Turn the Running game over to TChoice

[superonyx]

I absolutely have no problem with this. I have repeatedly stated that Choice is the best bonafide Hb we have. Barber and Felix have special qualities, but Choice is the better runner. He showed he could be a 20 + carry guy. I'd give him the job tomorrow. Barber should be traded for 5th or 6th and start Choice and give Felix 11,12 great plays.

So what makes choice a better "bonafide" hb than Felix? Because in every category Felix has exceeded anything choice has done. In fact search the post on this forum from this season and you will see threads with post showing Felix has broken more tackles and has given up less sacks and ran between the tackles better than choice. And again I am not saying choice is bad. But why keep saying something that production has shown to be false.

Maybe you have some inside knowledge of choice that we and the cowboys staff doesn't have.

 

[Cowboys2008]

Personally I'm done with the notion that Felix can be anything consistent for us. So I say give Choice the chance. If not now, then when? We've got nothing to lose at this point by trying him out as the main guy, and only heart to possibly gain. Quit trying to not hurt peoples feelings when this guy absolutely wants to be out on that field! Which I'm not sure can honestly be said about the other 2. Though, I get the sense from what I'm seeing that Barber is actually trying to at least regain his previous form before the injury. Felix just looks lost out there though, imo.

 

[AdamJT13]

Choice career, 164 attempts 842 yards 5 TD's (long of 66) and a 5.1 average.

Felix career: 214 attempts, 1,237 yards, 6 rushing TDs (long of 60) and a 5.8 average.

Only two running backs in the past 50 years have had a higher average per carry with more than 200 attempts in their first three seasons.

Felix should be starting, Choice should be backing him up, and Barber should be used only for pass protection and short yardage (as long as he has more short-yardage plays like he's had for most of the season and not like the two before halftime Sunday).

 

[GOLDENCHILD1688]

barber more the likely wont e here next year.

bench him and let choice get his carries and see what e can do. he already showed flashes. the guy can play

 

[RoyTheHammer]

I just don't know why you don't evaluate everyone in every role you possibly can at this point. Use this failure of a season to see what you've got, there's no risk involved.

This.

Felix and Barber especially arn't doing anything right now. There's no reason not to give Choice 10+ touches a game for the rest of the season and see what we have in him. I'd sit Barber for the rest of the season and then cut him. I used to love the guy, but he just hasn't had it after the injury at the beginning of last season. Its a shame, but Choice needs a chance to show what he can do. He couldn't do any worse i know that.

 

[Clove]

What's going on around here? 3 weeks ago, everyone hated Choice for some strange reason. We're all confused I guess.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

What's going on around here? 3 weeks ago, everyone hated Choice for some strange reason. We're all confused I guess.

I did notice alot of that myself. Alot of people saying "oh choice is the 3rd back for a reason. he's not good enough to get on the field." That was a bunch of bs imo. Everytime he's seen the field and gotten some consistent reps he's done well. He's more talented than Barber at this point i can't see him doing worse. He plays with passion and always seems to turn nothing into at least a few yards.. which is something we could desperately use right now with our OL.

 

[odog422]

The legend of Choice continues. Choice has never had a 100 yard rushing game in his pro career. His college stats are no better than barbers. He didn't look like a franchise back against the steelers. And if he did it was just one game. And Please give us some examples of Jerry being obessed with measurables. Why is it so difficult for people to understand that choice isn't the victim of some conspiracy.

And I would love to see choice run the ball more. In fact I'd like to see him featured in a few games. I want to know what we have. But I am not assuming he is a franchise back because he rushed for less than 100 yards against the steelers a few years ago.

Barber's college stats - 3 years ('01-'03) - 2,007 yards rushing, 5.8 avg.; Choice's college stats - 3 years ('05-'07) - 3,365 yards rushing, 5.0 avg.

They are not the same back. Choice is better.

No, Choice didn't break 100 against Pittsburgh, but if you watched not only that game, but the THREE games against the the three best run defenses in the NFL that year - and we were not trotting out an All Pro line either - he ran successfully. In fact, most who watched wondered why we didn't run more with him. Well...actually, that's what we do, get away from the run when it works, but I digress. But he very well could have had a 100 in that game.

And did he look like a franchise back or didn't he? You say he didn't but then you say "and if he did..."

People are not suggesting a "conspiracy," or some such high drama. People are simply saying, with this staff, what you do on the field really doesn't seem to matter. That even if you perform, unless their hand is forced by Jerry or injury, this staff will not make a change and reward performance with more playing time. And especially now, with nothing to play for, why not make the change?

