World Cup Final: USA vs Japan

[Cythim]

Ok stupid question of the day: If we can field a womans soccer team that is good enough to make to the World Cup finals why can't we do the same with the mens team? I know the competition is much strong on the mens side but surely we should be able to field a better team.

You can likely thank Title IX for that. We have a deep college system to develop talent while other nations rely on clubs that struggle to generate revenue.

 

[Cythim]

Because of the NFL.


All of our potential great soccer stars are playing in the NFL.


Soccer is one of the big 5 sports for girls.

For guys its on down the list.

False. Messi, Xavi, and many of the greatest soccer players around the world do not fit the profile for any standard American sport. Our men's team sucks because we look for NFL and NBA athletes instead of quality soccer players who have technique and a deep understanding of the game. We also pigeonhole players into set roles at an early age so they do not develop a complete understanding of the game.

 

[MC KAos]

False. Messi, Xavi, and many of the greatest soccer players around the world do not fit the profile for any standard American sport. Our men's team sucks because we look for NFL and NBA athletes instead of quality soccer players who have technique and a deep understanding of the game. We also pigeonhole players into set roles at an early age so they do not develop a complete understanding of the game.

I agree, Uruguay has a great team full of world class players and their country has 3 million people. It's because of cheapness and bad management that we suck.

 

[Stautner]

I have to agree with others - I think in men's sports the better athletes often tend to focus more on football/basketball/baseball first, either out of doing the more accepteable thing among their peers, or because that is the direction they were steered toward by parents and others from an early age - although that culture should be changing as more and more parents will have grown up in an era where soccer is a bigger, more accepted sport, and therefore a sport that will be passed down from generation to generation in the United States the way others have. People have to remember that in the United States soccer had some catching up to do.

I don't think that same affect occurs with womens sports. First, ALL womens sports had catching up to do, so soccer didn't start out as for down the list that it did with men's sports. The evolution of soccer in the US was much closer in sync with the evolution of women's sports in general. Second, other women's sports just didn't have the same kind of dominance in culture that football/basketball/baseball had on the men's side, so soccer didn't have the same huge disadvantage in competing for athletes.

A THOUGHT ABOUT THE GAME:

I had never watched an entire soccer game in my life other than ones my very young kids played in. I watched this one, and was glued to the TV the entire match. Games like this, and the conversion of (or eventual death of) hard headed old farts like me who never gave soccer a chance will help change sports culture in the US so that kids (males in particular) will be more likely to choose soccer as a primary sport at an early age with their parents blessing.

 

[joseephuss]

Ok stupid question of the day: If we can field a womans soccer team that is good enough to make to the World Cup finals why can't we do the same with the mens team? I know the competition is much strong on the mens side but surely we should be able to field a better team.

Same sport, different scenarios. Really can't compare the two.

For the men, soccer has to compete and mostly lose to football, basketball and baseball. For the women, soccer is pretty much the top sport. That makes a difference in the quality of the athlete and player that develops and makes it to the national team.

Competition makes a huge difference. On the men's side, the U.S. is climbing an uphill battle to catch the other countries that treat soccer as a cult of some sort and have been playing for a much longer time. The women don't have to deal with that. The U.S. pretty much started on an even step with every other country if not higher in developing women's soccer. Some counties didn't even allow women to play soccer in the recent past much less have a national team.

 

[Doomsday101]

Same sport, different scenarios. Really can't compare the two.

For the men, soccer has to compete and mostly lose to football, basketball and baseball. For the women, soccer is pretty much the top sport. That makes a difference in the quality of the athlete and player that develops and makes it to the national team.

Competition makes a huge difference. On the men's side, the U.S. is climbing an uphill battle to catch the other countries that treat soccer as a cult of some sort and have been playing for a much longer time. The women don't have to deal with that. The U.S. pretty much started on an even step with every other country if not higher in developing women's soccer. Some counties didn't even allow women to play soccer in the recent past much less have a national team.

I fully agree with this. Women sports are somewhat limited compared to men’s sports and with so many different sports available to men the quality of athletes are spread throughout the various sports in the US.

