You can't pay everyone

[ABQCOWBOY]

I was reading about his cartilage issue and it is possible that it will heal on its own if it doesn't fold up in itself. They deem it degenerative but it isn't actually in all cases. It's not arthritic or the like. Its just a type of tear.

I confess, I don't know enough about his specific situation to determine if it will be degenerative to the point of ineffectual or not. I guess the dilemma is that you don't know. The best you can hope for is that the team does a good job of determining the situation and acts accordingly.

 

[tyke1doe]

Well have to disagree on this and frankly its a risk I would not take if I was Dallas. You don't give up on something thats working and running the ball with Murray is bringing us wins and quite possibly the Lombardi. So what if we do get a top notch running back that we thought can do everything what Murray can do but can't? Not every back is a match for the team that they go to and frankly I would not want to find out.

Like I said before if ain't broken, don't fix it. Murray running the ball isn't broken. Other parts of our team needs work such as defense.

I think you're missing the point, which generally happens when one immediately reacts rather than understanding the context of the discussion.
I said if there's a choice between Dez and Murray and if we have to make that choice, I would choose Dez over Murray. If we can keep both of them, GREAT. But only if we have the money. If we don't have the money, and if it becomes a choice between the two, I think Dez has more value.

But because someone saw that I picked Dez over Murray and read that I think we can replace Murray easier than we can Dez, well, the butthurtedness ensued. I'm not saying you felt this way, but some others did.

Brady and Rodgers went to the superbowl with receivers. They also had good defenses to back them up. Romo never had a team with a good oline and a good defense. Maybe if they actually surround him with a real team he might actually perform up to par with a Brady or even Rogers.

Is someone forgetting the 2007 season? We didn't have a good offensive line and a good defense then? But this isn't about Romo. My point is that Brady has largely done what he did without spectacular receivers. He had Moss that one year in 2007 and set records. But Brady has been to four Super Bowls (minus the one with Moss) with simply good receivers. And Aaron Rodgers is Aaron Rodgers. This isn't a discussion about Romo. It's a discussion about who do you choose if you had to between Dez and Murray. And it's my contention that with this offensive line, you go with Dez because you can get any good running back, and he'll do fine behind this line.

Never said that we won the Superbowl. For me to say that would be crazy. Im saying that there are certain pieces that are needed to make it to the superbowl and win it. One is a good running game and a good defense. Why do you want to get rid of our running game so quick? Whats wrong with Murray carrying the load all the way to the playoffs and possibly the superbowl? Dez is a great receiver and he certainly has an impact. However, we've finally found balance on offense with a one two punch. Why are you so eager and willing to get rid of Murray so fast and risk lossing an important part of the offense?

Jerry is itching for another Superbowl. Romo is as well before he retires and time is not on their side. Right now all the pieces on offense is in place. They need to work on defense and get some players. Sign everyone if possible including MURRAY to a contract and bring us back that lombardi. Because were not going to get many more chances if we start breaking this team up so soon. [/quote]

Sigh. The topic of this thread is "You can't pay everyone." In the context of this thread, it was offered that Dez and Murray are looking to be paid. In the spirit of this thread, I said if you had to choose one, you choose Dez.
No where am I saying we need to get rid of Murray. I hope I've made myself crystal clear.

 

[tyke1doe]

I saying that your argument is flawed because you didn't include the part that Garrett didn't give him the ball. You thought of other scenarios which would fit your argument instead. But the fact is Garrett didn't give him the ball even though we could have won because Murray was gashing their entire defense. Your argument seems to want to point out that there was something wrong with Murray because of it.

With all due respect, you don't understand what a logical flaw is. Not including every scenario in a discussion that involves a question and seeks an answer is not a logical flaw. Lack of knowledge or understanding? Maybe. Logical flaw? No.
For example, "Why did daddy leave, mommy?" "Well, son, maybe daddy have a rough time being a father. Or maybe he has to work things out. Either way, you're not to blame." Because mommy doesn't know or doesn't share the true reason behind daddy leaving being he has another family and another wife suggest a logical flaw?
The nature of a question is to discover an answer. If a person doesn't have the answer, he/she asks questions. How can asking a question and possibly stating a reason to those questions be a logical flaw? A question gets to the very heart of logic because it says in order to understand a concept or a situation, you have to inquire about it.

Second, I DID include the part about Garrett not giving him the ball. Here's what I said:

And why did they have the least rushing attempts?
Could it be they didn't trust Murray until this year? Why? Because maybe he wasn't ready to handle the load?
Or could it be Jason Garrett didn't think he had the line to feed Murray the rock?
Either way, it doesn't speak very highly of Murray as the back he is now compared to last year and the previous years.

