Why DT?

[Chuck 54]

TCrawford is paid like a Pro Bowler....I think the jury is still out on just how effective he can be until we see him healthy, having played with a bad arm most of last season. Thornton was an effective starter at 3-4 DE, so I have no doubt (like Hatcher), we will see more from him at 4-3 DT.

I still want another DT in the draft...teams killed us running up the gut last season....it's not all about rushing the passer; it's nice to stop the short yardage and goal line runs now and then.

 

[conner01]

I don't see us taking a DT at 4, and unless a very impactful DT who can rush the passer falls to 34, I don't think we take one there. I know some fans want a big plugger type but that's just not gonna happen. Unless a guy who can rush the passer falls then it won't happen in the top two rnds. This is a deep DT draft but many of them are more pluggers than rushers and those guys aren't part of the plan.

 

[9darter]

I'm thinking even Thornton is a just a JAG.

Agree. I guess we will see Philthy draft a better DT in rounds 3-4, and Dallas ignoring the position until some longshot 6th or 7th round "we don't know what else to spend these picks on" type of selection.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Exactly.

If either of the starters is injured and out for any length of time this part of the defense is screwed.

They desperately need another player there.

I'm thinking a 2nd rounder.

Even if our first rounder is a QB? Is a DT likely to be the BPA there?

 

[conner01]

Even if our first rounder is a QB? Is a DT likely to be the BPA there?

Not likely. Unless a DT who can play the run, push the pocket and pressure the QB falls. I know fans want a DT, any DT but the team wants more of a pass rusher type DT and those are few and far between

 

[Dalmations202]

IMO, DT is the number one position of need for the draft, and this is a heavy year for DT's.

yes, Dallas has Crawford and Irving -- both of which give up lots of weight on that DL. While they can use their speed to get to the QB, they can't collapse the pocket, and often times are easily single blocked.

Hayden was single blocked all year long. Enough said.

IF you want to improve the D, you improve the trenches and get pressure. A monster who DEMANDS a double team every play just makes all the rest of the DLine that much better. It is much easier for Crawford and Lawrence to get to the QB if they only have a G and T to have to deal with.

If you get a monster to collapse the pocket and demand a double team, then they have to start keeping in TE's and RB's to block which allows for fewer targets. It allows for the LB's to get into lanes instead of having to bring pressure.

I am all for speed from the DE's, but they work best with Big Nasty's which can almost be immovable in the middle. The immovable middle clogs up running lanes, and forces 3rd and long -- where they can bring in the speed.

Dallas has seemed to forget this and pays the price for it EVERY year.

 

[Floatyworm]

IMO, DT is the number one position of need for the draft, and this is a heavy year for DT's.

yes, Dallas has Crawford and Irving -- both of which give up lots of weight on that DL. While they can use their speed to get to the QB, they can't collapse the pocket, and often times are easily single blocked.

Hayden was single blocked all year long. Enough said.

IF you want to improve the D, you improve the trenches and get pressure. A monster who DEMANDS a double team every play just makes all the rest of the DLine that much better. It is much easier for Crawford and Lawrence to get to the QB if they only have a G and T to have to deal with.

If you get a monster to collapse the pocket and demand a double team, then they have to start keeping in TE's and RB's to block which allows for fewer targets. It allows for the LB's to get into lanes instead of having to bring pressure.

I am all for speed from the DE's, but they work best with Big Nasty's which can almost be immovable in the middle. The immovable middle clogs up running lanes, and forces 3rd and long -- where they can bring in the speed.

Dallas has seemed to forget this and pays the price for it EVERY year.

This just stinks of Marinelli's doing. All he wants is these skinny DTs that rush the QB. It's not working...hasn't worked...not going to work. I'm afraid this problem won't be solved until he's gone...and we get a coach that understands that playing all these games of twisting/stunts to get to the QB....just don't work. The quickest way to the QB is a straight line. Point A to B....Not all this silly gamemanship that wastes time getting to the QB.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

I have done a million mocks on Fanspeak...in almost none of the scenarios is a DT the BPA when we come up, outside of possibly the second round. The type of DT that would make an impact up the middle.

Almost all of the DT's are either run defenders with no pass rush, or some pass rush and weak against the run. Don't see any being significantly better than the starting duo, maybe someone that replaces the injury prone McClain.

