What picks can we get for Glover or Ellis??

[sago1]

According to Rafael Vela 2 Jan 06 comments speculation within Cowboy organizaiton has already begun re veterans LaRoi Glover, Greg Ellis, Dat Nguyen and Al Singleton. Brad Sham predicted that one or both of the Ellis/Glover tandem would leave this offseason. Glover & Ellis have 2 of the largest cntracts on the team but since both played in a rotation, their value dropped. But both are productive players at positions where demand exceeds supply and what's more, their salaries (particularly Ellis') make them attractive to other teams. That's why Vela thinks Cowboys would trade them rather than release them.

What they would bring depends on the market. Dallas might get a late first round pick for one of these two. Imagine if you are a Denver or an Indianapolis and you lose in the AFC title game. You’re close to a Super Bowl. Do you acquire a known veteran quantity or chance that a rookie can get you over the top? If nothing else, Dallas should be able to draw second round picks for them, if the team chose to put them on the market.

MY COMMENT: If Vela thinks we might get 2nd round pick for each of them, we got to make the trade(s); if we can even get 2 3rds it would be good & certainly better then cutting them. Any first day pick(s) we can get for them saves us lot of cap money & gives Cowboys lot more opportunity. I've been posting we should use FA to sign FS, LB, PK & even C & draft OT, OG, WR. An extra 1-2 picks (on first day) & maybe we even trade down from 18 to say 21/22 & pick up a third rounder--changes whole dimension. With an extra 1-3 picks we can go BPA in first round to get good DT behind Ferguson or LB; 2nd round also has some good OTs & FS, etc. Of course with our luck it won't be happen but we can dream. BTW: Vela said nothing about Dat or Singleton in his article.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Well I don't know what we could get for them...but it does seem like Denver likes ex cowboy players.

 

[baj1dallas]

Denver wouldn't give up a first for either, I don't think. Both of them...sure.

 

[DBoys]

You could get 2nd rounders for each of them I would imagine.

 

[Clove]

Yeah, some seem to think I'm crazy to think we can get 2's for these guys, but these people don't think about teams that need that 1 part to put them over the edge.

Glover is an extremely good 4-3 DT that could destroy teams with an already good DT next to him and a atleast 1 or 2 great DE. Like the Colts who have great edge rusher, and could use a great pass rushing DT like Glover.

Other teams that need a pretty darn good DE would defenitely give up a 2 for Ellis, and for a team that is interested in dropping out of the 1st to get a DE, might as well pick up Ellis who will be much better than any 2 out there.

 

[AbeBeta]

You could get 2nd rounders for each of them I would imagine.

Philly couldn't get nuthin' for Corey Simon last year but we are going to get high first day picks for Ellis and Glover -- maybe multiple picks?

Let's stop living in fantasy land. I like both of these guys but at their ages, come on.

 

[Dale]

Glover might have some trade value given that he's one year removed from appearing in five straight Pro Bowls. However, the reality is that teams will be hesitant to give up any picks for players in their 30s that are widely expected to be released. I'm expecting both to simply be let go; I'd be quite surprised, though excited, if we can get anything for either player.

 

[AbeBeta]

Glover might have some trade value given that he's one year removed from appearing in five straight Pro Bowls. However, the reality is that teams will be hesitant to give up any picks for players in their 30s that are widely expected to be released. I'm expecting both to simply be let go; I'd be quite surprised, though excited, if we can get anything for either player.

Let's bookmark this post so we can simply refer to it everytime the topic comes up.

 

[blindzebra]

Moss got a second round pick, SEA could not trade Alexander for a 2nd, IND could not get a 2nd for James, but we are supposed to get a 2 for two 30+ DL that EVERYONE KNOWS DOES NOT FIT OUR NEW SCHEME.

Vela is another hack, and anything above a 4th round pick is shear fantasy land, so put down the controllers and walk away from the Madden.

 

[DBoys]

Philly couldn't get nuthin' for Corey Simon last year but we are going to get high first day picks for Ellis and Glover -- maybe multiple picks?

Let's stop living in fantasy land. I like both of these guys but at their ages, come on.

1 is a pro bowler and the other is a consistent 8 sack guy. Dallas has no money issues so they don't have to get rid of them. If you want to argue a point do it with facts instead of insults. The age reason is weak. Were you one of the guys saying Key and T Glenn were washed up because they were in their 30's?

 

[CactusCowboy]

Problem is teams know we will most likely release them, so not sure if we would get a 2nd.....maybe, but not likely.

 

[DBoys]

Moss got a second round pick, SEA could not trade Alexander for a 2nd, IND could not get a 2nd for James, but we are supposed to get a 2 for two 30+ DL that EVERYONE KNOWS DOES NOT FIT OUR NEW SCHEME.

Vela is another hack, and anything above a 4th round pick is shear fantasy land, so put down the controllers and walk away from the Madden.

Good post I didn't know they only got a 2nd for Moss and Seattle and Indy could not get a second.

So do you think we will get anything for them?

 

[Dale]

1 is a pro bowler and the other is a consistent 8 sack guy. Dallas has no money issues so they don't have to get rid of them. If you want to argue a point do it with facts instead of insults. The age reason is weak. Were you one of the guys saying Key and T Glenn were washed up because they were in their 30's?

Age doesn't mean you're a poor player, but it does severely decrease one's trade value.