Uh, not feeding Murray the rock means not giving him the ball.

There was nothing wrong with Murray. He was having an outstanding day. Garrett didn't give him the ball because of erroneous playcalling. Yet you didn't include that as part of your scenario.

You guys need to learn how to read more comprehensively and exercise critical-thinking skills a little more.
Here's where analytical skills come into play. Why do you think Garrett didn't give Murray the ball more? You say "erroneous playcalling." But why, especially since the Cowboys had a 26-3 led on the Packers?
Garrett isn't brainless. There's a reason he called the plays he did. Could it be he didn't trust Murray to finish the game out? Could it be that he trusted Romo more? Could it be he didn't think the lead was safe? I don't know. And you don't either. But ... (and here's my point)
The fact that he DIDN'T trust Murray by putting the game into his hands says something either about Jason Garrett or Murray. And given the fact that Murray had carried it up to that point, and Jason didn't give it to him more may suggest either Garrett trusts Romo more, that he didn't think continuing to feed Murray would work or maybe he was concerned about the carries Murray was getting.
I don't have the answer. But those scenarios don't compliment Murray in any way.
Now, there could be other scenarios, but "erroneous playcalling" is a surface conclusion that doesn't call one to analyze any further.

Maybe you should ask Garrett and not me. Thats why I question is playcalling all along and I've made it known loud and clear here that I hate his playcalling. I'm glad that we now have Linehan so that Garrett doesn't call plays.

But you decided to respond, not Garrett. No one told you to respond to my question. You apparently got offended by it.

But the fact is were running the ball with Murray now. Garrett and this entire offense is comfortably with him running. The entire team is happy with him running the ball. The conclusion is that the team knows they have a good thing with Murray. If you tell them right now that they should trade Murray because he is easy to replace they would think your crazy. Murray is an important piece in why we're winning. You just don't let him go that easily.

It's a bit amusing that in a thread discussing why we can't pay everyone, people are getting bent out of shape as if someone is suggesting we should trade Murray. Take a deep breath and repeat after me, "It's only a fantasy football discussion. It's only a fantasy football discussion. It's only a fantasy football discussion."

I guess you didn't see Murray run during his rookie year. If he didn't get injured he would have been a 1K rusher. That happened with crappy oline. He's also averaging over 5 yards during his entire career. Lastly, Murray leads the league in yardage after contact. Which means that not all of his production is because of this oline. He is actually a very good running back in his own rights and worthy of taking us to the superbowl.

If, if, if.

But ... he DID get injured.
And that offensive line had him on course for 1,000 yards before his injury, unless you're suggesting he would have gotten there by his sheer talent alone.

Be that as it may, I don't understand how this discussion became an attack on Murray. Well, I know how it did because some Cowboys fans are very, very sensitive to criticism of Cowboys players. But, again, I remind you to read and interpret comments in their context. It'll be good for your blood pressure.

 

[tyke1doe]

What the hell kind of point are you trying to make with Jackson and Asomugha? Again, you're COMPLETELY forgetting what we are discussing. You were saying that McCoy was signed to a big contract because they had no other talent around them. I proved you wrong and you are now creating some other argument. Are you mental? If you are, I apologize.

First, you raised Jackson as a rebuttal to being able to pay McCoy.
Second, my point is that the Eagles tried to sign all of those players but had to let them go one or two years after their contract. Again, remember context, son. You're the one who is saying we can sign all of them. I'm saying they couldn't keep all of them. And, remember, the title of this thread is "You Can't Pay Everyone."

Eddie Lacy is on a PASSING team. Their running game plays off the pass, not the other way around. When Rodgers went down last year, he had two big games and one of them came against our piss poor defense (Who the hell didn't have a good game against us?). How is Lacy doing this year? With Rodgers and his receivers tearing it up, Lacy is averaging 4.0 YPC and had one game with a little over 100 yards. As for Morris, he benefited from the gimmicky read option his rookie season and has been on a decline since. His 3.8 YPC this year is fantastic. This isn't "opinion", this is fact, "son". It's called doing research before spouting off at the mouth and forming a solid argument. A Cowboys'; fan who didn't know Murray rushed for over 1,000 yards last year obviously doesn't pay attention.

Eddie Lacy is on a passing team and yet he amasses 1,000 yards. Hhhmm.
DeMarco Murray was on a passing team in previous years and had one 1,000 yard rushing year.
And you're telling me that you couldn't plug Lacy or any other top back behind this line, and they couldn't do the same thing?
Your stats are solidifying my point. Thank you very much.

