What happens if the new HC reverts to the 4-3?

[AbeBeta]

Ever heard of a guy named Jason Taylor?

Ever heard of nearly every other DE in the league? Yes, there are small DEs in the league - but they are the exception to the norm.

 

[dbair1967]

Ware is not an ideal player for a 4-3. And you don't want to take your best defender and put him in a spot he doesn't fit

fyi...its what he did in college

its also what he does when we go to a 4 man line in nickel defenses here

David

 

[dbair1967]

Ever heard of nearly every other DE in the league? Yes, there are small DEs in the league - but they are the exception to the norm.

really? care to name them all?

it isnt that big of an exception

and Ware isnt that small

David

 

[AbeBeta]

really? care to name them all?

it isnt that big of an exception

and Ware isnt that small

David

How about this one. Name all of the 3-4 OLB who spent their first year learning OLB then moved to DE in a 4-3.

 

[AbeBeta]

fyi...its what he did in college

its also what he does when we go to a 4 man line in nickel defenses here

David

FYI -- he played college ball at a small college against mediocre competition. he could have been 220 and been successful at DE there.

 

[SupermanXx]

hahah, you think our DL would be "very doable"

 

[junk]

How about this one. Name all of the 3-4 OLB who spent their first year learning OLB then moved to DE in a 4-3.

How about Terrell Suggs? Weighs 260....a whopping 3 pounds greater than Ware. Has switched back and forth between schemes.

Ever heard of nearly every other DE in the league? Yes, there are small DEs in the league - but they are the exception to the norm.

Taylor (from Akron....not exactly a power house) - 255

Suggs - 260

Schoebel - 262

Freeney - 268

McCray - 261

B. Thomas - 266

Derrick Burgess - 260

Simeon Rice - 268

Leonard Little - 263

Kiwi - 265

KGB - 250

Bears ends - Ogunleye, Brown and Anderson - 258-260

John Abraham - 256

Osi Umenyiora - 261.....and he is from Troy! What?! A 4-3 defensive end from Troy? I didn't think that was possible.

Those guys are all in Ware's weight range and all play 4-3 defensive end (except Suggs....who has played both as pointed out above).

Feel free to admit you were wrong and really had no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

noone's moving to the 3-4

sorry 4-3 guys

 

[rw54]

If Jason Ferguson went down, wouldn't we be forced to go to the 4-3. I hope the next DC or HC will be flexible enough to go with what works. I also think our current 3-4 inside Lbers are pretty poor in pass coverage and if we stay with that scheme we have to get better there or we will see December all year long.

 

[Billy Bullocks]

If Jason Ferguson went down, wouldn't we be forced to go to the 4-3. I hope the next DC or HC will be flexible enough to go with what works. I also think our current 3-4 inside Lbers are pretty poor in pass coverage and if we stay with that scheme we have to get better there or we will see December all year long.

Probably. But we need him for the 4-3 too. The difference in the 2 basically rests in having 3 real big guys (290+ lbs) in the enterior and then 2 outside guys who are in the 250 range. In the 4-3, as some other posters have mentioned, you have guys who way 250-260 who might bookend one or both end spots, but you still have a NT and a DT. The nose still needs to absorb double teams on the inside.

Though the makeup of the players is a bit different, it's pretty much a similar idea. Pro Set defense you could say.

 

[blindzebra]

Haley Shmaley. That a different era -- Haley retired from the Cowboys in 1996.

What's your next argument, Bob Lilly? Should we move Ware to DT?

Rice, Taylor or Freeney ring a bell? I believe they are in this era.

 

[CowboyJeff]

Ware is not an ideal player for a 4-3. And you don't want to take your best defender and put him in a spot he doesn't fit

Remember when people said Dwight Freeney was too light to be a 4-3 DE as well?

 

[AbeBeta]

How about Terrell Suggs? Weighs 260....a whopping 3 pounds greater than Ware. Has switched back and forth between schemes.

Feel free to admit you were wrong and really had no idea what you are talking about.

Obviously Ware is at about the lowest weight guys CAN be successful at DE. Playing against him in a big way is that he hasn't learned that position at the pro-level. How many of these guys started as 3-4 OLBs then moved to DE? A guy like Osi who is an obvious comparison took two full years to become dominant (and he was mediocre last year after missing 5 games). Same for O-gun (also has his share of missed games), Abraham was good soon but is always hurt, Kiwi's 4 sacks aren't anything to crow about, Taylor is awesome but it took him 3 years to become consistently dominant. What I see is a) it take time to get good - not for all of them but for most -- Osi and Taylor are pretty good comparisons and b) some of these guys get hurt more than seems normal.

I'm sure Ware could eventually be good as a DE. But he's on the verge of being a GREAT OLB - OLB is clearly the position that suits him best.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

After listening to Talkin' Cowboys on DallasCowboys.com I would have to agree the defense is better suited for the 4-3. Ware would be a terror at DE!

 

[junk]

Obviously Ware is at about the lowest weight guys CAN be successful at DE. Playing against him in a big way is that he hasn't learned that position at the pro-level. How many of these guys started as 3-4 OLBs then moved to DE? A guy like Osi who is an obvious comparison took two full years to become dominant (and he was mediocre last year after missing 5 games). Same for O-gun (also has his share of missed games), Abraham was good soon but is always hurt, Kiwi's 4 sacks aren't anything to crow about, Taylor is awesome but it took him 3 years to become consistently dominant. What I see is a) it take time to get good - not for all of them but for most -- Osi and Taylor are pretty good comparisons and b) some of these guys get hurt more than seems normal.

I'm sure Ware could eventually be good as a DE. But he's on the verge of being a GREAT OLB - OLB is clearly the position that suits him best.

Ware isn't going to get lighter as he ages.

I know Parcells made some comment about Ware not being able to go against offensive tackles all the time, but who blocks him when he plays OLB. Uh, offensive tackles.

Really, there isn't much difference between standing up and putting your hand on the ground. Who is to say that what he has been learning at OLB couldn't be applied to DE? Same principles. He played hand on the ground DE for nickel snaps already.

To answer your question, Suggs started as an OLB and moved to DE. He later moved back to OLB.

This has gone a long way from no one does it to a discussion about quite a few players.