What is this team lacking?

[OmerV]

Okay...it's hard to keep track of all the back and retracking from people.
The offense doesn't just score points. Ball control and top are crucial. You criticized the d for 33 points.....but how many 3 and outs? What was top? You can't just throw points around.
I say 2016 was a model for success. So good a rookie could do it. I'm not sure how good the defense really was. And the offense wasn't dynamite and fireworks. But we did know how to control the game through the offense..

Does that mean we can exactly replicate it? Probably not....but we can use that as a model.

But look at the point you made - the 2016 defense was not very good, so the offense had to use ball control to help cover for a bad defense. In other words, the defense was the problem on that team, not the offense.

It seems a bit odd to blame the offense for losses because it didn't do enough to cover for a bad defense, don't you think?

As for the 2016 model, obviously the team didn't load up on standout receivers to plod along. On the other hand, the top receiver on that 2016 team was a possession receiver (Beasley). And the reality is we don't have the same level of offensive line to control the game with anyway, and the running game has sucked during the recent string of losses, and that's a big blow to the ability to just slow the game down and control the clock.

In any case, even if you blame losses on not using the 2016 model, how is that Dak's fault? It certainly doesn't mean he isn't playing well. It means the offensive approach and offensive personnel is different. Dak may be able to cover for a bad running game or a bad defense, but it's a lot to expect him to cover for both.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

In your opinion , is the quarterback. Is it the defense backfield . Is it that we don’t have a great offensive line . Is it the head coach. Is it the defensive line. Is it the linebackers.

Leadership and direction.
Micah and Rowdy need to step up and take charge.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

But look at the point you made - the 2016 defense was not very good, so the offense had to use ball control to help cover for a bad defense. In other words, the defense was the problem on that team, not the offense.

It seems a bit odd to blame the offense for losses because it didn't do enough to cover for a bad defense, don't you think?

As for the 2016 model, obviously the team didn't load up on standout receivers to plod along. On the other hand, the top receiver on that 2016 team was a possession receiver (Beasley). And the reality is we don't have the same level of offensive line to control the game with anyway, and the running game has sucked during the recent string of losses, and that's a big blow to the ability to just slow the game down and control the clock.

In any case, even if you blame losses on not using the 2016 model, how is that Dak's fault? It certainly doesn't mean he isn't playing well. It means the offensive approach and offensive personnel is different. Dak may be able to cover for a bad running game or a bad defense, but it's a lot to expect him to cover for both.

We might be arguing different things here. But you do seem to have a drive to protect dak.

You are right...thus isn't 2016. Dak has been proclaimed the big money leader. Not just for butt slaps....but in charge of sustained drives, ball control, and yes scoring points. Are we to blame wr#5 instead? Dak is the defacto, assumed, and paid leader.....he is obligated to help solve any problem not be absolved of them.

I am not blaming just the offense, or even just dak. If you recall....I objected to you casually throwing around the 33 points given up be defense. A complelty meaningless Stat without context...which you refuse to supply. The offense could easily contribute to those points through turnovers and 3 and outs.

I won't let you subtly change my narrative to confuse my point.

 

[Coogiguy03]

A BETTER RUNNING BACK!!!!!!!!! Which is why we have to pass so much, get rid of 21 watch how this offense chews up yards

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Got it. Scoring points fast is a sign of a bad offense, and allowing the other team to score points is a sign of a bad offense.

I'll note that the defense gave up half the Raiders' points in the first 15 minutes of the game on Thursday. The defense being tired because of TOP was not the issue.

I didn't say that. But...are we scoring points fast?

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Meant to type rewatched. Auto correct changed it

All good ....I don't ding for grammar or the silly auto correct that makes it worse.

 

[slick325]

The right culture. One that doesn't allow them to live off of the legacy of former HOF players and championship teams just because you currently wear the star. Starts from the Jones family. The entitlement is sickening. Stop believing your press clippings, the Triplets are not in your locker room.

 

[Gorgon]

In your opinion , is the quarterback. Is it the defense backfield . Is it that we don’t have a great offensive line . Is it the head coach. Is it the defensive line. Is it the linebackers.