Second, with regards to Lacy, Lacy has been out a few games because of a concussion. Not playing in a game will impact your YPC. Even so, 4.0 YPC is pretty good.

Third, so Morris benefited from a gimmicky read option rookie season, you say? You do know that Carolina runs the same read option with Cam Newton, and do you know what DeAngelo William's numbers were in the same time frame as Morris'? Williams rush totals were 737 (2012) and 843 (2013).
Son, holes in the defense are holes in the defense. It doesn't matter if it comes from misdirection, your offensive line opening the holes in the line or if your running back takes it from the read option.
Yes, it's called doing your research and not simplying pulling stats without any context.

Is there anything else or do I have to continue making you look like an idiot? I'll do this all day, and you can end each and every sentence with "son" and a laughing emoticon in a futile attempt to get a rise out me. You have that as your tactic while I'm slapping you in the face with facts while you dodge and create new topics to argue about.

Actually, it DID get a rise out of you because you noted it, son.

I'm sorry you got butthurt because I suggested Dez is more valuable to the team than Murray. I wasn't even talking to you initially. But, hey, I can keep this up all day too. You keep supply stats, and I'll keep putting them in context.

At this point, I'm hoping you are mental. At least that would be an excuse.

I love it when people don't even understand their own insults. If I were mental, why would you even engage me? Unless you think you I'm not mental and believe my threads are worthy of a challenge.

Me, I love schooling children. So consider this class in session.

 

[mattjames2010]

First, you raised Jackson as a rebuttal to being able to pay McCoy.
Second, my point is that the Eagles tried to sign all of those players but had to let them go one or two years after their contract. Again, remember context, son. You're the one who is saying we can sign all of them. I'm saying they couldn't keep all of them. And, remember, the title of this thread is "You Can't Pay Everyone."



Eddie Lacy is on a passing team and yet he amasses 1,000 yards. Hhhmm.
DeMarco Murray was on a passing team in previous years and had one 1,000 yard rushing year.
And you're telling me that you couldn't plug Lacy or any other top back behind this line, and they couldn't do the same thing?
Your stats are solidifying my point. Thank you very much.

Second, with regards to Lacy, Lacy has been out a few games because of a concussion. Not playing in a game will impact your YPC. Even so, 4.0 YPC is pretty good.

Third, so Morris benefited from a gimmicky read option rookie season, you say? You do know that Carolina runs the same read option with Cam Newton, and do you know what DeAngelo William's numbers were in the same time frame as Morris'? Williams rush totals were 737 (2012) and 843 (2013).
Son, holes in the defense are holes in the defense. It doesn't matter if it comes from misdirection, your offensive line opening the holes in the line or if your running back takes it from the read option.
Yes, it's called doing your research and not simplying pulling stats without any context.



Actually, it DID get a rise out of you because you noted it, son.

I'm sorry you got butthurt because I suggested Dez is more valuable to the team than Murray. I wasn't even talking to you initially. But, hey, I can keep this up all day too. You keep supply stats, and I'll keep putting them in context.



I love it when people don't even understand their own insults. If I were mental, why would you even engage me? Unless you think you I'm not mental and believe my threads are worthy of a challenge.

Me, I love schooling children. So consider this class in session.

They didn't get rid of Jackson because of his contract, "son". Do your research! They didn't get rid of Asomugha because of cap, they got rid of him due to poor play,.

What the **** are you talking about with Lacy? "Out a few games" and it will "impact your YPC"? WHAT? YPC doesn't drop because you are out a game, genius AND Lacy hasn't been out any games. Packers have played 7 games, he has been in all 7 games.The dude is playing terrible football, but you obviously don't watch him if you thought he has been out, so you shouldn't be discussing him.

Carolina uses TWO RBs, the Commanders did not. Carolina's offense is far more similar to what Buffalo runs than the Commanders. Alfred Morris had over 300 carries in 2012, DeAngelo Williams had 170 in 2012 and 201 in 2013.

Anything else? At this point, I think you're trolling.

 

[tyke1doe]

They didn't get rid of Jackson because of his contract, "son". Do your research! They didn't get rid of Asomugha because of cap, they got rid of him due to poor play,.

