Would anybody agree with me on this?

[Hostile]

The sad thing is that the Patriots have a kicker to thank for some rings.

I understand your angst towards them, however, it's part of the game until it's changed.

You're right, they do. I feel for their players who actually left it on the field to have to hear that in the media. I really do. Clean uniform and all.

 

[Dale]

I think everyone understands the fact we need a very, very considerable upgrade at kicker. That's not in question.

But is drafting one in the first round really the best solution? What historical evidence supports that claim? Our best bet, IMO, is to simply sign a solid free agent. We've avoided signing a "name" kicker these last few years, going with the Visintainers and Suishams and Cortez's instead. Perhaps this is the year that trend changes.

 

[Dallas4ever]

I don't think that you ever draft a kicker higher than fifth or sixth round if then IMO. Not unless you plan on him carrying you most of the time. Good football teams very rarely draft kickers.

 

[Hostile]

I think everyone understands the fact we need a very, very considerable upgrade at kicker. That's not in question.

But is drafting one in the first round really the best solution? What historical evidence supports that claim? Our best bet, IMO, is to simply sign a solid free agent. We've avoided signing a "name" kicker these last few years, going with the Visintainers and Suishams and Cortez's instead. Perhaps this is the year that trend changes.

The point is being overlooked because we do need a better kicker. I posted this in another thread on this. Here are the 5 guys I could find who were drafted in the 1st at Kicker.


2000...Sebastian Janikowski, Raiders

1984...Tony Zendejas, Commanders

1979...Russell Erxleben, Saints

1978...Steve Little, Cardinals (Paralyzed in a car accident early in his career. Had a 72 yard FG in college at Arkansas.)

1966...Charlie Gogolack, Commanders


Anyone see your Adam Vinatieri in that list?

 

[Dallas4ever]

The point is being overlooked because we do need a better kicker. I posted this in another thread on this. Here are the 5 guys I could find who were drafte din the 1st at Kicker.


2000...Sebastian Janikowski, Raiders

1984...Tony Zendejas, Commanders

1979...Russell Erxleben, Saints

1978...Steve Little, Cardinals (Paralyzed in a car accident early in his career. Had a 72 yard FG in college at Arkansas.)

1966...Charlie Gogolack, Commanders


Anyone see your Adam Vinatieri in that list?

Good point Hos.

 

[Dale]

I think kicker and free safety should top our free-agent wish lists. Possibly an offensive lineman, too, depending on who's out there. From there, let the chips fall as they may.

Maybe we pick up another stud linebacker, or a few offensive lineman, or a young playmaking receiver. Pick 'em as they come...just like we did this year.

 

[Jimz31]

The point is being overlooked because we do need a better kicker. I posted this in another thread on this. Here are the 5 guys I could find who were drafted in the 1st at Kicker.


2000...Sebastian Janikowski, Raiders

1984...Tony Zendejas, Commanders

1979...Russell Erxleben, Saints

1978...Steve Little, Cardinals (Paralyzed in a car accident early in his career. Had a 72 yard FG in college at Arkansas.)

1966...Charlie Gogolack, Commanders


Anyone see your Adam Vinatieri in that list?

Which is why you don't have to draft them.

V also gets some respect does he not?

 

[Hostile]

Which is why you don't have to draft them.

V also gets some respect does he not?

The point of the thread was take that kicker in round 1 or 2.

Or am I imagining things? Nope, I went back and that is the point.

I don't agree with it.

I respect Vinatieri, and if he was available I'd be in favor of getting him if he didn't want a king's ransom.

I still would not use a high Draft Pick on a Kicker.

 

[Jimz31]

The point of the thread was take that kicker in round 1 or 2.

Or am I imagining things? Nope, I went back and that is the point.

I don't agree with it.

I respect Vinatieri, and if he was available I'd be in favor of getting him if he didn't want a king's ransom.

I still would not use a high Draft Pick on a Kicker.

Dude, you specifically responded to a post that I made earlier....this is just going with that.

 

[Dale]

I think Nugent is the prime example of why not to draft a kicker so high. Not only is his percentage horrible, but he's kicked only one touchback all season. Kickoffs were supposed to be his forte, weren't they?

 

[Hostile]

I think Nugent is the prime example of why not to draft a kicker so high. Not only is his percentage horrible, but he's kicked only one touchback all season. Kickoffs were supposed to be his forte, weren't they?

Exactly, and I was higher on that kid than anyone.

 

[Hostile]

Dude, you specifically responded to a post that I made earlier....this is just going with that.

I responded to several posts, all of them about spending on a kicker. I don't spend a high draft pick. If we can find a good FA so be it.

 

[MapleLeaf]

Fair enough.

Name me the top 10 Kickers in the NFL (your opinion, not mine) and let's see what their draft position was. Let's see if they are worth the price of Day 1 Draft picks.