Heck the biggest star in Pro soccer in the US is not even from the USA David Beckham

 

[joseephuss]

I fully agree with this. Women sports are somewhat limited compared to men’s sports and with so many different sports available to men the quality of athletes are spread throughout the various sports in the US.

Heck the biggest star in Pro soccer in the US is not even from the USA David Beckham

That is is somewhat true. Of course Beckham has always been one of the most popular players/biggest stars even if he wasn't the best on the field.

 

[Stautner]

I fully agree with this. Women sports are somewhat limited compared to men’s sports and with so many different sports available to men the quality of athletes are spread throughout the various sports in the US.

Heck the biggest star in Pro soccer in the US is not even from the USA David Beckham

I think this is true, but I still think things will shift some over time. There are still a lot of parents that didn't grow up with soccer and don't steer their kids in that direction, and there are still a lot of places in the country where football/basketball/baseball and even hockey are the top dogs, with soccer being more of a secondary sport that many of the top male athletes neglect in faovr of the others. But soccer is getting more and more national attention, and many young parents today have grown up with soccer being a more prominant sport, and I think the culture in the US will keep evolving where soccer will be able to compete for better athletes.

 

[Doomsday101]

That is is somewhat true. Of course Beckham has always been one of the most popular players/biggest stars even if he wasn't the best on the field.

Looking at MLS teams there are many non US born players not just Beckham. I think the US has made strides in the sport but it is still not to the level of South America or Europe and frankly I'm not sure if it ever will be at that level. I just don’t see many Americans as passionate with Soccer as I do with people from other countries.

 

[Doomsday101]

I think this is true, but I still think things will shift some over time. There are still a lot of parents that didn't grow up with soccer and don't steer their kids in that direction, and there are still a lot of places in the country where football/basketball/baseball and even hockey are the top dogs, with soccer being more of a secondary sport that many of the top male athletes neglect in faovr of the others. But soccer is getting more and more national attention, and many young parents today have grown up with soccer being a more prominant sport, and I think the culture in the US will keep evolving where soccer will be able to compete for better athletes.

Well I don't see American football fading away or American Basketball. I do think we will improve as a nation in soccer but I'm not sure we will see the same fanatical passion as we see in many other countries for the sport.

 

[Stautner]

Well I don't see American football fading away or American Basketball. I do think we will improve as a nation in soccer but I'm not sure we will see the same fanatical passion as we see in many other countries for the sport.

I agree with this. I'm not saying soccer will ever overtake football/baseball and basketball in the U.S., but I am saying that I believe it will become more and more acceptible for better athletes to play, and that as time goes on it will attract more quality athletes to play than in the past. That's already happened to a degree, and it's unmistakable that soccer is dramatically bigger than 15-20 years ago. Soccer was almost non-existent in youth sports when i was a kid.

 

[joseephuss]

Looking at MLS teams there are many non US born players not just Beckham. I think the US has made strides in the sport but it is still not to the level of South America or Europe and frankly I'm not sure if it ever will be at that level. I just don’t see many Americans as passionate with Soccer as I do with people from other countries.

The MLS is just too far behind to overcome the other premier soccer leagues in the world. It is also too far behind to overtake the NFL, the NBA and MLB. The NFL is still growing in popularity. I don't think anyone who gets involved in the MLS as a player, coach or owner or anything else has any false hopes about what the league is or will be in 10 or 15 years. They know it is what it is.

If your goal is to be one of the best, then you aren't going to want to spend too much time playing in the MLS. You want to make it to the premier leagues over seas. Just like minor league baseball players want to make it to the majors. Or basketball players playing in the leagues in Greece or Spain want to make it to the NBA. I don't think there is anything wrong with being a stepping stone league.

 

[Stautner]

The MLS is just too far behind to overcome the other premier soccer leagues in the world. It is also too far behind to overtake the NFL, the NBA and MLB. The NFL is still growing in popularity. I don't think anyone who gets involved in the MLS as a player, coach or owner or anything else has any false hopes about what the league is or will be in 10 or 15 years. They know it is what it is.