How convenient that they get rid of a player after he signs a huge contract. Teams generally say they get rid of players because of "poor play," but it's interesting that "poor play" generally coincides money demands. And Jackson started yapping about money shortly after signing his contract.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on...-investigate-eagles-release-of-desean-jackson][/url]
The Eagles still haven't commented about Jackson's release, so it's not completely clear yet why the team dumped him. In the hours before he was released on March 28, NJ.com reported that the Eagles were 'concerned with his "continued association with reputed Los Angeles street gang members who have been connected to two homicides since 2010.
Of course, there's also a few other reasons Jackson could have been cut. Chip Kelly may not have liked Jackson's locker room demeanor -- he was reportedly selfish -- and it's highly probable that money played a factor. Jackson had three years left on a five-year deal that was going to pay him over $10 million in 2014.

Did someone say "Do your research"?

What the **** are you talking about with Lacy? "Out a few games" and it will "impact your YPC"? WHAT? YPC doesn't drop because you are out a game, genius AND Lacy hasn't been out any games. Packers have played 7 games, he has been in all 7 games.The dude is playing terrible football, but you obviously don't watch him if you thought he has been out, so you shouldn't be discussing him.

Actually, it does. If you miss games, that means you're not getting carries. That will alter your YPC. So, for example, if you have 20 carries in five games as opposed to 37 carries in six games, depending on the yards amassed, that will affect your YPC.
Second, I stand corrected on Lacy. He received a concussion in game 1, and I assumed that the proper protocol was that a player had to miss the second game. However, because the Packers played on a Thursday night, Lacy recovered in time to play game 2.

Carolina uses TWO RBs, the Commanders did not. Carolina's offense is far more similar to what Buffalo runs than the Commanders. Alfred Morris had over 300 carries in 2012, DeAngelo Williams had 170 in 2012 and 201 in 2013.

Really?

Cam ran 111 times for 585 yards; RGIII (before he got hurt) ran 86 times for 489 yards; E.J. Manuel ran 53 times for 186. The numbers say that Carolina's offense is more similar to Washington's than Buffalo's.

Be that as it may, Alfred Morris toted the rock more than 300 times and amassed more than 1,600 yards. Not only did he prove his durability, he showed he could handle the load. It doesn't matter what offense you run in, holes are holes. If he can run in that offense, he can run behind the Cowboys offensive line.

Anything else? At this point, I think you're trolling.

I'm trolling? You got butthurt over my statement. I'm just responding to your super sensitivity. I'm sorry you're upset that some thing other running backs can run behind the Cowboys' line. Then again, you'll have time to mature and grow out of your binary, narrow-minded way of thinking. There's still hope for you.

 

[DeaconBlues]

I love the assumption(s) that (a) AP won't be in jail next year for child abuse, and, if not, (b) that Minnesota will just release him.

 

[mattjames2010]

How convenient that they get rid of a player after he signs a huge contract. Teams generally say they get rid of players because of "poor play," but it's interesting that "poor play" generally coincides money demands. And Jackson started yapping about money shortly after signing his contract.



Did someone say "Do your research"?



Actually, it does. If you miss games, that means you're not getting carries. That will alter your YPC. So, for example, if you have 20 carries in five games as opposed to 37 carries in six games, depending on the yards amassed, that will affect your YPC.
Second, I stand corrected on Lacy. He received a concussion in game 1, and I assumed that the proper protocol was that a player had to miss the second game. However, because the Packers played on a Thursday night, Lacy recovered in time to play game 2.



Really?

Cam ran 111 times for 585 yards; RGIII (before he got hurt) ran 86 times for 489 yards; E.J. Manuel ran 53 times for 186. The numbers say that Carolina's offense is more similar to Washington's than Buffalo's.

Be that as it may, Alfred Morris toted the rock more than 300 times and amassed more than 1,600 yards. Not only did he prove his durability, he showed he could handle the load. It doesn't matter what offense you run in, holes are holes. If he can run in that offense, he can run behind the Cowboys offensive line.



I'm trolling? You got butthurt over my statement. I'm just responding to your super sensitivity. I'm sorry you're upset that some thing other running backs can run behind the Cowboys' line. Then again, you'll have time to mature and grow out of your binary, narrow-minded way of thinking. There's still hope for you.

So you quote the ONE part of the article you think can prove your argument? Read the ENTIRE article, genius. They viewed him as a locker room cancer, they was the MAIN issue for them, not the money. He had over 1,300 yards last year with 9 TD's. If it was about the money, they would have just come out and said it was, there is no reason to hide that. He was released unexpectedly because of off the field issues, not because of his contract.

Your point about YPC is idiotic. He's averaging 4.0 YPC, that is never good for a starting RB (Especially an RB who is supposedly tough to bring down). It doesn't matter if it's 40 carries or 300 carries, 4 YPC is a good sign that the RB isn't productive.

