to improve what’s behind Lamb.

I never said Tolbert was a 2 . Mingo about 5 on the chart these days .

 

[thunderpimp91]

Mingo ? Show me how he replaces Tolbert or anyone else ??

Mingo isnt very good, but that doesnt mean that Tolbert is much better. If we look at yards per route ran Mingo is horrible at just .55 yards per route. Brandin Cooks is .79. Jalen Brooks is .82. Tolbert is at .95 yards/RR. All of these guys are outside the top 140 WRs in the league at this stat and basically given us JAG production all year. An average #1WR is sitting around 2.5 Y/RR. An average #2 is around 1.75 Y/RR. An average #3 is around 1.5 Y/RR.

None of these guys should be in the starting lineup without winning a position battle in the summer. Outside of Lamb and Turpin the Cowboys WR counting stats have been strictly volume based production and not an indication of how good they are compared to the rest of the league.

 

[RonWashington]

Like I said earlier when a Cowboy is given reps ( Dowdle ) or targets ( Tolbert ) and they show progress make sure to saw the limb off the tree .

 

[ShiningStar]

Pump your breaks. Tolbert isn't a Cobb. He's not even a Terry Glenn RIP.

Terry was awesome, to bad we got him so late and he was still so good for us.

what a great reciever to have.

 

[quickccc]

42 catches 6 TD’s this year he’s never going to be the outside burner wasn’t drafted for that never was . He’s the outlet that can stretch the chains has become more and more reliable and has a knack for finding the end zone for his QB . Every club needs this type of receiver , the Randall Cobb / Cole Beasley type .

He’s only in yr 3 when his rookie yr went by with Dak hardly finding him .

Look forward for more development next yr the last yr of his rookie contract . Very nice TD grab back of the end zone feet in bounds tonight .

Beasley ? Cobb?

Tolbert is rarely in the slot, how is that ?

I don't think he is even Cedrick Wilson 2.0 ( terrific run after catch, punt returner)

i can say it seems like he has a knack for the red zone in tight corners.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Like I said earlier when a Cowboy is given reps ( Dowdle ) or targets ( Tolbert ) and they show progress make sure to saw the limb off the tree .

Dowdle is a completely different conversation, his metrics are very good. The Tolbert issue is that any wr in the league would put up similar numbers given that many snaps. Tolbert can make plays but the rate in which he makes plays is very low for a starting caliber receiver.

 

[ShiningStar]

Dowdle is a completely different conversation, his metrics are very good. The Tolbert issue is that any wr in the league would put up similar numbers given that many snaps. Tolbert can make plays but the rate in which he makes plays is very low for a starting caliber receiver.

to be fair, our offensive coach is afraid of the red zone.

we dont really know what Tolbert is right now because i dont feel hes being used or evaluated correctly.

I think the offensive coach doesnt do any of our offensive players any justice and looks at them as if to say "why cant you score touch downs" hes not collaborating the use of thier skills to show what offensive we have, he seems to be bottle necking them to do what he thinks is best.

thats not fair to a player.

 

[thunderpimp91]

to be fair, our offensive coach is afraid of the red zone.

we dont really know what Tolbert is right now because i dont feel hes being used or evaluated correctly.

I think the offensive coach doesnt do any of our offensive players any justice and looks at them as if to say "why cant you score touch downs" hes not collaborating the use of thier skills to show what offensive we have, he seems to be bottle necking them to do what he thinks is best.

thats not fair to a player.

How do you want them to use Tolbert differently?

 

[ShiningStar]

How do you want them to use Tolbert differently?

find out if he can stretch the field or not, give him the throws and plays that suit his skills, talents or whatever you want to label them, than throw the ball to where he wins most of his match ups.

find out if he can separate, run quick or fast, if he can fight for the ball. Lots of things to find out, this is why it irks me that if we are to have a new HC, this is time and info they would need.

 

[thunderpimp91]

find out if he can stretch the field or not, give him the throws and plays that suit his skills, talents or whatever you want to label them, than throw the ball to where he wins most of his match ups.

find out if he can separate, run quick or fast, if he can fight for the ball. Lots of things to find out, this is why it irks me that if we are to have a new HC, this is time and info they would need.

I'm very open to hearing arguments on how he can be utilized better, but this answer just doesn't seem to make any sense IMO. To me the Cowboys offense might be on of the better fits in the league. Its clear that he does his best work running north / south routes which the Cowboys utilize at a higher rate than most in the NFL.

