Who Don`t You Want

[The Realist]

I understand what he's trying to get at. Unfortunately, his stream of thought is not cohesive.

Here's what he said:

"I also don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a college 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at 3-4 DE in the league. Those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron and Justin Smith.

The best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college vs on the edge as a college DE. They are use to interior pass rush in nickel whereas guys like Spears, Canty, Hatcher.................aren't."

So on the one hand he doesn't like "big" DEs, but on the other hand he makes the claim that the "best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college.

Hmmm, maybe he's referring to the D-II DT's that played football with Akwasi Owusu-Ansah at IUP that are 6'2" 250 lbs, because D-I DT's are all going to be roughly 6'3-4ish and 280+lbs. Which by any standard would considered "big."

Further, his entire claim is muddled by the fact that Cameron Jordan played both DT and DE at Cal. A little fact he claimed he knew, but obviously didn't.

The irony is that Cameron Jordan fits the exact profile of the type of player he described and claims makes the best 3-4 DEs.

I said - "I don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at 3-4 DE."

Your brain saw - I don't like drafting big DE's.

Peppers, Mario, Tuck, Dunlap have nothing to do with the conversation because they don't play in a 3-4.

 

[Picksix]

Don't know if serious or half-serious but :laugh2:

Tongue in cheek. Think I've heard or read all of those at one point or another.

Seriously, don't want a QB. As for OL, if we can't trade down to get better "value" and end up taking a guy like Carimi, and he starts on our OL for 10 years, I don't really care where we take him.

 

[junk]

I understand what he's trying to get at. Unfortunately, his stream of thought is not cohesive.

Here's what he said:

"I also don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a college 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at 3-4 DE in the league. Those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron and Justin Smith.

The best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college vs on the edge as a college DE. They are use to interior pass rush in nickel whereas guys like Spears, Canty, Hatcher.................aren't."

So on the one hand he doesn't like "big" DEs, but on the other hand he makes the claim that the "best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college.

Hmmm, maybe he's referring to the D-II DT's that played football with Akwasi Owusu-Ansah at IUP that are 6'2" 250 lbs, because D-I DT's are all going to be roughly 6'3-4ish and 280+lbs. Which by any standard would considered "big."

Further, his entire claim is muddled by the fact that Cameron Jordan played both DT and DE at Cal. A little fact he claimed he knew, but obviously didn't.

The irony is that Cameron Jordan fits the exact profile of the type of player he described and claims makes the best 3-4 DEs.

Yeah, I don't know what you are trying to say either.

Where did he ever talk about small DTs playing at IUP? He's saying he doesn't like to project guys who played defensive end in college to a 3-4 end. The only DEs that can play a 3-4 end in the NFL were obviously big. No 260 pounder is going to play 3-4 end in the NFL, so saying big was probably unnecessary.

Stating it as simply as possible....he prefers his 3-4 ends to be former DTs.

Using examples, I assume he means he prefers to project players who played DT in college to end in the 3-4. Players like Richard Seymour, Haloti Ngata, Luis Castillo, Ziggy Hood etc. Guys that are used to providing pass rush through traffic as opposed to working in space on the edge.

Canty, Spears and Hatcher all played DE in college in various schemes. Canty was in a 3-4. Spears and Hatcher were both 4-3. However, all worked off of the edge.

 

[The Realist]

Yeah, I don't know what you are trying to say either.

Where did he ever talk about small DTs playing at IUP? He's saying he doesn't like to project guys who played defensive end in college to a 3-4 end. The only DEs that can play a 3-4 end in the NFL were obviously big. No 260 pounder is going to play 3-4 end in the NFL, so saying big was probably unnecessary.

Stating it as simply as possible....he prefers his 3-4 ends to be former DTs.

Using examples, I assume he means he prefers to project players who played DT in college to end in the 3-4. Players like Richard Seymour, Haloti Ngata, Luis Castillo, Ziggy Hood etc. Guys that are used to providing pass rush through traffic as opposed to working in space on the edge.