EJ Manuel rushed 53 times in 10 games last year because he was injured. Secondly, the amount of times a QB rushes doesn't prove the scheme, *******. Carolina uses two RBs heavily, Williams/Stewart/Whoever their third string is at the time, plus Newton. The Commanders relied on a single RB to carry the load in 2012. The schemes were not the same, actually watch their games.

And it was a gimmicky offense that Alfred Morris played in. Defenses didn't have a grasp on the read option yet, and he benefited heavily from it, obviously. How is Morris doing in a standard offense now? Again, a fantastic 3.8 YPC. I'd much rather go by what he has done NOW than what he did two years ago.

And yes, you're trolling. Then again, I'm still trying to find an excuse for your blatant idiocy.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Everybody needs to come down here. It's a discussion. Lets tone it down a bit. We are all Cowboy fans here. Please, lets be civil.

 

[Doomsday101]

Everybody needs to come down here. It's a discussion. Lets tone it down a bit. We are all Cowboy fans here. Please, lets be civil.

Need to be Sybil she had what 13 personalities? lol

 

[tyke1doe]

So you quote the ONE part of the article you think can prove your argument? Read the ENTIRE article, genius. They viewed him as a locker room cancer, they was the MAIN issue for them, not the money. He had over 1,300 yards last year with 9 TD's. If it was about the money, they would have just come out and said it was, there is no reason to hide that. He was released unexpectedly because of off the field issues, not because of his contract.

I read the entire article, son. A part of being a locker-room cancer was the fact that he was complaining about more money. They knew this BEFORE he signed his first contract.
Second, as to your point that if it were about the money, they would have come out and said it. Bahahahahahahaha! Teams don't generally say that. They find some other excuse to get rid of a player. If you think money didn't play a part in a game that has become big business, you really don't know how the economy works, son.

Your point about YPC is idiotic. He's averaging 4.0 YPC, that is never good for a starting RB (Especially an RB who is supposedly tough to bring down). It doesn't matter if it's 40 carries or 300 carries, 4 YPC is a good sign that the RB isn't productive.

Rather, your understanding about what factors into YPC is idiotic. To argue that the amount of games you play and the number of carries you get don't factor into YPC is idiotic.

Furthermore, 4.0 YPC is good for a starting running back. The highest average YPC career-wise is 7.2 by Michael Vick. Guess what Barry Sanders' average YPC over his career was? 4.3. Guess what Emmitt Smith's average YPC career-wise was? 4.2. And Lacy has 4.0? And you say that's never good for a starting running back?

Yeah, okay. Tell me about research again.

EJ Manuel rushed 53 times in 10 games last year because he was injured. Secondly, the amount of times a QB rushes doesn't prove the scheme, *******. Carolina uses two RBs heavily, Williams/Stewart/Whoever their third string is at the time, plus Newton. The Commanders relied on a single RB to carry the load in 2012. The schemes were not the same, actually watch their games.

Uh, but Carolina ran the read option. And the Commanders ran the read option. That was the point. The fact that Carolina employed more running backs and spread the wealth around doesn't negate the fact that both teams ran that offense. And in that offense, Morris was able to exploit it enough to gain more yards than the three Carolina backs combined.

In 2012-13, Williams, Stewart and Tolbert combined for 393 rushes for 1,256 yards. Morris rushed 335 for 1,613 yards. And this isn't even including Cam's and RGIII's yardage.
In 2013-14, the same trio rushed 350 times for 1,384 for a 3.9 YPC compared to Morris' 276 rushes for 1,275 yards and a 4.6 YPC.

Be that as it may, that simply means that in the read option offense Carolina ran, Cam spread it out more among the backs, whereas in the Skins read option, Morris was the primary runner. And somehow by this you're trying to prove that he couldn't carry the rock behind Dallas' line?

And it was a gimmicky offense that Alfred Morris played in. Defenses didn't have a grasp on the read option yet, and he benefited heavily from it, obviously. How is Morris doing in a standard offense now? Again, a fantastic 3.8 YPC. I'd much rather go by what he has done NOW than what he did two years ago.

So are you saying that the Commanders' offensive line is better than the Cowboys' offensive line? See, this is why I say you have no analytical, critical-thinking skills. You just trot out stats with no context. But you don't understand the full picture. You'd prefer to go by NOW because the Cowboys have a better line. You don't want to go on last year when Morris had more yards than Murray did. But we're talking about track record. And Morris does have a track record of being able to tote the rock.
But, again, getting back to my original question. Are you saying that the Commanders offensive line is as good as the Cowboys' offensive line? Because if you are, I'd like for you to go on record as saying so.