You say you want to see Choice run more as well, so I don't get why you feel the need to suggest everyone else who feels the same is suggesting legendary status for Choice or conspiracy theory.

Strange.

 

[dbair1967]

Barber's college stats - 3 years ('01-'03) - 2,007 yards rushing, 5.8 avg.; Choice's college stats - 3 years ('05-'07) - 3,365 yards rushing, 5.0 avg.

They are not the same back. Choice is better.

No, Choice didn't break 100 against Pittsburgh, but if you watched not only that game, but the THREE games against the the three best run defenses in the NFL that year - and we were not trotting out an All Pro line either - he ran successfully. In fact, most who watched wondered why we didn't run more with him. Well...actually, that's what we do, get away from the run when it works, but I digress. But he very well could have had a 100 in that game.

And did he look like a franchise back or didn't he? You say he didn't but then you say "and if he did..."

People are not suggesting a "conspiracy," or some such high drama. People are simply saying, with this staff, what you do on the field really doesn't seem to matter. That even if you perform, unless their hand is forced by Jerry or injury, this staff will not make a change and reward performance with more playing time. And especially now, with nothing to play for, why not make the change?

You say you want to see Choice run more as well, so I don't get why you feel the need to suggest everyone else who feels the same is suggesting legendary status for Choice or conspiracy theory.

Strange.

The OL peformed much better in 2008 than it is this year, nobody can really dispute that. Davis was still playing extremely well, Colombo wasnt a liability, Adams was still a probowl claibar LT and Gurode was one of the top 3 centers in the league.

That said, Choice did run well for a short period of time at the end of 2008. Doesnt mean he's franchise calibar RB. Timmy Smith would be in the hall of fame if people based opinions of their ability on a very small sampling. Troy Hambrick once ran for almost 200 yds in a game. As Emmitt's backup people couldnt wait to see him take over fulltime for the eventual hall of famer, and once he did people saw all the holes in his game and that he wasnt half the player Emmitt was.

Choice should be getting Barber's reps, but all this non sense of thinking that if he replaces Jones as a starter and gets most of the carries the run game will be magically transformed is a joke. The run game isnt going to change with him in there.

 

[superonyx]

Barber's college stats - 3 years ('01-'03) - 2,007 yards rushing, 5.8 avg.; Choice's college stats - 3 years ('05-'07) - 3,365 yards rushing, 5.0 avg.

They are not the same back. Choice is better.

No, Choice didn't break 100 against Pittsburgh, but if you watched not only that game, but the THREE games against the the three best run defenses in the NFL that year - and we were not trotting out an All Pro line either - he ran successfully. In fact, most who watched wondered why we didn't run more with him. Well...actually, that's what we do, get away from the run when it works, but I digress. But he very well could have had a 100 in that game.

And did he look like a franchise back or didn't he? You say he didn't but then you say "and if he did..."

People are not suggesting a "conspiracy," or some such high drama. People are simply saying, with this staff, what you do on the field really doesn't seem to matter. That even if you perform, unless their hand is forced by Jerry or injury, this staff will not make a change and reward performance with more playing time. And especially now, with nothing to play for, why not make the change?

You say you want to see Choice run more as well, so I don't get why you feel the need to suggest everyone else who feels the same is suggesting legendary status for Choice or conspiracy theory.

Strange.

You seem to have trouble putting things in proper context.

Our season is a loss at this point. The reason i have no trouble with using Choice at this point is the same reason I would have no trouble using back ups on the offensive line. Because at this point winning lost its meaning. Is that so difficult to understand.

This Choice playing ballriding agenda didnt just start when we lost our season. It has been going on since the offseason. I see you didnt just join the board so you should know this. Or did you just stop reading the board until our season was totally lost.

Strange.

As far as college stats go. You may take total yards from Choice and say it means he was better than barber. Yet he had almost a yard less per carry......hmmm.... And logical reason you dont do that for their pro production? Strange.... So if you are basing who is better on total rushing yards and completely ignoring yards per carry then here is a stat you have to use:

Barber 4181 yards
Choice 842 yards

See how goofy you sound?

btw... against PITT when he seemed to gain this cult following he got 23 carries to get his 88 yards. Its kind of hard to say he didnt get 100 yards because we just stopped running. Is 23 carries not enough?