Not many teams have shown willing -- through the history of the league -- to part with a high pick, which could be spent on someone who is about 22, for a guy nearly 10 years older.

If Glover were 28, yes, I think we could get something for him. But he'll be 32 next season, and I just can't imagine teams banging down our door looking to trade for a 32-year old.

No one's saying his age makes him a poor player. If he's released, teams WILL be beating down his door. But age does, indeed, severely decrease one's trade value, IMO.

 

[TheHustler]

solid 2nd for ellis, late 2nd for glover.

 

[AbeBeta]

1 is a pro bowler and the other is a consistent 8 sack guy. Dallas has no money issues so they don't have to get rid of them. If you want to argue a point do it with facts instead of insults. The age reason is weak. Were you one of the guys saying Key and T Glenn were washed up because they were in their 30's?

No, I never said either were washed up.

Fact - We don't have to trade b/c of money -- but everyone knows they don't fit in our scheme. Everyone knows they will get cut sooner or later.

Fact - Corey Simon -- Eagles got nothing for him.

Fact -- Larry Allen is also a pro bowler - you think we can get anything for him? No, that would be silly.

Fact -- 2nd round picks for either is a fantasy.

 

[TheHustler]

Moss got a second round pick, SEA could not trade Alexander for a 2nd, IND could not get a 2nd for James, but we are supposed to get a 2 for two 30+ DL that EVERYONE KNOWS DOES NOT FIT OUR NEW SCHEME.

Vela is another hack, and anything above a 4th round pick is shear fantasy land, so put down the controllers and walk away from the Madden.

Moss went for a first (7th overall) + Napolean Harris, a solid LB.

The Seahawks trying to trade Shaun was just a rumor.

Edge wanted a $16 million bonus from whoever traded for him plus at LEAST the 2nd round pick they'd have to give up.

 

[DBoys]

Moss went for a first (7th overall) + Napolean Harris, a solid LB.

The Seahawks trying to trade Shaun was just a rumor.

Edge wanted a $16 million bonus from whoever traded for him plus at LEAST the 2nd round pick they'd have to give up.

Should of checked for myself thanks for the truth Hustler

 

[trueblue1687]

Moss got a second round pick, SEA could not trade Alexander for a 2nd, IND could not get a 2nd for James, but we are supposed to get a 2 for two 30+ DL that EVERYONE KNOWS DOES NOT FIT OUR NEW SCHEME.

Vela is another hack, and anything above a 4th round pick is shear fantasy land, so put down the controllers and walk away from the Madden.

Keep in mind that you are comparing apples to oranges here. Last years running back stable was rich with old talent...and NEW. Teams were somehow showing an abundance of RB's that could play well. Pro bowl D-linemen are a different story altogether. That said, I think we would be LUCKY to get a third for Glover and possibly a late second for Ellis is likely. Also keep in mind that trades are pure speculation. The only story to come out is Ellis saying that HE doesn't think that he fits the scheme and that HE thinks he won't be back. He may very well stay around for situational play-much like this season. Nothing has been said one way or another that either will be released. Both played about as much as any other D-linemen and that type of scheme fits a 3/4 to a T. Rotate fresh players in and out. My question is other than salary considerations, why would you not hang on to either or both?? I dare say you won't get anything better in FA at their salaries and any rookie is going to be a drop off in ability and experience for a year or two most likely...no matter how good they were in college.

 

[trueblue1687]

One other thought: Why all the concern over the age of 30?? Ellis is 30, Glover is 31, Ferguson is 30 as well. I remember alot of folks screaming like school girls over the Ferguson signing....and *****ing like school girls over "letting" Bertrand Berry slip away (also 30 incidentally) and some were even pushing for Darren Howard who is, you guessed it 30 years old. My point is that it really doesn't make much difference about age at that position unless your drawing social security. I would never advocate a Bruce Smith signing, but both players are still very good (Ellis and Glover) and will be for several more years. I could see a team with a real need giving a late 2nd or a 3rd for them, either way, like someone said earlier: some team(s) will grab both of these guys up quick. The question is how and obviously it all hinges on them actually being shopped or dropped.

 

[Verdict]

Moss got a second round pick, SEA could not trade Alexander for a 2nd, IND could not get a 2nd for James, but we are supposed to get a 2 for two 30+ DL that EVERYONE KNOWS DOES NOT FIT OUR NEW SCHEME.

Vela is another hack, and anything above a 4th round pick is shear fantasy land, so put down the controllers and walk away from the Madden.

I have seen you make some very good posts, but this post came off a bit strong to me. Lets look at this objectively for a minute. Your "Seattle couldn't get a second for Alexander" statement is very deceiving. Alexander, talent wise is worth a FIRST ROUND PICK. The trouble is he is looking for a huge payday. Ellis is not near the player Alexander is and I will readily concede that. On the other hand Ellis is signed to a longer term, cap friendly deal that might make him quite attractive to a team who needs his services. He was initially a first rounder and will play better than a young second rounder. I just dont think you can view these things in a vacuum. In my book Ellis isnt nearly as good a player as Glover, but his contract might make him more valuable to a potential trade partner.

Bottom line is a player is worth whatever you can get for him. No more no less. The QB that the Eagles traded to Miami wasn't worth a second rounder but Miami gave it up to get him. Stranger things have happened.