If your goal is to be one of the best, then you aren't going to want to spend too much time playing in the MLS. You want to make it to the premier leagues over seas. Just like minor league baseball players want to make it to the majors. Or basketball players playing in the leagues in Greece or Spain want to make it to the NBA. I don't think there is anything wrong with being a stepping stone league.

Obviously as a whole soccer here will never be what it is in some countries because for some countires it is and has been for many years the primary sport and a national passion. The United States already has other sports filling those roles, but soccer is on the rise, and given the resources that are thrown at youth athletics in the United States I believe we will see US teams that are more competative internationally the more time goes on.

 

[joseephuss]

Obviously as a whole soccer here will never be what it is in some countries because for some countires it is and has been for many years the primary sport and a national passion. The United States already has other sports filling those roles, but soccer is on the rise, and given the resources that are thrown at youth athletics in the United States I believe we will see US teams that are more competative internationally the more time goes on.

I agree that you can have individual U.S. players and the U.S. national team grow to be more competitive internationally as time goes on. I think the MLS growing to the point of being competitive to other leagues around the world is a different beast. Individuals and a single team are on a much smaller scale than an entire league.

 

[Bizwah]

I agree that most of our better athletes go into the big three sports.

It's that way where I live. Early on, most kids start playing soccer.....but by the time they reach third grade, the better athletes have gone into football.

From Kindergarten through Second grade, my son's team didn't even have a goal scored on them in soccer. But last year, nearly all of the kids on his team (including my son) made the move to football instead.

Only a handful of kids from that team stayed with soccer.

 

[Doomsday101]

[youtube]H_YU2EcgE3A[/youtube]

If you want Americans to take the game more seriously then they need to get rid of this image.

 

[joseephuss]

[youtube]H_YU2EcgE3A[/youtube]

If you want Americans to take the game more seriously then they need to get rid of this image.

Unfortunately that will not go away. I wish it would. To a much lesser extent you are seeing an increase in these types of antics in the NBA and the NFL. I hope it doesn't continue to grow in those sports.

 

[Doomsday101]

Unfortunately that will not go away. I wish it would. To a much lesser extent you are seeing an increase in these types of antics in the NBA and the NFL. I hope it doesn't continue to grow in those sports.

You not go to be around in the NFL faking injuries all the time. Sorry but watching the few soccer games I have seen it is a joke they way these guys flop around it seems to be a part of the game. I was surprised to see the women acting more like professionals than the men soccer players

 

[CATCH17]

False. Messi, Xavi, and many of the greatest soccer players around the world do not fit the profile for any standard American sport. Our men's team sucks because we look for NFL and NBA athletes instead of quality soccer players who have technique and a deep understanding of the game. We also pigeonhole players into set roles at an early age so they do not develop a complete understanding of the game.

If Messi and Xavi were born American they would be lucky to even have played Soccer.

They wouldve tried to play the popular American sports and failed because of their natural genetics most likely.

 

[Stautner]

I agree that most of our better athletes go into the big three sports.

It's that way where I live. Early on, most kids start playing soccer.....but by the time they reach third grade, the better athletes have gone into football.

From Kindergarten through Second grade, my son's team didn't even have a goal scored on them in soccer. But last year, nearly all of the kids on his team (including my son) made the move to football instead.

Only a handful of kids from that team stayed with soccer.

It's going to be a slow process, but look at one simple point in your post - that early on kids start playing soccer. a generation ago that wasn't the case. Even when it became more common for kids in some areas to start out with soccer, it was viewed as an easy early acdtivity (not a lot of rules to learn) until they got older and could play other things. None of the better athletes played soccer as they got older, and often they simply couldn't because High Schools in many parts of the country didn't have soccer teams. Now at least ocassionally a few kids that are quality athletes stick with soccer as they get older - still easily a minority, but a few here and there. Soccer clubs are now big, with kids travelling around the state and country to play. Some good athletes will get locked into that early on, and when they do they wont have time to get very active in other sports. It will grow from there - maybe not at aa great speed, but it will grow.