And yes, you're trolling. Then again, I'm still trying to find an excuse for your blatant idiocy.

Or trying to mask your butthurtedness because I keep slapping your arguments down.

 

[Echo9]

Based on what?

Edit: nevermind, you said you're guessing. That's good, because it's simply a guess. Nobody knows what the negotiations will bring.

Actually casmith, I think he's basing it roughly on the franchise tag level right now. True that no one knows what negotiations will bring. It's also true that the rates for RBs have dropped a little the last few years. But it's a pretty reasonable educated guess to think that Murray is going to want 8-10 mil and that's sorta the going rate for a top RB based on the top 5 salaries right now. Will another team pay him that? No one knows. There's an injury history, there's also a pretty strong case to be made that Murray's success is at least partially dependent on our stellar O line. If we all know this, then GMs across the league know this. This could play into negotiations and Murray won't get his expected 8-10 per year, but then again, on the open market, its not out of the question.

There was a rumor that we offered him a 4 year 16 mil contract a few weeks back, but I have no idea if that was ever confirmed. If it was and that's the opening bid by Dallas, then his agent will probably come back with a 'highest paid in the league' number like 11 per year. If Murray keeps up the pace. he'll be over 2,00 yards which makes that salary demand reasonable. Personally I'm hoping Dallas re-signs him for something in the middle of that. 6.5 to 7 would be good for both sides.

 

[mattjames2010]

I read the entire article, son. A part of being a locker-room cancer was the fact that he was complaining about more money. They knew this BEFORE he signed his first contract.
Second, as to your point that if it were about the money, they would have come out and said it. Bahahahahahahaha! Teams don't generally say that. They find some other excuse to get rid of a player. If you think money didn't play a part in a game that has become big business, you really don't know how the economy works, son.



Rather, your understanding about what factors into YPC is idiotic. To argue that the amount of games you play and the number of carries you get don't factor into YPC is idiotic.

Furthermore, 4.0 YPC is good for a starting running back. The highest average YPC career-wise is 7.2 by Michael Vick. Guess what Barry Sanders' average YPC over his career was? 4.3. Guess what Emmitt Smith's average YPC career-wise was? 4.2. And Lacy has 4.0? And you say that's never good for a starting running back?

Yeah, okay. Tell me about research again.



Uh, but Carolina ran the read option. And the Commanders ran the read option. That was the point. The fact that Carolina employed more running backs and spread the wealth around doesn't negate the fact that both teams ran that offense. And in that offense, Morris was able to exploit it enough to gain more yards than the three Carolina backs combined.

In 2012-13, Williams, Stewart and Tolbert combined for 393 rushes for 1,256 yards. Morris rushed 335 for 1,613 yards. And this isn't even including Cam's and RGIII's yardage.
In 2013-14, the same trio rushed 350 times for 1,384 for a 3.9 YPC compared to Morris' 276 rushes for 1,275 yards and a 4.6 YPC.

Be that as it may, that simply means that in the read option offense Carolina ran, Cam spread it out more among the backs, whereas in the Skins read option, Morris was the primary runner. And somehow by this you're trying to prove that he couldn't carry the rock behind Dallas' line?



So are you saying that the Commanders' offensive line is better than the Cowboys' offensive line? See, this is why I say you have no analytical, critical-thinking skills. You just trot out stats with no context. But you don't understand the full picture. You'd prefer to go by NOW because the Cowboys have a better line. You don't want to go on last year when Morris had more yards than Murray did. But we're talking about track record. And Morris does have a track record of being able to tote the rock.
But, again, getting back to my original question. Are you saying that the Commanders offensive line is as good as the Cowboys' offensive line? Because if you are, I'd like for you to go on record as saying so.



Or trying to mask your butthurtedness because I keep slapping your arguments down.

Uh, no. Barry Sanders averaged 5.0 YPC over his career (Seriously, stop spreading misinformation). Smith played for a LONG time in the league, and his YPC dropped due to mediocre play later in his career and slowing down from 97 and on despite the rushing yardage totals. Lacy is playing like trash this year when defenses are fearing the pass, get over it. You haven't brought up a single point that Lacy could be productive behind this line.


Carolina uses two RB sets, that's not what Washington did. And AGAIN, Morris had ONE great season when the read option caught offenses off guard and DC's had trouble scheming against. He has been on a decline since. Not to mention, he's not as good a blocker as Murray AND he doesn't catch balls out of the backfield which needs to be factored into this.