Seems for the most part that the guys that could be an improvement are in the first three rounds.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Not likely. Unless a DT who can play the run, push the pocket and pressure the QB falls. I know fans want a DT, any DT but the team wants more of a pass rusher type DT and those are few and far between

That is what I think as well. Nkemdiche is a possibility, but comes with baggage and his production has never been close to what his tools would indicate. Almost all of the guys are one or the other, stout against the run or with pass rushing skills.

 

[Floatyworm]

That is what I think as well. Nkemdiche is a possibility, but comes with baggage and his production has never been close to what his tools would indicate. Almost all of the guys are one or the other, stout against the run or with pass rushing skills.

I posted Nkemdiche's stats a month ago.....and was shocked @ his career college numbers. Thought there had to be a mistake. But nope....His numbers for a guy w/ his athletism just doesn't add up. Major red flag......

 

[Jake0]

IMO, DT is the number one position of need for the draft, and this is a heavy year for DT's.

yes, Dallas has Crawford and Irving -- both of which give up lots of weight on that DL. While they can use their speed to get to the QB, they can't collapse the pocket, and often times are easily single blocked.

Hayden was single blocked all year long. Enough said.

IF you want to improve the D, you improve the trenches and get pressure. A monster who DEMANDS a double team every play just makes all the rest of the DLine that much better. It is much easier for Crawford and Lawrence to get to the QB if they only have a G and T to have to deal with.

If you get a monster to collapse the pocket and demand a double team, then they have to start keeping in TE's and RB's to block which allows for fewer targets. It allows for the LB's to get into lanes instead of having to bring pressure.

I am all for speed from the DE's, but they work best with Big Nasty's which can almost be immovable in the middle. The immovable middle clogs up running lanes, and forces 3rd and long -- where they can bring in the speed.

Dallas has seemed to forget this and pays the price for it EVERY year.

The only explanation I can think of for neglecting DT completely last year was they knew this year's draft was gonna be loaded. Absolutely must come out with a quality DT this year. I think 3rd round is the value sweet spot because the depth should mean not too large of a talent drop from 2nd to 3rd but using the 2nd is fine too.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

The only explanation I can think of for neglecting DT completely last year was they knew this year's draft was gonna be loaded. Absolutely must come out with a quality DT this year. I think 3rd round is the value sweet spot because the depth should mean not too large of a talent drop from 2nd to 3rd but using the 2nd is fine too.

Tell me which guy drafted in the third is going to be a disruptive pass rusher that can still hold his own against the run.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Even if our first rounder is a QB? Is a DT likely to be the BPA there?

A DT being the BPA at the beginning of the 2nd round?

Wouldn't surprise me. Many good to very good DT's in this draft.

 

[Jake0]

Tell me which guy drafted in the third is going to be a disruptive pass rusher that can still hold his own against the run.

Don't need a disruptive pass rusher. Need a guy that holds his ground against the run primarily, commanding doubles, and actually pushes linemen backwards rather than being blown backwards.

 

[CATCH17]

IMO..the problem has always been when they moved T. Crawford to DT. Should have been left on the strong side DE. We need game changers @ DT. That's what made Tampa's D so good. You had game wreckers in Sapp and McFarland. We trot out Nick Hayden.

Heck I'm thinking even Thornton is a just a JAG. Until this team takes getting studs @ DT seriously...this team is gonna get worked over.

They really need to take a page from the Panthers when they took Star Lotulelei and Cecil Short in the 1st and 2nd round. Totally solidified their D.

Those Tampa defenses were stout through the middle at every level and we try to build our defense from the outside.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Don't need a disruptive pass rusher. Need a guy that holds his ground against the run primarily, commanding doubles, and actually pushes linemen backwards rather than being blown backwards.

So, isn't Thornton that guy or did we waste our free agent dollars?

 

[Jake0]

So, isn't Thornton that guy or did we waste our free agent dollars?

A piece of the puzzle/rotation. Need more.

 

[RS12]

In a draft where DT is its strength, how do you not draft one is a better question. Take what the draft gives you.

 

[DBOY3141]

In a draft where DT is its strength, how do you not draft one is a better question. Take what the draft gives you.

kind of like last year when the strength of the draft in a lot of folks minds was RB......didn't work out so well for the ole' Boys. hopefully history doesn't repeat itself.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Strengthening a position where we are at least average and ignoring positions where we are well below average isn't very smart either. Depth is a great thing, when you have good starters. When you have borderline scrubs starting at multiple positions, you might want to focus on those.

This team would be much better with a playmaking corner or safety or pass rusher than a rotation guy in the middle. Just my opinion. And yes, DT is deep, for the first couple of rounds but there isn't one that is an impact guy like Donald was.