Hes 31st in the entire league in attempts to him of 20 yards or more. We have an excellent sample size on his ability to stretch the field and his ability work back to the ball. We also see that he is inconsistent in fighting for the ball when he isnt working his way back to the QB. Hes been allowed to run over 500 routes so far this year, which is something like 15th most in the entire league, and they've mixed it up quite a bit. Hes ran outside, hes ran from the slot, hes been put in motion, hes been tight to the formation and worked out, hes lined up wide and worked in. Anyone that goes back and watches just his targets from this season will instantly be able to tell what his strengths and weaknesses are.

There may be some other ways to utilize him, I have my opinion, but I can't say for sure. I really struggle with the idea that the Cowboys are not getting info on tape of the guy. Tolbert has had an excellent opportunity this year to maximize his playing time do to injuries and an overall weak WR room in Dallas. Both the tape he has put out in addition to the numbers seem to indicate he is more of depth/rotational guy at this point in his career who needs to either be able to play those 50/50 balls at a higher rate to make that an above average skill or needs to improve his side to side route tree to keep defenses more honest in how they play him.

 

[ShiningStar]

I'm very open to hearing arguments on how he can be utilized better, but this answer just doesn't seem to make any sense IMO. To me the Cowboys offense might be on of the better fits in the league. Its clear that he does his best work running north / south routes which the Cowboys utilize at a higher rate than most in the NFL.

Hes 31st in the entire league in attempts to him of 20 yards or more. We have an excellent sample size on his ability to stretch the field and his ability work back to the ball. We also see that he is inconsistent in fighting for the ball when he isnt working his way back to the QB. Hes been allowed to run over 500 routes so far this year, which is something like 15th most in the entire league, and they've mixed it up quite a bit. Hes ran outside, hes ran from the slot, hes been put in motion, hes been tight to the formation and worked out, hes lined up wide and worked in. Anyone that goes back and watches just his targets from this season will instantly be able to tell what his strengths and weaknesses are.

There may be some other ways to utilize him, I have my opinion, but I can't say for sure. I really struggle with the idea that the Cowboys are not getting info on tape of the guy. Tolbert has had an excellent opportunity this year to maximize his playing time do to injuries and an overall weak WR room in Dallas. Both the tape he has put out in addition to the numbers seem to indicate he is more of depth/rotational guy at this point in his career who needs to either be able to play those 50/50 balls at a higher rate to make that an above average skill or needs to improve his side to side route tree to keep defenses more honest in how they play him.

if thats true and im not saying you are wrong, than next year he has to be replaced.

I dont know why Dallas wants to hang on to players that seem to give them nothing but the bare min. But again, i dont know how much is the OC, WR coach, or just flat out talent. But for Dallas, they do hold on to guys who offer nothing at times. Some times they dont utlize, but again coaches are also in play and none have really shown me much this season.

im sorry but the basic should be "your offense has to go as your QB and we dont know anything this year because of age and how much Dak might have diminshed, but this year was a down year across the boards and it was mostly designed taht way, so im willing to give some players the benefit, but the coaches have got to be looked at.

again waste of time.

i want to get into the specs of all this. i want to know what coach was wasting time and besides MM, who takes orders from JJ, and lets leave that to the side, where does MM stand in all this, looking at the finished product and saying "yea, that mess was successful"

 

[RonWashington]

to be fair, our offensive coach is afraid of the red zone.

we dont really know what Tolbert is right now because i dont feel hes being used or evaluated correctly.

I think the offensive coach doesnt do any of our offensive players any justice and looks at them as if to say "why cant you score touch downs" hes not collaborating the use of thier skills to show what offensive we have, he seems to be bottle necking them to do what he thinks is best.

thats not fair to a player.

Excellent post . If MM were to come back the 82 yr old GM should insist on an OC calling plays . If that’s a deal breaker , good bye.

Luke Schoon a 6’6” TE not a red zone threat is a horrible use of roster . Heck target Spann Ford in the red zone . Flournoy missing in action like Tolbert his rookie year has been wasted

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I never said Tolbert was a 2 . Mingo about 5 on the chart these days .

Mingo is not very good either.

 

[RonWashington]

Mingo is not very good either.

Invisible . Shocking how little he’s done .

 

[Mannix]

-------Schoonmacher is 6’6” can be effective downfield TE

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Invisible . Shocking how little he’s done .

I hope it was a trade for potential because he’s so raw he’s never going to get playing time but Lamb is out hopefully he can show a pulse.

 

[ShiningStar]

I hope it was a trade for potential because he’s so raw he’s never going to get playing time but Lamb is out hopefully he can show a pulse.

im hoping he shows something next year, but again, JJ aside, the next coach is already behind schedule.

 

[Chasing6]

I see dump offs to 87 not necessarily designed pass plays downfield . Why ? Schoon was on a 2 or 3 game run where he was actually a threat past the sticks . Again are the TE’s being used to full capacity ?

Not if they are being asked block first and then drop into the flat for a 2 yard pass.