And I'm not saying the Commanders offensive line is better than Dallas, I'm saying the Dallas offensive line is good (It's not even ranked first in the NFL for **** sake!) but it isn't the greatest offensive line in history like some are making it out to be. Murray is doing a great deal of the work, and as someone kindly mentioned, Murray is leading the league in yards after contact. Which means the offensive line is not doing all the work.

Got anything else? If not, NEXT IDIOT UP!

 

[Matts4313]

Uh, no. Barry Sanders averaged 5.0 YPC over his career (Seriously, stop spreading misinformation). Smith played for a LONG time in the league, and his YPC dropped due to mediocre play later in his career and slowing down from 97 and on despite the rushing yardage totals. Lacy is playing like trash this year when defenses are fearing the pass, get over it. You haven't brought up a single point that Lacy could be productive behind this line.


Carolina uses two RB sets, that's not what Washington did. And AGAIN, Morris had ONE great season when the read option caught offenses off guard and DC's had trouble scheming against. He has been on a decline since. Not to mention, he's not as good a blocker as Murray AND he doesn't catch balls out of the backfield which needs to be factored into this.

And I'm not saying the Commanders offensive line is better than Dallas, I'm saying the Dallas offensive line is good (It's not even ranked first in the NFL for **** sake!) but it isn't the greatest offensive line in history like some are making it out to be. Murray is doing a great deal of the work, and as someone kindly mentioned, Murray is leading the league in yards after contact. Which means the offensive line is not doing all the work.

Got anything else? If not, NEXT IDIOT UP!

bro, that's not right at all. its easy to have The most yards after contact when that first contact is a safety instead of DT.


you know what Murray also has? The most yards **before** contact. The OL is absolutely giving him lanes.

 

[dfan32]

I agree, 2 players in their prime who are producing at a high level.

The big difference between these two, Bryant could possibly do what he does here on a different team. Murray would be far less likely to enjoy the same success on another team. Having said that, Murray seems like a smart guy. He probably knows there are only one or two other teams that could provide him the opportunity to have the same type of success.

 

[tyke1doe]

Uh, no. Barry Sanders averaged 5.0 YPC over his career (Seriously, stop spreading misinformation). Smith played for a LONG time in the league, and his YPC dropped due to mediocre play later in his career and slowing down from 97 and on despite the rushing yardage totals. Lacy is playing like trash this year when defenses are fearing the pass, get over it. You haven't brought up a single point that Lacy could be productive behind this line.

My bad on Barry Sanders. Even so, many great backs had YPC in the 4's including ... LaDamian Thomlinson 4.3, Earl Campbell, 4.3, Tony Dorsett 4.3. So I guess a 4.0 YPC is pretty good if Hall of Fame backs have that average for a career.

Second, you're the one who mentioned that Lacy has a 4.0 YPC average. He's playing like trash - as you say - yet he is averaging 4.0 YPC. And the Packers line is not anywhere near good as the Cowboys.
Furthermore, Lacy only touches the ball an average rush of 13 a game. He's not carrying the ball as much, particularly since Aaron Rodgers is throwing about 30 times a game. But, of course, you're not accustomed to such critical analysis. You simply throw out stats without much comprehension of how they fit it the overall picture, like claiming 4.0 isn't very good for a starting running back.

Carolina uses two RB sets, that's not what Washington did. And AGAIN, Morris had ONE great season when the read option caught offenses off guard and DC's had trouble scheming against. He has been on a decline since. Not to mention, he's not as good a blocker as Murray AND he doesn't catch balls out of the backfield which needs to be factored into this.

Morris had TWO good season. Going over 1,000 yards is considered a very good season. It's the gold standard for a running back. And Morris has more 1,000 yard seasons (2) than Murray (1).
As for him being in decline, the Commanders are in decline. Their offensive line isn't getting the job done. The Commanders have always been a run-dominated team marked by great offensive lines. You think that might have something to do with the rushing woes? Nah, it's just on the back. How stupid.

And I'm not saying the Commanders offensive line is better than Dallas, I'm saying the Dallas offensive line is good (It's not even ranked first in the NFL for **** sake!) but it isn't the greatest offensive line in history like some are making it out to be.

So now you're introducing the fact that the Cowboys line is not the greatest offensive line in history. We know that, silly. But it is one of the best, if not the best in the NFL this year. Which, interestingly enough coincides with a great season by Murray.

Second, I like how you dodge my question by shifting the issue. But I'm going to put you back on track.
If the Commanders' offensive line is not better than the Cowboys' offensive line, wouldn't that mean that Morris' numbers aren't going to be as good as if he were running behind Dallas' line?
I mean, that would make sense to anyone who understands the connection between a good-great offensive line and a good-great running game. Then again, not everyone operates from common sense.