Two areas stand out: First, it's still too tough to run inside the 20, meaning our OL needs to get a lot better. I still think Zeke is a 1,500 yard back, at least, but we need much more consistent OL play. Second, we have real holes in the middle, whether it's the MLB or safety positions. Still too easy to run up the gut.

 

[Beast_from_East]

We also need a defensive back coach that will teach players to turn your dam head around when the ball is in the air.

How freaking difficult is that to teach

 

[Whirlwin]

We also need a defensive back coach that will teach players to turn your dam head around when the ball is in the air.

How freaking difficult is that to teach

Do you think that would be the first thing they would teach them. Look for the damn ball

 

[OmerV]

We might be arguing different things here. But you do seem to have a drive to protect dak.

You are right...thus isn't 2016. Dak has been proclaimed the big money leader. Not just for butt slaps....but in charge of sustained drives, ball control, and yes scoring points. Are we to blame wr#5 instead? Dak is the defacto, assumed, and paid leader.....he is obligated to help solve any problem not be absolved of them.

I am not blaming just the offense, or even just dak. If you recall....I objected to you casually throwing around the 33 points given up be defense. A complelty meaningless Stat without context...which you refuse to supply. The offense could easily contribute to those points through turnovers and 3 and outs.

I won't let you subtly change my narrative to confuse my point.

Look, I don't think Dak is perfect. As I've said many times, I don't put him in the truly elite category. He's not Rogers or Brady or Mahomes. But when a guy is playing well and people put all the blame on him and choose to ignore bigger problems, yeah, I feel the need to comment. The team is 1st in the NFL in yardage and 2nd in the NFL in scoring. That means that, for the most part, the offense is carrying their load.

As for you not putting all the blame on Dak, maybe that's true, but some do, including USArmyVet, who I was responding to when you joined the conversation. That was the context.

 

[blueblood70]

real issues,

• defense needs to tighten it up especially in coverage stop holding and getting PIs even if they are sometimes called and should not be..
• OL needs to play together as unit most have played well but its either one linemen or TE that misses blocks or gets pushed into the backfields and messes up the play,,watching a lot of playback from the raiders game its the TEs the defenses are targeting and they are walking them back into the play and messing up pass or run..just one player each play..tighten it up and we will be back to 6-0 type play,
• Run game falls on the OL but also the OCs inability to stay patience with it and wear down a DL..we need to be creative but also physical, hes been neither the last 4 games. Kellen im overrated Moore needs to get that part of our offense back. this isnt school yard sandlot football and being cute and passing 75% of the time isnt working..run game please!

 

[Mk2_Cowboys]

In your opinion , is the quarterback. Is it the defense backfield . Is it that we don’t have a great offensive line . Is it the head coach. Is it the defensive line. Is it the linebackers.

A good owner who hires a real coach who is accountable and not a proxy puppet .

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Look, I don't think Dak is perfect. As I've said many times, I don't put him in the truly elite category. He's not Rogers or Brady or Mahomes. But when a guy is playing well and people put all the blame on him and choose to ignore bigger problems, yeah, I feel the need to comment. The team is 1st in the NFL in yardage and 2nd in the NFL in scoring. That means that, for the most part, the offense is carrying their load.

As for you not putting all the blame on Dak, maybe that's true, but some do, including USArmyVet, who I was responding to when you joined the conversation. That was the context.

The problem is you won't let armyvet have his say without the "but the defense gave up 33" OK fine...but Dak's ineffective offense, especially early on....contributes to that. So fine that you argue...but it's not even a good reason.
Now if dak put up 25 early points....and we end up losing 33 to 28.....I would concede your point.
If we want to blame the defense for our woes....we should start a conversation about that....and let armyvet just have his....you aren't changing his mind.

 

[OmerV]

The problem is you won't let armyvet have his say without the "but the defense gave up 33" OK fine...but Dak's ineffective offense, especially early on....contributes to that. So fine that you argue...but it's not even a good reason.
Now if dak put up 25 early points....and we end up losing 33 to 28.....I would concede your point.
If we want to blame the defense for our woes....we should start a conversation about that....and let armyvet just have his....you aren't changing his mind.

He said his word. Why is it incumbent on me to either agree that it's all Dak's fault or just remain silent?