Canty, Spears and Hatcher all played DE in college in various schemes. Canty was in a 3-4. Spears and Hatcher were both 4-3. However, all worked off of the edge.

Thank you............

Now the why...............a college DT doesn't have to adapt to rushing in traffic. He's already done it a lot. Cam plays some inside but the vast majority of his time is at DE base and in nickel.

Spears, Canty, Hatcher, Igor.............

Have no clue how to rush in traffic lined up head up on the OT in base 3-4.

Nor do they have any clue how to rush inside as nickel DT in nickel.

Fairley, Suh, Ngata..............

They spent 3-4 years in college doing it already.

 

[realtick]

I said - "I don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at 3-4 DE."

Your brain saw - I don't like drafting big DE's.

Peppers, Mario, Tuck, Dunlap have nothing to do with the conversation because they don't play in a 3-4.

Why don't you finish the rest of your own quote?

You said, "I don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a a 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at a 3-4 DE. Those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron and Justin Smith."

My brain saw "he doesn't like drafting big DE's" because it's the only relevant take away.

You don't like drafting big DE's (regardless of scheme) and playing them at DE in a pro 3-4....

But WHY?

Because "those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron Smith and Justin Smith."

Oh, okay, well I don't necessarily agree with that but I can see where you're headed....oh, wait, there's more?

"The best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college vs on the edge as a college DE..."

Wait, you don't want to draft a big college DE, because as you stated, those guys never succeed, but you prefer your 3-4 DE's to have played DT in college? If they played DT in college at a D1 level, you would assume that they are going to be "big" bodied. And you prefer those same "big" bodied linemen with DT experience to play as your 3-4 DE in the pros.

Further, you don't like Cam Jordan despite the fact he played both DT (extensively) and DE in college.

Yes, an absolutely succinct stream of thought.

 

[CanuckCowboysFan]

The best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college vs on the edge as a college DE.

Cam Jordan also played as a DT...............................
:bang2: :bang2:

 

[TheFinisher]

No Tackles in Round 1.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Phil Taylor and Marvin Austin....they'll get even lazier when they get paid and both are trouble makers.


Carimi..Wisconsin linemen have a history of maxing strength in college with little room for further development at the pro level.

 

[The Realist]

Why don't you finish the rest of your own quote?

You said, "I don't like drafting big DE's, whether they be from a a 4-3 or 3-4 and playing them at a 3-4 DE. Those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron and Justin Smith."

My brain saw "he doesn't like drafting big DE's" because it's the only relevant take away.

You don't like drafting big DE's (regardless of scheme) and playing them at DE in a pro 3-4....

But WHY?

Because "those guys have zero success rushing the QB except for Aaron Smith and Justin Smith."

Oh, okay, well I don't necessarily agree with that but I can see where you're headed....oh, wait, there's more?

"The best 3-4 DE's are use to playing in traffic as a DT in college vs on the edge as a college DE..."

Wait, you don't want to draft a big college DE, because as you stated, those guys never succeed, but you prefer your 3-4 DE's to have played DT in college? If they played DT in college at a D1 level, you would assume that they are going to be "big" bodied. And you prefer those same "big" bodied linemen with DT experience to play as your 3-4 DE in the pros.

Further, you don't like Cam Jordan despite the fact he played both DT (extensively) and DE in college.

Yes, an absolutely succinct stream of thought.

UR right......even though the sentence ended with "and playing them at 3-4 DE" that part isn't relevant says you.

All I know is the best pass rushing 3-4 DE's average under 5 sacks per year.

I want no part of that top 10.

 

[TheFinisher]

5-techniques have no business in the top 10. I can pick a guy from the 3rd or 4th Round who will give me just as much return as the guy in the top 10.

Please don't take a 5-tech in the top 10, that's how things like Tyson Jackson happen.