Murray is doing a great deal of the work, and as someone kindly mentioned, Murray is leading the league in yards after contact. Which means the offensive line is not doing all the work.

Of course, the line isn't doing all the work, silly. Murray has to move his legs. The offensive line isn't moving it for him. But Murray wasn't on a record-setting pace last year, or the year before that or the year before that. His record-setting pace happens to come when we solidify the offensive line.

How convenient.

Yes, Murray is a very good back. But he's benefiting from an improved offensive line. Somewhere, even Stevie Wonder is nodding in approval.

Got anything else? If not, NEXT IDIOT UP!

I just gave it to you, son. Your serve. [/quote]

 

[tyke1doe]

SMH...
I was referring to salaries... since you're all up in Adrian's jock for some reason, let's play your game... Dallas cuts Murray and intends to sign the great almighty Peterson (who will likely be 30 yrs. old
the next time he steps on an NFL field).... now, try to stay with me here, just how much money do you think the great almighty Peterson is going to want?... QB money, that's how much... what type of contract do you want to give in terms of years???...2...3..4...?..stretch it out to 6 years and pay the devil later?

I was never comparing talent... Peterson is a freak of nature... how many RBs in the league are better than Murray? who do you want? Dude has to be 220lbs. and able to take a pounding so there goes McCoy and Charles and all those little backs people have mentioned... there's Morris.. think Washington will give him away!?! Bell!?!...nope.....draft Gurley or Gordon? Why start all over? and who can guarantee they translate to NFL quality?

Too often, people tend to hide behind a keyboard spewing insults toward other people... whatever your reasoning is, its not necessary... try to be a nice person... we are strangers to each other, no need to be mean.

First, I couldn't care less about Adrian Peterson. However, almost everyone agrees he has been the top running back of this decade. Stating that isn't up someone's jock.

Second, you were not referring to salaries. This is what you said:

For everyone screaming to let Murray walk: It would be like a team letting AP walk. Only worse, because he has no legal baggage.

You made no mention of salary. In fact you compared Murray to AP, which is what I responded to. Yet, above, you're trying to make it a situation of Dallas cutting Murray for AP. That doesn't make sense based on the initial comment I was responding to.

Third, I don't think I insulted you. I merely said, "Please stop." However, if I did insult you, I apologize. I only reserve insults for people who try to dish it out first, which reflects my current discussion with Jessie james or whatever his name is.

 

[RoboQB]

First, I couldn't care less about Adrian Peterson. However, almost everyone agrees he has been the top running back of this decade. Stating that isn't up someone's jock.

Second, you were not referring to salaries. This is what you said:



You made no mention of salary. In fact you compared Murray to AP, which is what I responded to. Yet, above, you're trying to make it a situation of Dallas cutting Murray for AP. That doesn't make sense based on the initial comment I was responding to.

Third, I don't think I insulted you. I merely said, "Please stop." However, if I did insult you, I apologize. I only reserve insults for people who try to dish it out first, which reflects my current discussion with Jessie james or whatever his name is.

I guess I was a little bit vague... Replacing Murray with Peterson will cost more than just paying Murray... better?.. I was responding to various posts without cutting and pasting them... I guess this is
where a message board fails because there is no voice... only words.... the baggage comment was meant as a double whammy of sorts..... the point I was trying to make was that we cannot replace Murray with AP, in my opinion, due to the cost... might as well pay the guy we already have... Peterson is nearly 4 years older... you don't give 30 year old RBs big money... even the best one in the league.

By the way, thank you... I accept your apology and appreciate the explanation.

 

[tyke1doe]

I guess I was a little bit vague... Replacing Murray with Peterson will cost more than just paying Murray... better?.. I was responding to various posts without cutting and pasting them... I guess this is
where a message board fails because there is no voice... only words.... the baggage comment was meant as a double whammy of sorts..... the point I was trying to make was that we cannot replace Murray with AP, in my opinion, due to the cost... might as well pay the guy we already have... Peterson is nearly 4 years older... you don't give 30 year old RBs big money... even the best one in the league.

Thanks for the clarification. And I agree. I don't want AP at this point for the reasons you've stated.

By the way, thank you... I accept your apology and appreciate the explanation.

You welcome. I admit, I like to give out when I get it. But I do need to watch how I come across. Thank you for setting me straight.

 

[tyke1doe]

At any rate, I'm finished this discussion. I think I've made my points, and that adequately.
On to the weekend and, hopefully, another Cowboys victory.