As for putting up early points, sure that helps, but the job of the defense isn't only to hold down the opposing offense when our offense puts up a ton of points early, it's to hold down the opposing offense regardless of how the game plays out. Every week games will play out differently, and both sides of the ball have to adjust and hold up their end as the game goes on. The offense did that with 20 second half points.

But note that I haven't put it all on the defense either. The running game has been seriously lacking the last 4-5 games as well, and of course there are moments Dak could have done better as well. He missed Noah Brown on what should have been a pretty easy pass that would have given us a 1st down in overtime. Who knows how the rest of the possession would have gone after that, but it killed the chance to find out.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

He said his word. Why is it incumbent on me to either agree that it's all Dak's fault or just remain silent?

As for putting up early points, sure that helps, but the job of the defense isn't only to hold down the opposing offense when our offense puts up a ton of points early, it's to hold down the opposing offense regardless of how the game plays out. Every week games will play out differently, and both sides of the ball have to adjust and hold up their end as the game goes on. The offense did that with 20 second half points.

But note that I haven't put it all on the defense either. The running game has been seriously lacking the last 4-5 games as well, and of course there are moments Dak could have done better as well. He missed Noah Brown on what should have been a pretty easy pass that would have given us a 1st down in overtime. Who knows how the rest of the possession would have gone after that, but it killed the chance to find out.

Okay okay. Fine, but let's get back to my original point. People can't say anything critical of Dak without people popping up like gophers with "but defense".

It's not just from the people you label "haters".....it's ubiquitous.

 

[KMY_Amber]

This team is lacking improvement. These players need to step their game up. Dak and everyone else. It's time to get BETTER.

And even more importantly, the coaching staff needs to rise to another level.

Can we come out early and dominate? Can we have a great first drive, not a 3-and-out? Can the defense come out aggressive, not just playing BBDB zones as the opposing offense marches down the field in 5 to 7 yard chunks?

Can McCarthy put this team in the best position to win with sane decisions?

 

[blueblood70]

The problem is you won't let armyvet have his say without the "but the defense gave up 33" OK fine...but Dak's ineffective offense, especially early on....contributes to that. So fine that you argue...but it's not even a good reason.
Now if dak put up 25 early points....and we end up losing 33 to 28.....I would concede your point.
If we want to blame the defense for our woes....we should start a conversation about that....and let armyvet just have his....you aren't changing his mind.

what do you mean early, they would have been tied 14-14 at the half if not for missed xp..that matching the other team, the 3rd qtr we had so many penalties we couldn't get on track but still got a td via STs and both teams had lulls happens EVET game both teams ended up 33-33 at the half what doesn't it matter when we scored , the defense and refs are the blame period end of stpory..no need for concession, its plain and simple.

this had zero to do with dak last paly game was lost.....drum rol please

on a defensive play and drum roll continues yet another penalty, this one the wr created contact pulled the cb into him ie flopped and got the penalty...

not on dak or the offense really when you are handed 33 points you win, if not its on the defense..the offense had ZERO TOs,,sorry this is on the defense/refs..

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

what do you mean early, they would have been tied 14-14 at the half if not for missed xp..that matching the other team, the 3rd qtr we had so many penalties we couldn't get on track but still got a td via STs and both teams had lulls happens EVET game both teams ended up 33-33 at the half what doesn't it matter when we scored , the defense and refs are the blame period end of stpory..no need for concession, its plain and simple.

this had zero to do with dak last paly game was lost.....drum rol please

on a defensive play and drum roll continues yet another penalty, this one the wr created contact pulled the cb into him ie flopped and got the penalty...

not on dak or the offense really when you are handed 33 points you win, if not its on the defense..the offense had ZERO TOs,,sorry this is on the defense/refs..

So you feel you can't discuss that anywhere else but in reply to armyvets opinion?


And we will have to disagree...if the defense can;t score points early in the game, it puts the defense at disadvantage. And yes...the defense does need to get some stops of it's own.

Not sure why we are forced to discuss the flaws of every body else in order to discuss daks.

 

[Coogiguy03]

Guys that get wide open on defenses like they do too us. No name pass rushers that wreak havock on us every play