Mind you I was a guy saying I'd take Mike Nugent in the 3rd this year, so I partially agree.

...kickers taken with high draft picks was Janikowski and Ray Guy. Everyone else was lower although I remember an oriental guy from Stanford who was drafted higher also but he flamed out due to a weak leg I think.

But with the recent trends in the NFL I wouldn't be surprised if the hash marks in college come in line with the NFL or the league's GMs work harder to find out which young kicker's skills come closer in line with professional football's expectations.

To win three or four games a season with a kicker would make them worth a first day pick if you could isolate and define the skills needed to find the gem in the pile.

 

[Hostile]

...kickers taken with high draft picks was Janikowski and Ray Guy. Everyone else was lower although I remember an oriental guy from Stanford who was drafted higher also but he flamed out due to a weak leg I think.

But with the recent trends in the NFL I wouldn't be surprised if the hash marks in college come in line with the NFL or the league's GMs work harder to find out which young kicker's skills come closer in line with professional football's expectations.

To win three or four games a season with a kicker would make them worth a first day pick if you could isolate and define the skills needed to find the gem in the pile.

I simply don't agree. Not a day 1 pick.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Yep. Tom Brady is just another Jim Kelly without him.

Good call.

 

[MapleLeaf]

I've never met a player yet who did like them. It's simply part and parcel of the locker room culture.

If you've never played you can't imagine how galling it is to leave your blood and sweat on the field and see one of these guys in a clean uniform kick a winner and get all the pub.

Worse still is leaving all that on the field and seeing them miss one.

I went to football camps and while I was running gassers saw some of them warming up with water bottles in their hands. Hell, one guy was smoking while he warmed up.

I can't help the disgust. That's the best way I can explain it.

...but you have to spread some of it to the other specialists. The long snapper, the third string QB/holder and the upback on punt teams whose only job I ever noticed was to count the guys on his side of the field to make sure we weren't over our limit.

On the university team I was kicking for those three other guys had jerseys that were often cleaner than mine, but they never took any crap over that.

More often than not you would be lining up the kick and one half of the field was glaring angrily at you because they wanted you to miss and the other half of the field was glaring at you because they didn't trust you to make the kick.

That's the prime reason why kickers are so solitary. Your career is always based on one singular play and you are only as good as your last kick. The animosity one felt was always due to the fact that not many people can kick FGs well.

Hence my point to the linebacker on our team. I asked him to try kicking one and he pulled his groin. It wasn't as easy as he thought.

 

[Hostile]

...but you have to spread some of it to the other specialists. The long snapper, the third string QB/holder and the upback on punt teams whose only job I ever noticed was to count the guys on his side of the field to make sure we weren't over our limit.

On the university team I was kicking for those three other guys had jerseys that were often cleaner than mine, but they never took any crap over that.

More often than not you would be lining up the kick and one half of the field was glaring angrily at you because they wanted you to miss and the other half of the field was glaring at you because they didn't trust you to make the kick.

That's the prime reason why kickers are so solitary. Your career is always based on one singular play and you are only as good as your last kick. The animosity one felt was always due to the fact that not many people can kick FGs well.

Hence my point to the linebacker on our team. I asked him to try kicking one and he pulled his groin. It wasn't as easy as he thought.

I've never said kicking was easy. I can't do it. I admire the skill. I wish we had a better solution.

The Long Snappers I have known all were regular linemen so no, I never disliked them.

The only guys I remember holding were TEs. There could have been others I guess. I truly don't remember.

All of the ST guys I've ever seen were position players who got run through the guantlet in practices. Kickers got special treatment and thus special dislike.

Maybe it was different where you played. I've never met a player who liked the kickers. Like I said, just the accepted standard.

 

[BigWillie]

One kicker you might look at after this year is Mason Crosby from Colorado. He is just a junior, but he could likely come out after this year and be a high round pick.

To say this guy has a strong leg would be a complete understatement. If you've ever watched a highlight film of this guy, you would be amazed at how strong his leg truely is. While he was a sophmore, he booted a 40+ yarder against Nebraska into the wind that split the uprights halfway up. Easily good from 60+.

Alot of folks attributed his leg strength to the thin air in Colorado, alot like Jason Elam. Crosby went to Miami this year and booted a 58 yarder in the game.

Crosby is well known to play around in practice and hit 70 yarder, and I'm honestly not joking. Last year as a sophmore he nailed a 60 yarder against Iowa State.

Gary Barnett (Crosby's coach at CU) has stated that if a game were on the line, he would be confident in sending out Crosby for a 60 or even 70 yard FG.

Now I'm not one to beat Gary Barnett's drum, but for any coach to say that is unbelievable. To say you could go to midfield and have a drive stall and still get 3 points out of it -- amazing.

 

[Rack]

Feel better, J.Jones21?