And yes people around here like to fall in love with backups and bash the owner, the staff, coaches, ect on why their favorite backup isnt playing. Its happened before and it will again.
We have 3 running backs averaging less than 3 yards per carry. That has ZERO to do with the running backs and everything to do with the line. It really doesnt matter how a back plays from here on out. Our line is the worst in the league by far. They are lazy and weak. They get zero push.

But again. I would also like to see Choice get some carries. I would like to see Mcgee get some throws. I would like to see Hurd get some catches.
And if that confuses you so much then i am sorry and their really isnt much I can do to help you.

oh yea... did he look like a franchise back 2 years ago? To me he didnt. I want more than 88 yards on 23 carries from my franchise back. Did he look acceptable and competent? Sure did.
Unlike some on here I have been around the game long enough to not even think of a 3rd RB being called franchise back after such a short period of time with such limited production.

Sorry that seems strange to you.

 

[tupperware]

Let's just try to enjoy the rest of the season with family and friends. No need for us to question every single thing we may think. Some people are entitled to their opinion even if you think it may seem silly.

 

[superonyx]

Let's just try to enjoy the rest of the season with family and friends. No need for us to question every single thing we may think. Some people are entitled to their opinion even if you think it may seem silly.

Almost.... Its enjoy your family and friends... Not enjoy the season with your family and friends. Your family and many of your friends could care less. (unless you actually think people on this board are your friends, you dont do you?).....

I see I left a scar...:

 

[odog422]

The OL peformed much better in 2008 than it is this year, nobody can really dispute that. Davis was still playing extremely well, Colombo wasnt a liability, Adams was still a probowl claibar LT and Gurode was one of the top 3 centers in the league.

That said, Choice did run well for a short period of time at the end of 2008. Doesnt mean he's franchise calibar RB. Timmy Smith would be in the hall of fame if people based opinions of their ability on a very small sampling. Troy Hambrick once ran for almost 200 yds in a game. As Emmitt's backup people couldnt wait to see him take over fulltime for the eventual hall of famer, and once he did people saw all the holes in his game and that he wasnt half the player Emmitt was.

Choice should be getting Barber's reps, but all this non sense of thinking that if he replaces Jones as a starter and gets most of the carries the run game will be magically transformed is a joke. The run game isnt going to change with him in there.

Saying the line was performing better than it is now is not saying much at all. That said, at the time, Kosier was hurt and the line was in flux. They were not playing at Pro Bowl caliber level, absolutely not.

I never said he was a franchise back. My point was he played well enough to merit more playing time and that playing time in Dallas with this staff isn't determined by what you do on the field, more often than not. The fact that right now our blocking is so bad that Barber is completely ineffective yet Choice still gets no opportunities, even after producing previously against the top 3 run defenses in the NFL at the time, is what is absurd.

 

[Smith22]

Tashard is one of those players who gets better and better in the fans eyes the more he doesn't play. If we can just keep him on the sidelines for another 3-4 weeks, he'll be the next Bo Jackson. Let's not needlessly expose him.

yeah, we are much better off leaving him on the bench while Barber continues to start.......... We know what we have in Barber, how about we at least try and find out what we have in Choice.

 

[Goldenrichards83]

Saying the line was performing better than it is now is not saying much at all. That said, at the time, Kosier was hurt and the line was in flux. They were not playing at Pro Bowl caliber level, absolutely not.

I never said he was a franchise back. My point was he played well enough to merit more playing time and that playing time in Dallas with this staff isn't determined by what you do on the field, more often than not. The fact that right now our blocking is so bad that Barber is completely ineffective yet Choice still gets no opportunities, even after producing previously against the top 3 run defenses in the NFL at the time, is what is absurd.

 

[Aikmaniac]

I never thought I'd say this, but Barber is done. I agree with the majority that think Jones and Choice should be the rotation. MB III might do well as a closer again, but when will we need a closer this year?

 

[odog422]

You seem to have trouble putting things in proper context.

Our season is a loss at this point. The reason i have no trouble with using Choice at this point is the same reason I would have no trouble using back ups on the offensive line. Because at this point winning lost its meaning. Is that so difficult to understand.

This Choice playing ballriding agenda didnt just start when we lost our season. It has been going on since the offseason. I see you didnt just join the board so you should know this. Or did you just stop reading the board until our season was totally lost.

I understand context fine. I was addressing your characterization of support for Choice. So what is it I'm missing in addition to that? That you never wanted Choice to play previously? Is that it? That you don't want him on the team? Or is it that you think he's overrated since you talk about "ballriding agenda?" Sounds personal to me, although you have the right to not like our players.

You're right in that I didn't just join the board and many have thought Choice deserved carries after producing the way he did against the top 3 run defenses in the NFL at the end of 2008, not just this offseason. So what's your point?

As far as college stats go. You may take total yards from Choice and say it means he was better than barber. Yet he had almost a yard less per carry......hmmm.... And logical reason you dont do that for their pro production? Strange.... So if you are basing who is better on total rushing yards and completely ignoring yards per carry then here is a stat you have to use:

Barber 4181 yards
Choice 842 yards

See how goofy you sound?

Actually, you made the college comparison and when I posted that Choice had over 1300 yards more you now go to the pro stats. Argue what you want but know your facts. Their production was not the same as you stated.

Whose goofy when you're comparing Barber's stats as a pro and starter to Choice's as a backup, especially when Barber's been in the league longer?

btw... against PITT when he seemed to gain this cult following he got 23 carries to get his 88 yards. Its kind of hard to say he didnt get 100 yards because we just stopped running. Is 23 carries not enough?

Apparently it wasn't. How hard to grasp is that? It was more yards than what Pitt was giving up per carry and per game on the year, however. But to be even more clear, it was what he did against the top 3 run defenses in the NFL that garnered the idea that he should get more opportunities. And since when did liking a player get translated into "cult" following status? It's a Cowboys site we're on and people like different players more than others. Just because you don't others are somehow demented in their thinking?

And yes people around here like to fall in love with backups and bash the owner, the staff, coaches, ect on why their favorite backup isnt playing. Its happened before and it will again.

Exactly. So if you know that's what happens here, why are you so aggravated about it?

We have 3 running backs averaging less than 3 yards per carry. That has ZERO to do with the running backs and everything to do with the line. It really doesnt matter how a back plays from here on out. Our line is the worst in the league by far. They are lazy and weak. They get zero push.

So remind me again why the need to rant against someone who wants Choice to get some opps?

But again. I would also like to see Choice get some carries. I would like to see Mcgee get some throws. I would like to see Hurd get some catches.
And if that confuses you so much then i am sorry and their really isnt much I can do to help you.

You're repeating yourself and I'm not confused, except for your reference to context. But I said that already.

oh yea... did he look like a franchise back 2 years ago? To me he didnt.

That's not what you said originally. You said, "if he did, it was for only one game." So, whose confused?

I want more than 88 yards on 23 carries from my franchise back. Did he look acceptable and competent? Sure did.
Unlike some on here I have been around the game long enough to not even think of a 3rd RB being called franchise back after such a short period of time with such limited production.

Sorry that seems strange to you.

I never called him a franchise back, the poster you responded to previously did. So again, it seems you are the one who is confused.

 

[Bleu Star]

Yea let's put him in their so we don't have to spend the rest of the season and offseason reading this same post over and over again. It's only been the 387th play choice post. We can watch him get hit in the backfield and break no tackles like he did last year....... Oh wait a minute.... He broke that 1 tackle all of last year. Bring him in Wade.

Tashard is one of those players who gets better and better in the fans eyes the more he doesn't play. If we can just keep him on the sidelines for another 3-4 weeks, he'll be the next Bo Jackson. Let's not needlessly expose him.

I see the same usual suspects over and over again when there is any mention of Choice... Why do you guys dislike Choice so much?

Can you both really type with straight faces that you don't think Choice is talented enough to have a chance to carry the load?

 

[Stautner]

In fact search the post on this forum from this season and you will see threads with post showing Felix has broken more tackles and has given up less sacks and ran between the tackles better than choice. And again I am not saying choice is bad. But why keep saying something that production has shown to be false.

Maybe you have some inside knowledge of choice that we and the cowboys staff doesn't have.

This actually made me laugh out loud. You're "proof" is the thoughts of what some people post on here? You've got to be kidding, right?

You say you want to see Choice run more as well, so I don't get why you feel the need to suggest everyone else who feels the same is suggesting legendary status for Choice or conspiracy theory.

Strange.

It's the standard respionse for some. If you disagree with them they dramatically overexaggerate your words to make them sound ridiculous rather than logically respond to the words as they are and as they were intended.

 

[superonyx]

This actually made me laugh out loud. You're "proof" is the thoughts of what some people post on here? You've got to be kidding, right?

Actual the "proof" as you call it wasnt an opinion of one of the posters on this board. It was a link to a statistical analysis of all the runningbacks production in every situation and how effective each were..

You see what happens when you assume?

But i am sure you are used to that.

Dont let the facts get in the way of illogical thinking.